Learning how to act to become more "humanlike"
Ettina wrote:
Quote:
Personally, I say we're not. I do believe that sufficient differences exist to render us a separate species, or at least a separate subspecies.
If an AS and an NT marry, they can have fertile children. Furthermore, AS have never formed a separate population - only a subsample of a larger NT population. What possible basis could you have for saying we aren't human? None of the arguments that biologists use to define separate species apply to NT versus AS.
Yeah-- I noticed.
I don't remember if different subspecies can breed fertile offspring or not. My academic biology is terribly rusty. Judging by the variety of Canis familiaris and Canus lupus hybrids out there, I'd have to guess they can.
It's partially (but only partially) humorous. Both poking a little fun at and partially acknowledging the Neanderthal theory of autism, and acknowledging the fact that, given some human behaviors, I'm not sure I want to count myself a member of the Homo sapien camp anyway. Most of them certainly don't seem to want me, and maybe they can just get bent.
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"Alas, our dried voices when we whisper together are quiet and meaningless, as wind in dry grass, or rats' feet over broken glass in our dry cellar." --TS Eliot, "The Hollow Men"
nessa238 wrote:
I think people with Aspergers are split between those who want to fit in and hence strive to be as NT as possible and those that just want to be themselves and hence have a constant battle on their hands. I prefer to be in the latter category as I don't want to be just like everyone else - I'm me.
If a person has to put on an act to be accepted which is the real them? the act or the person they are trying to hide?
If a person has to put on an act to be accepted which is the real them? the act or the person they are trying to hide?
The dichotomy between the two.
I prefer to prefer to be in the latter category, but the fact is that I'm in the former one, because I have grown tired of the battle and the fallout. Stay gold, dear one. Stay gold.
_________________
"Alas, our dried voices when we whisper together are quiet and meaningless, as wind in dry grass, or rats' feet over broken glass in our dry cellar." --TS Eliot, "The Hollow Men"
nessa238 wrote:
I think people with Aspergers are split between those who want to fit in and hence strive to be as NT as possible and those that just want to be themselves and hence have a constant battle on their hands. I prefer to be in the latter category as I don't want to be just like everyone else - I'm me.
If a person has to put on an act to be accepted which is the real them? the act or the person they are trying to hide?
If a person has to put on an act to be accepted which is the real them? the act or the person they are trying to hide?
i feel like i'm torn between these two. i will try my best to follow their rules, but only if they will accept me and let me be myself at the same time. am i really that weird....?
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Aspie: 166/200
NT: 57/200
AQ: 41/50
LizNY wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
I think people with Aspergers are split between those who want to fit in and hence strive to be as NT as possible and those that just want to be themselves and hence have a constant battle on their hands. I prefer to be in the latter category as I don't want to be just like everyone else - I'm me.
If a person has to put on an act to be accepted which is the real them? the act or the person they are trying to hide?
If a person has to put on an act to be accepted which is the real them? the act or the person they are trying to hide?
i feel like i'm torn between these two. i will try my best to follow their rules, but only if they will accept me and let me be myself at the same time. am i really that weird....?
That's not weird, it's logical
I get NTs being dismissive at best and downright nasty a lot of the time and I've jsut thought that this is probably why I am far more hard-line in not wanting to be like them. I suspect the average person with Aspergers doesn't get the same level of disrespect off NTs as I've had hence they have less incentive to hate them and want nothing to do with them. It's evidently all dependent on the reception a person gets from other people. NTs have rarely ever wanted much to do with me and often actively insult and ridicule me to each other, so I've had no incentive whatsoever to want to joint their 'club'.
I've been protected from all the pressure to be like them in effect and as a result have been able to stick with just being myself and only found friends among accepting people who didn't want to change me.
If a person wants to mix with NTs they have to be continually striving to be like them - that's the deal. I personally think it's far too high a price to pay.
nessa238 wrote:
LizNY wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
I think people with Aspergers are split between those who want to fit in and hence strive to be as NT as possible and those that just want to be themselves and hence have a constant battle on their hands. I prefer to be in the latter category as I don't want to be just like everyone else - I'm me.
If a person has to put on an act to be accepted which is the real them? the act or the person they are trying to hide?
If a person has to put on an act to be accepted which is the real them? the act or the person they are trying to hide?
i feel like i'm torn between these two. i will try my best to follow their rules, but only if they will accept me and let me be myself at the same time. am i really that weird....?
That's not weird, it's logical
I get NTs being dismissive at best and downright nasty a lot of the time and I've jsut thought that this is probably why I am far more hard-line in not wanting to be like them. I suspect the average person with Aspergers doesn't get the same level of disrespect off NTs as I've had hence they have less incentive to hate them and want nothing to do with them. It's evidently all dependent on the reception a person gets from other people. NTs have rarely ever wanted much to do with me and often actively insult and ridicule me to each other, so I've had no incentive whatsoever to want to joint their 'club'.
I've been protected from all the pressure to be like them in effect and as a result have been able to stick with just being myself and only found friends among accepting people who didn't want to change me.
If a person wants to mix with NTs they have to be continually striving to be like them - that's the deal. I personally think it's far too high a price to pay.
If it's any consolation, I don't think your experience is that unusual - I was treated the exact same way you describe and have no relationships with people because of it. I know that many others here have experienced this full-on rejection as well, especially those who weren't diagnosed until adulthood and therefore their behaviour wasn't understood or supported. However, I don't think that hatred of NTs is the most frequent outcome (though not an unusual one) - unfortunately, I think that the more frequent reaction to this lifelong treatment results in hatred of self, which is why many if not most adult autistic people who missed the boat on the diagnosis boom have chronic self-esteem issues.
I also don't think it's necessarily true that most high-functioning autistic people want to learn to be like neurotypical people. Most of the autistic people I know would rather be at home with their special interest than doing NT-type things. However, the desire to be able to function socially well enough to get through the necessary parts of life which include it is natural. I do agree that there is one advantage to being an adult autistic who has not had an "autism support team" - which is that we haven't been pressured to become like neurotypicals. The kids who are diagnosed early have their parents and expert professionals rallying around essentially trying to teach them to be as unlike their true nature as possible - which I think is important to help low-functioning autistic people be able to manage independence but not necessarily always appropriate for the high-functioning ones. Instead of teaching them that they are "wrong", they should be teaching the people around them to accept them for who they are.
