Nesseccity of Empathy

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I grew up Roman Catholic, but always had doubts. What the priest told us during Sunday service just never seemed to match what was going on around me the rest of the week. So much hypocrisy. Then I studied Roman Catholic theology, up to masters level, and lost what remained of my faith. One of our professors, a Jesuit priest, spent a year explaining to us why he did not believe in miracles and other dogmas of the church. And it wasn't any old college either, one of my former professors still sits on the Vatican's International Theological Commission and others from that faculty do/did, too.

The most absurd thing is that during my first year of studies I experienced an event that I still think was a religious "calling" ("Berufung", in German). It just never became clear what I was called to (do). Still waiting to get more detailed instructions. It's been seventeen years.

The hypocrisy can be very disheartening. I see it from this inside, because I am a priest. I am blessed to have a bishop who is actually a holy man. But most bishops in the U.S. are not holy men, I regret to say.

So you studied theology and lost your faith? It's not supposed to work that way. I wonder what you were being taught. A religious experience of a call needs to be followed up on. How old are you?

I'm 39. Of course, I have since also learned that I'm autistic. I don't know how you do it, but I would be useless as a priest. Autism might make it easier to stay celibate, though.

I was 39 when I was ordained and I didn't know I had ASD. Anyway, look, if I can help you in any way I'm here for you, ok? I converted to Catholicism after a religious experience I had when I was 20. Then, the Blessed Virgin Mary got me through the seminary. I have an extremely high I.Q. and a very deep faith. In other words: I'm a straight shooter. If you like , you may hit me up either on this forum here or through personal messages. +Blessings.

A lot of people think if you have ASD you are incapable of understanding others, incapable of empathy. Is ASD something you can be open about, JSBachlover, or need to be discrete about to avoid unnecessary negativity from others?

I don't go around announcing it, but I am proud to have ASD and to have come as far along as I have. I connect amazingly well with people. Yet, I am an Aspie to the core. It's an amazing situation to be in, and I love it.

And, as I've said before, I love being able to tell the weekday of any date you can give me. The parishioners find that to be weird but fun.

I'm drawing a blank on the positives of empathy.

Empathy means that you love other people. That's all.

You sure about that?

Last I heard, it means you feel what someone else is feeling by just looking at them, which in turn leads to bad things if there's a person around to take advantage of that situation.

I strongly posit that empathy is the core of the worst acts done by groups of humans.

Empathy can also be at the core of some of our best actions as human beings. And I think that empathy allows us to feel love.

I also think perhaps it may be very possible to feel love and empathy when you have ASD but sometimes not getting so much back as is needed.

I've tried to feel that way, and believe it, but it's difficult to do. I am around feedback that I should be ashamed. I admire you for finding that path of being proud of who you are.

I am sure about that. Then you wrote: "Last I heard, it means you feel what someone else is feeling by just looking at them, which in turn leads to bad things if there's a person around to take advantage of that situation. I strongly posit that empathy is the core of the worst acts done by groups of humans."

It would lead to bad things if the motive of reading other people is to take advantage of them. But that holds true only for psychopaths and narcissists, and, moreover, that is not "empathy," that is "sizing up a person's motives" which is a colder and more malicious process. Empathy, by its nature, is seeking to know the other, out of genuine concern.

So why do you think that empathy is the core of the worst acts done by groups of humans? Did something happen in your past to make you think this? Was there abuse?

Empathy generally means the ability to recognize and understand the emotional state of others by looking at them -- this can lead on to "feelings", such as care, but they're separate entities. One can care for someone for a great number of things, such as if someone does something for you which is tangible and readily understood without any form of empathetic connection involved (which is mostly a form of nonverbal communication).

Yes, it can and does lead to bad things, as it's very easy to whip up the masses due to the "feelings" they experience when they see how others are feeling. It can also lead to good things too, of course. It needn't even require manipulation by others to lead to bad things, rather, just a domino effect.

Sure, I've been abused and bullied by groups of people, and all have been due to the group getting whipped into a frenzy by the "feelings" they experienced as it happened, which was based on that nonverbal communication called empathy. Groups of people that'd be "nice" when taken individually, and who wouldn't bully me if it were just me and them.

I don't think empathy = love, but I think it is a prerequisite of love. If I don't see someone as being like me, if I see them as an alien, some other, I am not likely to feel any positive feelings or develop a bond with that person. The moment I begin to see some commonality between me and another person, I begin to feel more comfortable around that person, and I start caring about their well-being. Does this make sense to anyone? Or what is your opinion?

By the way, I also think it works the other way around. Lack of empathy is a prerequisite for hate. The people who I hate the most are people whose behavior I see as harmful and illogical. My inability to relate to the person combined with my seeing the person as a threat create the negative emotions I feel toward the person. I start to see them as an enemy and not as a human being.

em_tsuj, I possess the same feelings/perspective that you do, regarding everything you have expressed. I don't believe that I could have expressed it quite as well, however.

If I were to expand on what you have stated, specifically, in regard to the following comment you made: "The moment I begin to see some commonality between me and another person, I begin to feel more comfortable around that person, and I start caring about their well-being." That is the point where I personally connect with the sentiments of Dillogic, because, I have, in recent years, been deceived by a couple of people who's motives were of the destructive sort, and as soon as they perceived that I had acquired a level of "comfort" with them, and in turn began to "care about their well-being", they went in for the kill, so to speak. I could perhaps, be wrong, but I think that Dillogic, quite possibly may have meant something along this line, when he was expressing how "empathy" could lead to particular, negative experiences.