Need some input - 4 yr old daughter

Post Reply New Topic

Okay. Well, I guess I'll just watch and wait.

By the way, what was your hyperfocus and special interst? Did it ever change, or is it the same?

My special interest was trains up until around the age of 6, and then it changed to cars. Both lasted for several years, but since then I've had many more interests, and with slightly less intensity.

Hyperfocus is an ability that I've always had. If I'm doing something I enjoy, I can sit down and ignore everything else for several hours. In fact, it's hard not to do that.

I don't know, but it doesn't sound like enough to be an ASD.



Hmmm...I don't know that one. I have classic autism and have no idea what my visual perception scores would be. I cannot guess either, since my perception is normal to me.



There is no benefit if there is nothing wrong with your child. If the psychs have to work that hard to try and find a link to her and ASD, then she likely does not have it and it would do her no service to be stuck with the label. The label is useful for those with limitations in functioning in their everyday life. If she doesn't even need OT anymore, I would just let it go, and let her live a normal, happy childhood.

Last edited by littlelily613 on 19 Aug 2011, 6:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Hi

I apologise if I am saying something that has already been mentioned, but I have not read through all the replies. Have you looked at the information regarding highly gifted children showing some traits of aspergers because they are gifted? I know I had a chart at one time listing the similarities and differences between the 2 but I can't remember what I did with it, I will keep looking if you think it may be useful

One of the main things that sticks in my mind is regard for other children and world events, a gifted child even as young as 4 or 5 can get very upset if they see news programs with people suffering, if they saw a child fall over they would try to help.

Gifted children also have very advanced social skills in some cases and can be the most popular kid in the class, this would never be the case for a child with asd

Hi Blueskygirl

I haven't read all of the responses, so apologies if similar has already been discussed. My daughter is about 10 months older than yours. I've always felt she was very different from average and considered her to be spirited, extroverted, confident, strong-willed and, without a doubt, highly intelligent. In many ways (talking, crawling, feeding herself, etc) she was way ahead of her peers. We've always had issues with behaviour management, but she's a wonderful child. Like your daughter, she loves animals too. She has spoken of becoming a vet (and I think it's still a possibility), but at the moment she says she wants to be a TV presenter, presenting a science show.

It was only at the tail end of last year, around her 5th birthday, that I started to suspect something more. She'd started school a few months earlier (they go early here in Scotland) and I noticed a few things which took me by surprise. As I said, she's confident and outgoing and I never noticed any social problems before. In fact, she a very caring child and appears to make friends easily. But, when we were walking home with other kids and their parents, the other kids would be talking, but I was needing to prompt her to say something related to the topic. I found I was speaking for her a lot of the time. She's anything but shy, so this was strange. Also, her nursery teachers had mentioned a problem with paying attention, but this had continued through to school as well. Apparently she takes ages to get on with a task, even though she's quite capable and later demonstrates that she can do it, no problem. She's always been like this at home, so this wasn't a surprise, but I had hoped that their authority would have had an effect, but it hasn't.

I spoke to the depute head about the possibility of Aspergers and she immediately dismissed the notion. But, a few months later, my concerns got bigger, I made a list and I spoke to her again. She'd completely changed her mind (must have been more observant or had read a bit about it). She spoke with an ed psych and organised a speech & language appointment. We've had the appointment and she's now on a waiting list for ASD assessment - the therapist's gut feeling is that she has Aspergers.

Anyway, on the plus side, she's doing really well at school. She's just started her second year and, academically, she's right up there with the bright sparks (and way ahead in science). The teachers like her and she's a right wee character. She has concentration difficulties, but is managing to keep up despite this. The social side is a bit of a concern. She only speaks of one friend (a boy) and he sometimes plays with other kids, but she doesn't play with them. It's him or nobody. LIke many AS girls, she's a tomboy, and she has nothing in common with most other girls.

My advice would be to keep notes of any behaviour that concerns you. It's easier to see it once it's written out.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Thanks everyone!

I will keep you posted. I have a meeting with the neuropsychologist next Wednesday to go over the results.

I have read a lot about giftedness, and thought maybe that's what is was, in combination with some sensory issues. I guess I'll see what the eval says and just watch her as she grows.

She just got to the point where she likes going to see G rated movies. The slightest bit of conflict was always upsetting to her previously. We saw Winnie the Pooh and Cars. She enjoyed them both. She's not into the one's that have more scary stuff in it like the princess movies do.

Thanks for all the insight and tips!

Also, Mummy of Peanut - Our girls sound so similar!

Data we haven't yet received:

When she has her "bouts of poor eye contact", is it predominently in new situations/locations/with new people? Does it manifest with a certain emotion or in situations that are more emotional, or when describing situations that are emotional/stressful? Does it manifest when describing complex ideas (other than her favourite topics: ie dogs). Does it manifest more often following a "negative event" like the event you describe where she's pretending dolls and doesnt know what to say next. Does it manifest less after a pleasant experience - a shared laugh for example.

The reason that you want to get a DX of some sort now is so that you don't have to jump through the hoops when problems arise in later years. The "trend" for us is that we often do okay during the early years when social play is pretty simple but as the other kids mature and social skills become more sophisticated THEN the troubles really begin and the child may require IEP or other special services. Might just as well have this done now and begin your learning ramp now so that you can make intelligent and educated choices later for your kiddo.

With respect to the variance in symptoms.... I am surprised that the Doctors cannot tell you about this. It is commonly reported (and my own experience) that my Autistic symptoms vary from day to day even. Some factors to consider are General Health (lack of sleep, improper nutrition or lack of exercise) and then the enviornment (too many people or too much chaos will stress me out signficantly). Also if there is change in the Doctor's office from the last time, it could cause some anxiety. We are a sensitive people so a great number of things can "set symptoms off" or make anxiety/excitement.

Hope this helps some...

BTW: I personally don't think there is a "problem" per say with anything you have written and see nothing to "correct" at this time.

When she has her "bouts of poor eye contact", is it predominently in new situations/locations/with new people? Yes

"Does it manifest with a certain emotion or in situations that are more emotional, or when describing situations that are emotional/stressful?" No

"Does it manifest when describing complex ideas (other than her favourite topics: ie dogs)" Yes! She is a pretty out of the box thinker as well..she'll come up with stuff and I'll think to myself..."that's amazing." When she gets really excited about what she's saying, she won't have great eye contact a lot of times...or she'll have fleeting eye contact...and then when she's done talking, she'll make eye contact again. Yeah, actually...I guess it does manifest during these times...and also when a new person asks her a question...she'll kind of look away and shrug her shoulders like she's being shy...but then after about 20 minutes, she'll be comfortable with them and want to talk.

[b]" Does it manifest more often following a "negative event" like the event you describe where she's pretending dolls and doesnt know what to say next." ]Yes, or when someone asks her a question maybe that she doesn't know how to answer...or if it's a real general question, she won't say nearly as much if they ask about something specific. For instance, when we came home from Florida, my aunt picked us up from the airport, and asked my daughter, "How was Florida, Charlotte?" And C didn't answer at first and then just said, "good". But if she had asked her "What did you do at the beach?" I'm certain she would have told her all about looking for crabs, swimming in the ocean and the pool. But this is where it kind of gets variable...because if someone asked her that today, she may go on and on about it.

"Does it manifest less after a pleasant experience - a shared laugh for example." Yes. Once she warms up to someone, she makes great eye contact. But even with someone she knows and loves a lot...if she's thinking while she's talking, she doesn't make good eye contact. But I even do that. I just figured it was because she's thinking about what she's saying.

Last edited by Blueskygirl on 19 Aug 2011, 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sensory integration problems can exist on their own outside an ASD diagnosis. Also, the smart girls with Asperger's are much harder to catch and dx at young ages. It wasn't until my daughter was about 7 that it was becoming clearer that she had more going on and that, only because she also has a learning disability that caught up to her grade level. Most of her teachers were shocked to find out that she was on the specturm. They would never have guessed. Once my daughter gets to know someone she has pretty good eye contact - it's only when nervous or anxious that she has the 'stereotypical' social deficits in eye contact and conversation reciprocity. She rocks and flaps her hands but not dramatically so and usually only when concentrating/excited.

Stay vigilant but try not to worry. Sounds like she's doing fine and her educational team is on top of her difficulties. Never be afraid to readdress problems when you feel they are persistant.

Hi, we'll get our daughter's results from her neuropsychological evaluation tomorow, but we did receive the results from her OT eval today! She has graduated from OT!

Results:

Peabody test:

Grasping - 75th percentile (up from 25th)
Visual Motor Integration 84th percentile (up from 50th)

Beery Test of Visual Motor IntegrationVisual Motor - 77th percentile
Visual Perception - 99th percentile
Motor Coordination - 55th percentile

In the summary, it says....

"Overall, Charlotte has improved significantly across the board. Her fine motor skills, visual motor and visual perceptual skills are well within normal limits. However, she continues to have mild challenges with sitting still and focus. Some of these issues may be related to sensory performance issues. Further, her psychosocial development is doing well as she interacts with other children well. However, she may have some challenges reading body language and some of the other smaller nuances that are associated with age appropriate communication. Social groups and group and individual sporting activities are crucial at this point to ensure that her psychosocial development improves and grows with her level of intellectual skill development."

Sounds like she's got the skills she needs, and now all she has to do is practice. Thankfully, for a kid her age, practice equals play, so it shouldn't be unpleasant for anybody concerned.

met with the Neuropsychologist yesterday. She was diagnosed with PDD-NOS. Here's what some of the report said...

"She displays a qualitative impairment in social interaction as manifested by a marked impairment in the use of multiple nonverbal behaviors including eye contact. Social reciprocity is evident during play, but decreased in conversation. She also exhibits stereotyped and repetitive hand flapping and toe walking. Nevertheless, she spontaneously seeks to share enjoyment, cultivates appropriate peer relationships, does not exhibit encompassing preoccupations, and does not adhere to specific routines. She di not have a delay in the development of spoken language, and on the contrary, displays advanced language skills. She displays features of Aspergers Disorder, but presents subthreshold symptomatology; thus, she meets criteria for Pervasive Developmental Disorder Not Otherwise Specified. Strengths include ability to initiate interactions, imaginative play, lack of preoccupations, adaptabiliy, happy demeanor, superior intellectual functioning, advanced verbal skills, and family support. Weaknesses include repetitive motor mannerisms, decreased eye contact, and reciprocity in conversation. Although she appears to meet criteria for PDD-NOS at the current time, her social interaction skills and repetitive patterns of behavior should be monitored closely and reevaluated in the future as she ages and matures."