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ALGORITHMICALLY Detecting Autism From Forum Behavior

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swbluto
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25 Oct 2011, 12:07 pm

DeaconBlues wrote:
Interesting assertions. Do you have any hard data to back them up, or are you (like many sociologists) speaking through a non-standard orifice?


Well, it's just speculation that needs data and experimentation to verify how valid the hypotheses might be. It might be that there are no particular set of sociological or statistical analyses that'd easily detect autistic individuals from neurotypical individuals based on their socialization patterns and there might be a ton of exceptions as wavefreak suggests, but that's for experimentation to determine. I get the eerie suspicion that NTs and Aspies might show different socialization patterns since there's usually a difference in real life, I don't see why there wouldn't exist some kind of consistent difference or differences online.

But, I think this analysis would be suspectible to systemic bias, as this only measures, in particular, socialization patterns and trends associated with ToM characteristics. It'd seem quite possible for someone who's aspie to have an on-par ToM and show "normal socialization patterns" but yet have stimming and repetitious behavior and the other traits associated with autism. But, I'm primarily interested in this analysis to analyze myself as I don't stim nor engage in stereotyped behavior, so socialization and communication patterns is all that I'm interested in.



Last edited by swbluto on 25 Oct 2011, 12:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

jackbus01
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25 Oct 2011, 12:17 pm

Surfman wrote:
...
swbluto may in fact be an intellect whore, or her attention needs are higher than most, along with a soft spot for meaness....she also trolls the newbies in the general forum, as the regulars have wised up to her aloof ambiguity, hence my prognosis of ADHD

That will be $540 thank you

Dont forget your meth based meds and please call the next patient


You seem to know a lot about trolling. :)



Last edited by jackbus01 on 25 Oct 2011, 12:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

swbluto
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25 Oct 2011, 12:19 pm

Surfman wrote:
The less responses to your thread starts, the less friends you make on WP, the worse your grammar and written flow, the longer your boring paragraphs and an excess of wordage, the more aspergian you are

Someone like Moog, who barely constructs a whole sentence, and has many ardent followers, may indicate a complete lack of autism :)

swbluto may in fact be an intellect whore, or her attention needs are higher than most, along with a soft spot for meaness....she also trolls the newbies in the general forum, as the regulars have wised up to her aloof ambiguity, hence my prognosis of ADHD

That will be $540 thank you

Dont forget your meth based meds and please call the next patient


I have no idea what you're talking about. You should troll someone else's thread, surfman.



jackbus01
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25 Oct 2011, 12:21 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
Dude - maybe you're a quantum aspie. You behave like an aspie as long as you don't try to measure it. But as soon as you attempt to quantify it, you collapse into an NT.


funny and clever!
Aspergerian uncertainty principle, right!



jackbus01
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25 Oct 2011, 12:23 pm

swbluto wrote:
Surfman wrote:
The less responses to your thread starts, the less friends you make on WP, the worse your grammar and written flow, the longer your boring paragraphs and an excess of wordage, the more aspergian you are

Someone like Moog, who barely constructs a whole sentence, and has many ardent followers, may indicate a complete lack of autism :)

swbluto may in fact be an intellect whore, or her attention needs are higher than most, along with a soft spot for meaness....she also trolls the newbies in the general forum, as the regulars have wised up to her aloof ambiguity, hence my prognosis of ADHD

That will be $540 thank you

Dont forget your meth based meds and please call the next patient


I have no idea what you're talking about. You should troll someone else's thread, surfman.



Okay, I am confused now: who is the troll Surfman or swbluto?



swbluto
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25 Oct 2011, 12:29 pm

jackbus01 wrote:
swbluto wrote:
Surfman wrote:
The less responses to your thread starts, the less friends you make on WP, the worse your grammar and written flow, the longer your boring paragraphs and an excess of wordage, the more aspergian you are

Someone like Moog, who barely constructs a whole sentence, and has many ardent followers, may indicate a complete lack of autism :)

swbluto may in fact be an intellect whore, or her attention needs are higher than most, along with a soft spot for meaness....she also trolls the newbies in the general forum, as the regulars have wised up to her aloof ambiguity, hence my prognosis of ADHD

That will be $540 thank you

Dont forget your meth based meds and please call the next patient


Surfman doesn't like me because he's misread the tone of my posts before and assumed I was a troll. The reason why he misread the tone of my posts is because my autistic way of thinking prevents me from comprehending how people will misconstrue what I post, and neurotypicals like himself especially have a bad habit of misreading autistic individuals.

So, he ends up trolling my threads and accusing me of trolling. It's not fair, but I guess autism isn't fair.



Last edited by swbluto on 25 Oct 2011, 1:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

wavefreak58
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25 Oct 2011, 1:09 pm

swbluto wrote:
...my autistic way of thinking ...


Today autistic?

Tomorrow?


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swbluto
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25 Oct 2011, 1:27 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
swbluto wrote:
...my autistic way of thinking ...


Today autistic?

Tomorrow?


All I know is that my thinking and way of speaking seems autistic. I'm literal, I tend to use pedantic language and I don't seem to accurately predict how neurotypicals will interpret what I say online and offline and so on. I don't actually know if it's "autism" because it might be something else and I don't really want autism, so that's why I'm uncertain about it.



wavefreak58
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25 Oct 2011, 1:29 pm

Maybe we could model swbluto's exploration of autistic potentialities as a Markov Process. It seems consistent to describe his vacillations regarding his NT/autistic status as a random variable with no dependence on previous state. Would the proposed algorithm invoked by the opening post need to incorporate this dynamic to be valid?


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swbluto
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25 Oct 2011, 1:32 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
Maybe we could model swbluto's exploration of autistic potentialities as a Markov Process. It seems consistent to describe his vacillations regarding his NT/autistic status as a random variable with no dependence on previous state. Would the proposed algorithm invoked by the opening post need to incorporate this dynamic to be valid?


Lol, my uncertainty doesn't influence my actual neurological status, so I'm not entirely concerned about fluctuations in my certainty. What I need is HARD, INDISPUTABLE evidence to prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt so that things like subjective certainty are irrelevant.



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25 Oct 2011, 1:39 pm

swbluto wrote:
wavefreak58 wrote:
Maybe we could model swbluto's exploration of autistic potentialities as a Markov Process. It seems consistent to describe his vacillations regarding his NT/autistic status as a random variable with no dependence on previous state. Would the proposed algorithm invoked by the opening post need to incorporate this dynamic to be valid?


Lol, my uncertainty doesn't influence my actual neurological status, so I'm not entirely concerned about fluctuations in my certainty. What I need is HARD, INDISPUTABLE evidence to prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt so that things like subjective certainty are irrelevant.


See my post above alluding to Turing Machines.

You are asking for algorithmic certainty. This is not possible as none of the definitions of autism and none of the diagnostic tools are fully objective and quantifiable. At best you would be able to develop a relatively accurate heuristic. But an algorithm akin to a binary search is not going to happen.


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25 Oct 2011, 1:46 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
But an algorithm akin to a binary search is not going to happen.


I don't need a definite "yes" or "no", I'm fine with a "ranking order" like, say, you're socialization patterns suggest you are 60% autistic or... you're less autistic than 95% of the boards!



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25 Oct 2011, 1:46 pm

There is one very large and fatal flaw with this: This is an aspie forum. I believe that most aspies may actually have a well developed theory of the mind or the potential to develop one, but it doesn't work as their minds are different from NT minds and the connection isn't made. Generally aspies connect with aspies better than NTs connect with aspies, but since there is more NT than autistic people Aspies don't get a chance to connect as much and this causes their overall ToM to suffer. An NT wouldn't be nearly as popular in an autistic forum as in a normal forum.



swbluto
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25 Oct 2011, 1:52 pm

Ganondox wrote:
An NT wouldn't be nearly as popular in an autistic forum as in a normal forum.


But moog is pretty popular...



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25 Oct 2011, 1:53 pm

swbluto wrote:
wavefreak58 wrote:
But an algorithm akin to a binary search is not going to happen.


I don't need a definite "yes" or "no", I'm fine with a "ranking order" like, say, you're socialization patterns suggest you are 60% autistic or... you're less autistic than 95% of the boards!



You seem to be asking for a function that given a set of inputs returns an output. It also seems this would be deterministic - the same output always comes from the same inputs. This type of algorithm isn't possible within the current state of autistic research and clinical practice.

You consider yourself mathematically erudite, correct? Then surely you can see what you are looking for cannot presently be accomplished by a deterministic algorithm.


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25 Oct 2011, 2:05 pm

swbluto wrote:
wavefreak58 wrote:
But an algorithm akin to a binary search is not going to happen.


I don't need a definite "yes" or "no", I'm fine with a "ranking order" like, say, you're socialization patterns suggest you are 60% autistic or... you're less autistic than 95% of the boards!


As you already know, you will not get a 0 1 answer, as myself, surfman, and wave freak have mentioned.

I get the vibe here that good ole doc is exploring an alternate for you, and thus this crusade for finding your neurological status?