Levels of Aspie

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LoMai,

I am not a Doctor but I am diagnosed, therefore communication skills will not be a plus in this letter, But I will do my very best here.

Some symptoms I have is to Perseverate
per·sev·er·ate to repeat something insistently or redundantly
I drive people crazy, I don’t know I’ doing it when I’m in that loop.

I can’t get issues out of my mind and Drive them into the ground till I loose my friends.

My Aspergers and OCD Obsessive Compulsive Disorder seem to accompany one another, For example: one day my OCD is really high while the Asperger symptoms are low. However, other days it’s Visa Versa.

To force your Daughter to look into someone’s eyes could cause her to go into Paroxysms of autism its often mistaken as a fit, I’m working on mine.

Strict corporal punishment will cause resentment and cause your daughter to crawl further away from society. Time is on your side, corrections works best when you talk logical sense to her and get her to understand in firm love and comfort. Loving firmness works for me.

As a child, often my mother took me to the store. I used to focus intently on a certain Toy. My mother would put it back on the shelf. I would fall on the floor kick and scream loud! When I did not get what I wanted, and embarrassed my Mother. People told her, she had a brat. No! I was suffering paroxysms of autisms.

We Aspergers people have trouble with change, routine works for me. I need my space to do my Aspergers OCD routines. I know it sound nuts, but it’s the nature of the beast!

The outstanding abilities you may notice with your Daughter are most likely the Splinter abilities. They are exceptional above normal Gifts, Abilities. To some they appear miraculous, such as in the ability to retain Logic, Numeric, Mathematical, Dates and Times of Events, Total Recall of Memory, Where You’ve Been, Etc. Read about them online. This is not true with all Autism, but I am fortunate to have some of these natural skills, and my Mother helped me hone in on these to offset the disadvantages I have. Perhaps this is how God balances things out!

Beware of people who tend to single your daughter out as an Odd Ball or psychotic. More harm would be done to her condition.

I am now a grown man Married with children who are diagnosed with Aspergers, My experience with additional professional counseling is enhancing their lives, hopefully they will excel to have above normal lifes

Thank you
Malcolm Mac Farlane

I think it was wrong for the headmaster to have yelled at this girl for not making eye contact. For Aspies making direct eye contact is often very scary. I got in trouble for not making eye contact when teachers or supervisors were telling me off but when they looked angry, I thought they were ugly and I didn't like looking at anything ugly.

GOOD POST, but I have to say that the tantrums aren't necessarily "The nature of the beast". BTW your mother sounds NICE! I wish MINE was like that! I KNOW I had:

the ability to retain Logic, Dates and Times of Events, Total Recall of Memory, Where You’ve Been, and think I had the others you mentioned. NOW, a lot of that is not so clear, but I still have the after effects. I obviously learned a lot.

Steve

Generally many people on the spectrum don't *do* phone calls (finding it easier to communicate in writing, not being interested in 'gossip', finding it difficult to sort out sounds in the background from the voice on the line etc.), but as with anything, if it becomes an obsession then anything is possible, especially if it develops into a ritual or becomes a habit of comfort (some people carry a favourite item in their pocket, wear comforting clothes or listen to comforting music).

I have recently read a book called "Send in the Idiots" (named after a phrase one of the people in the book used to shout out loud in class), about former students at a school for autistic children in New York. It was written by a guy who went to school with them, and Elizabeth, one of his former classmates (who sadly died before he started writing the book) had adopted a similar "interest" that developed after her mother started going back to work.

So yes nothing you mentioned speaks *against* AS as such.

I do however agree with those who have mentioned things like Bipolar in this thread (which occurs relatively frequently in kids with ASDs), certainly the intensity and the rages you mention might be related to that as well, and needs to be addressed alongside with a possible AS diagnosis, because Bipolar moodswings and rages don't go back to the same triggers as similar aspects in AS, and while a lot of these problems can be helped in AS by changing the environment (improving/adapting communication, introucing and maintaining structure, limiting sensory assaults etc.), the same isn't usually the case with Bipolar rages etc.

OCD is also quite common on the Spectrum, and if anxiety is the main reason behind her need for reassurance (sometimes, it can just be that bad experiences socially can make Aspies and Auties very scared and constantly in need of reassurance) then that's certainly something worth looking into as well.

I know this thread is a little old but I just wanted to encourage you to have your daughter seen by someone experienced in female adolescence with AS(aspergers).I can relate to some of your daughters sensory issues.I still run out of the bathroom after flushing(when I dont "forget" to flush....very embarrassing at 43!!)

I was DX with depression,anxiety,social attachment dis-order and possible Borderline PD.I tried really hard to be "good" but never seemed to be good enough,(I didnt get in trouble in school,good grades,no drugs until my folks kicked me out at 16,and then all hell broke lose).But I had very strong likes and dislikes ,black and white thinking and obsessive interests.Keeping all my melt-downs internal ended up with my eventual self-harm and two serious suicide attempts before 18.They were not "cries for help"(though I would have loved some if I even believed that was possible.)I eventually became promiscuous. I was very naive and believed what guys told me they really liked me and was afraid not having sex would leave me alone,(not uncommon in aspie females who have no other friends or family support)a binge drinker who ended up hooking up with punk rockers,the only group who would except me.By 26, I was homeless.

My life is not common for aspies and I dont want you to think that is were your daughter is headed.I also managed to graduate college(not the greatest grades but I have the diploma),and I did get sober and stayed that way after 26(some aspie obsessiveness and black and white thinking can work in our favor.)I stopped hating myself for being "different" and let myself be me,long before I heard about AS.However,I do think I would have avoided a lot of pain,risky life choices,bad relationships if I had not wasted so many years in non-productive therepy trying to change me into an NT instead of helping me understand why I was the way I was(I was so desperate to understand I "filled in the blanks" with psycho babble,I was an alien,past lives).It would have been very helpful to have had a site like this so I didnt think I was "the only freak like me".

Sorry to bore you with the monologue but I would love to help anyone avoid some of my missteps.I cant go back and my life was "interesting" in some aspects but I dont think I have reached my full potential with all these side tracks and wrong paths.If you think the past fews years with your daughter have been challenging.....the next few years are critical for her eventual mental health....teen years sucked more for me then any other time in my life.It truely was a nightmare I wish on no one.
I hope you will seek professional evaluation for her and learn as much as you can from this web site and others who have a positive view of AS.(I dont think my AS traits were responsible for my pain but my,my parents,peers and professionals ignorance of AS.)

Maybe I am missing something here but OCD and bi-polar is found in higher instances among Aspies. I think instead of trying to decipher what she may or may not have, she needs to be seen by someone who is familiar with the many variants of AS. I am a 27 year old, who has been a social butterfly at times even at a young age, this was due to the understanding nature of my friends and family. I was awkward and weird and I was ok with it, just because I couldn't relate to them in a emotionally intelligent way doesn't mean I didn't connect at all. And when I needed a break from the exhausting task of socializing I would bar myself in my room for a few weeks at a time. And this is how I have dealt with it all these years.. studying people and emotional issues, being social when I have the energy to, and cutting out for however long it takes for me to feel "centered" again. It should also be mentioned that girls can have very different symptoms because of our ability to mimick to the point where it is muscle memory. I can socialize like my NT friends (well, mostly) because I have found good coping skills as well as behavior modification techniques. So lets see what professionals have to say about this girl.

Um.. a few is 3, a couple is 2, a bunch is more than a few.. then I'd have to ask.

ps. a handfull is 5 or 4, depending if you count the thumb.

According to "Pervasive Developmental Disorder: Asperger's Syndrome" by Dr. Brasic copyright April 10, 2006:

Social problems

Children with Asperger disorder may have difficulties with peer relations and may be rejected by other children.

Outside the realm of immediate family members, the affected child may exhibit inappropriate attempts to initiate social interaction and to make friends. Within the immediate family, the child is often loving and affectionate.


Note that it says that the child is often loving and affectionate with immediate family. The opposite can be true as well. It doesn't exclude her because she is.

Separations from parents because of work and divorce may be particularly stressful for these children. Changing homes, communities, and neighborhoods may also exacerbate symptoms.

It isn't unusual for her to be clinging to you if you are the stability. It really just depends on her and what she perceives as stability. Yes, talking on the phone is strange for most of us, but it doesn't require eye contact and if she can't talk to you, but she can call, it fits with the inability to distinguish boundaries. As the one poster said, set definite number of calls. Only don't be surprised when she obsesses about when she can call you next because that's probably going to follow.

The mumbling into the phone could just be her way of mumbling (some AS do it). She might have figured out fewer people stare if she puts the phone to her ear as she does it. It could also be another problem. She has to be tested.



Individuals often exhibit practical speech problems, including inability to use language in social contexts, lack of sensitivity about interrupting others, and irrelevant commentary.

Individuals may vocalize their thoughts without censoring. Personal remarks inappropriate to most social environments may be uttered routinely.

The amount of speech may also vary greatly and reflect the individual's current emotional state more than the communication requirements of the social setting. Some individuals may be verbose and others taciturn.

There's also this from Misdianosing Narcissism also by Vaknin copyright (I believe) 2002:

The Asperger's patient often wants to be accepted socially, to have friends, to marry, to be sexually active, and to sire offspring. He just doesn't have a clue how to go about it. His affect is limited. His initiative - for instance, to share his experiences with nearest and dearest or to engage in foreplay - is thwarted. His ability to divulge his emotions stilted. He is incapable or reciprocating and is largely unaware of the wishes, needs, and feelings of his interlocutors or counterparties.

Inevitably, Asperger's patients are perceived by others to be cold, eccentric, insensitive, indifferent, repulsive, exploitative or emotionally-absent. To avoid the pain of rejection, they confine themselves to solitary activities - but, unlike the schizoid, not by choice. They limit their world to a single topic, hobby, or person and dive in with the greatest, all-consuming intensity, excluding all other matters and everyone else. It is a form of hurt-control and pain regulation.

Thus, while the narcissist avoids pain by excluding, devaluing, and discarding others - the Asperger's patient achieves the same result by withdrawing and by passionately incorporating in his universe only one or two people and one or two subjects of interest. Both narcissists and Asperger's patients are prone to react with depression to perceived slights and injuries - but Asperger's patients are far more at risk of self-harm and suicide.

So, it could be that what you call "She is also social but can not maintain relationships for more than a few months, mainly because she can be overbearing, insensitive, controlling, etc. - the parents of kids she makes friends with do not generally like her because of her intensity." is really just her talking non-stop about what interests her. Riding roughshod over others' conversations. Staying in their space of following them to talk about what she wants to say. Not showing any "softness" or "sympathy." Since she is a girl, I'm going to say that their judgment of her is probably much harsher. Things that might go unnoticed or more tolerated in boys, are probaby putting her under a microscope. For instance, I don't get overbearing, insensitive and controlling, I get harsh, abrasive and insensitive. And, I'm not much of a talker at all. In fact, you better bring a crowbar if you want me to talk. But, I do have to write the occasional email at work and God forbid, it goes to a feeler because my writing is stripped of all pleasantries and adjectives, adverbs, etc. Even when I read it 100 times to make sure it's warm and fuzzy, it still hurts their feelings because "I just told them." I've had guys send them out for me. Guess what? No such response. Society is just weird that way. Anyway, my feeling is that you, her teachers and the rest are probably being overly harsh because she's a female. But, getting back to original point, yes, that can be aspie, depending on what is actually happening.

Again, you need to have her tested. I know some on here say by a Psychiatrist, but it's a neurological disorder, so I would only trust a Neurologist with AS experience. Psychiatrists are not doctors. They shouldn't be acting like doctors. If she has this, she isn't choosing to be this way, she just is.


Psychiatrists can help with side issues (or what Neurologists call comorbid conditions). Depression, stress, etc. But, that should never exclude understanding what is actually happening in your child's brain or letting her understand it.

And I will tell you this right now, your child is not required to be like all the other children. Learn to love who she is and don't buy into this crap of making her fit into the exact mold everyone wants in school nowdays. I was beyond weird as a child. We didn't have all of this back then. My teachers made me separate curriculums and sent me to the library starting in the sixth grade. I graduated with a 3.98, earned a BA and a MA both with over a 3.95. I have a good job and marriage. I have my own life. And guess what? I'm still beyond weird. My family still thinks the aliens dropped me off. I'm sure my work thinks that as well.

In other words, find out what's going on with your child, but use moderation. Help her get along, but don't crush who she is. She will always be different. So was Einstein. People also thought he was beyond weird and he never fit in.