Aspie vs. Gifted

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There was a catagory in my school district call Gift-talented Learning Disabled(GT-LD) that this chart seems to claim is impossible. of course i dont like the chart because that was a designation I was given.

I was both, and now I am a teacher. I don't think the chart is meaning to imply that you can't be gifted AND have AS, most everyone who works in the field already knows it is common to have both. The point of the chart is to point out the differences (which can be quite subtle) to educators so they can more easily identify the AS students. What got me flagged for gifted testing initially in 4th grade was monologuing about JFK, and my use of vocabulary words. Then, when they tested my IQ, my verbal IQ was very high and my performance IQ was average. This should have set off warning bells, but they missed it even then. If something like this had existed when I was in school, somebody may have identified me (I was not diagnosed until age 32, and I sought it out because I went through the process with my son and all the questions the doc was asking also applied to me) and I may have not had to struggle so much. Confusing AS kids with NT gifted kids is common and a problem that prevents AS kids from accessing services that might help them reach their potential in life.

That said, it would rub fewer people the wrong way and be clearer all around if the categories were "Typically Developing Gifted" and "Asperger's".

I was in the Gifted class in elementary, and in "AP" classes in middle school and high school(until I insisted that I didn't want to take AP classes anymore). In elementary and middle school those classes typically only had 4-6 people in them. I was very different from everyone else in those classes and everyone in those classes was aware of it.

I did not find out the *extent* of those differences until much later, but I was aware that I was very different from them. I think that they were all even more aware of the differences than I was.

I hate this sort of discussion because I think it underlines something that is very, very wrong in the ASC world - especially where girls are concerned because we know that girls present differently and when they are extremely intelligent they tend to mask their autism , often very effectively.

In our world there is a spread of IQ (note: this is not intelligence) that fits a bell curve. Most people are around the middle - and by most I mean at least 75%, and there are a few at either end

The curve is exactly the same for ASC people.

The problem is that there is such snobbery about giftedness - this leads to an attitude that says, all those "odd" people out there are just gifted really unless you can see something obvious that puts them on the spectrum.

There are many of these "odd" people who would be helped significantly if there was an acceptance that ASCs and giftedness can go together but snobbery dictates that if you're gifted then you shouldn't be labelled AS or autistic so they write lists to try and separate them out.

I grew up as a "gifted" child. I'm very academic and I was put under huge pressure to achieve. I was told that all my problems were nothing but an illusion created by other people's jealousy. Much of my life, until just a few years ago, was a complete puzzle to me and the sense of failure dogged my every thought and action leading to even more difficulties in my life.

Now, as an adult, I find that the view I was taught and that made my life a misery because I couldn't live up to expectations was based on the idea that gifted people are naturally "odd" which simply isn't true. And now I know I am on the spectrum I can appreciate both my difficulties and my talents and that knowledge has taken a weight off my shoulders and helped me come to terms with life as it really is for me.

I have 2 children, both of whom are gifted.

The boy has a label of autism - it is very clear in him - and has received high levels of support for both his ASC difficulties and for his talents. He is generally a happy and balanced person as an adult despite his problems and gifts because of that support and understanding.

My younger daughter does not have a label of autism and has received support only for her talents. She is experiencing exactly what I experienced but while she has no diagnosis of AS that side of her is ignored.
She has a list of comorbid conditions as long as your arm, every single one of them closely connected with autism - synaesthesia, DCD, pain amplification, gender dysphoria, selective mutism....... the list goes on. And yet she failed assessment for autism or AS.
I know from my own experience that recognition that she is on the spectrum would help her enormously but until the male bias in assessment is addressed there is only me who recognises the level of her difficulties and can see her subtle differences from her peers for what they are. Her life is hell, and all the therapies and medications she has had don't help her with that because they aren't looking at the real problem, they just make her feel even more different - and there is nothing I can do about it because nobody is listening to either of us.

At least she has a family who recognise and support her - unfortunately, I don't think that's enough

There are things on that list I disagree with. For instance:

AS
Little or no elaboration with run-on speech - I think most Aspies over-elaborate due to attention to detail, this even comes up in the assessment questions.

When problems arise, parents or teachers are distressed by them while student may be unaware of distressing situation unless personally affected - this is a pile of crap.

Limited recognition of differences with peers - again, a pile of crap. Aspies are fully able to identify their differences.

Unaware of social conventions or the reasons behind them - we are aware of social conventions, even though they may be confusing as to why they are there at times, (not always), again, it's trouble applying them ourselves.

Uninviting verbal style - only true in some. Females especially are good at appearing engaging.

Gifted
Aware of social norms - many Aspies are aware of social norms, they just have difficulty fitting into them!

What is pedantic speech, exactly? I know what the definition is, but what is the difference between when someone is talking about something interesting & when someone is pedantic?

Also, what is seamless speech? Does this mean that people use transitions & segues more often?

As per Tony Attwood's "The Complete Guide to Asperger's Syndrome", pedantic speech is described as:

"The characteristics include providing too much information, an emphasis on rules and minor details, a tendency to correct errors in the previous utterance of the other person, the use of overly formal sentence structures, and making a rigid interpretation of what someone says that could be perceived as being argumentative rather than corrective. The person with Asperger's syndrome is often characterized as being a pedant, a comment which is not intended as a compliment.

An example is a teenager, when helping his father in his job as an after-hours office cleaner, was asked to empty all the bins. A while later, the father was annoyed that several bins had obviously not been emptied. When he asked his sone why, he replied, 'Those aren't bins, they're wicker baskets.' "

I'm not sure what they mean by "seamless" as pedantic could cover that, or possible run-on in the next line. It could mean that there isn't a proper space between sentences, or it being more of a one-sided conversation.

I was given all sorts of testing in the 70s and they called me gifted.

But Aspergers was not known until a decade later, and diagnostic criteria were not formalized until two decades later, so there was no way for that to be recognized.

I was "gifted" with motor control issues, no friends or social skills, special therapy for poor eye contact, extreme focus on special interests and pedantic (or, as I would have said, precise, accurate and complete) speech.

I think the "gifted" label was the result of IQ tests, I strongly suspect that today I would have also been labeled "Aspergers."

I rather wish the AS label had existed then, because the abilities that get me good test scores have always been at war with poor organization and time management, and my attempts to deal with these by "trying hard" have not been that successful. My teachers at every level have always said they "know" I could do more, if only I was trying harder, despite the fact that I was trying as hard as I possibly could and getting depressed in the process.