Knowing when to end something

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I am a poor judge of both when to end and start something.

I tend to wait too long to end a friendship until it gets really bad. I think I am getting better at it though. I just learn from experience and if I run into that again with someone else, run. Luckily I didn't last long with my boyfriends. I quit my job when I moved or had my hours cut and had to go to training for my next job so I quit since the training was in the middle of the night and I would be getting home around six am. Sometimes I do wonder if they kept my hours cut after business picked up again because they wanted me to quit than fire me or they did it to save money and they were using me for backup for when anyone calls in sick which was only once or twice a month.

It makes a LOT of sense. I've come to the assertion that most of my problem with the whole emotional mess (and for me it really is a mess) is that I don't really feel anything until I've had a chance to put it through a logical thought process. That's why I am such a delayed reactor- I do the logical thing (which makes me oddly effective in a crisis) but have to process all the emotional junk attached to the consequences of my actions and decisions after the fact. I can plan, be involved with and attend a funeral of a loved one, for instance, and I don't really feel anything while there are concrete things that have to be done, and courtesies to be paid, but I fall apart later-sometimes 10 or 20 years later.

I can be coldly rational- and do the "right" logical things- with a frightening degree of effectiveness and ruthlessness. But after I break it down and mull it over and replay it time and time again, that's when I process everything else. (PTSD, anyone?)

I hate making primarily emotional decisions- involving relationships and those sorts of things- because I really have no reference point. If I can't readily see the "right" answer, I delay the decision. If it's not a decision that can be backed up with logic and facts I'm pretty well screwed. If it is a logical decision, then I have no problem with it at all, even if what needs to be done seems heartless later. Just ask my ex-husband who I have (thankfully) not seen in over 20 years.

I think your theory makes a lot of sense.

I tend to sabotage it when stress builds up enough & causes me to have a major meltdown.

I think it is bad idea to end things like jobs or relationships over temporary spurts of frustration or problem that will pass. Even if the emotions are bad in the moment or during a period, it may be regrettable to end something based on those feelings.

Umm, okay, I've got one

I've been periodically catching up with this girl over the last 6 months; when I met her I thought we were well compatible and things were going really nicely. I ended up sending her this sizable love letter and she said we should be friends. Okay, because I've burned friendships before over less and it's not terribly mature.

About two months later she told me she's in a long-distance relationship, but only because I specifically asked her about why she said she had no heart previously, and that she should feel sorry for leading me on. At that point I decided that I should remain respectful and it was probably difficult for her to make friends being so beautiful and all.

Last night, while making plans, she said she was going to leave the city and come back for a 'hot girl.' I asked her if she was done with guys (she's said a number of things that sound like she's sexually active,) and she said 'probably not.'

At this point, I feel like I'm just fulfilling the emotional component of a relationship which she willingly left on the other side of the world, though I am aware that I am prone to cognitive distortions and self-pity in that regard... But then! I think, those NT types start and end potential love interests like this all the time, it's just not as big a thing, right? 'Tried with this person, turns out she doesn't know what she wants, move on. No biggie.'

Anyhow. I went a bit sideways and whilst I tried not to be too abrasive, I did send her a message with two rather confused and distinct halves, the first stating that I'm sick of being used and the second saying that I fell in love wit er very quicky upon meeting her and I can't keep doing this to myself.

She replied asking if that was a goodbye and if we can talk in person. I haven't replied. I really don't want to, as it seems useless to communicate that whenever I see her I spend between 3 days to 3 weeks in a state of abject depression, and seeming to confirm that she's sexually active whilst maintaining this platonic relationship with me really hurts.

Do I leave it? Do I try and talk to her? This is what I want to do:

Try to build a real friendship with her.
Real friends are more important than all else.

I am unsure as to whether this person actually is a real friend though. I feel quite used, and if it were a male friend who only partitioned out information as they saw fit or when confronted I'd have been done with it long ago.

Probably not.
But, there may be a time when she becomes more aware and less confused, and she may realize that she does need a real friend. It may never happen though, so just be cautious.

I very much appreciate your advice. It's unfortunate as she's a lovely girl but I think I should let it go. The reality is that I end up winding myself up to the point of getting depressed every time I see her, and I think that's significant. I think this is a good example of OP's topic-- I've been thinking for a while that this friendship/whatever isn't good for me, but those thoughts of 'what if it changes? What if her issues magically sort themselves out? What if she starts being more honest with me?' just keep coming up.

I'll share this one as well, because I hope someone might relate to it and perhaps get a bit of perspective for themselves-- 'what if I cut the cord and then find out that she actually loves me and was just testing me?'

Y'know? It's delusional thinking.

I'll put this in contrast with another friend, who I consider a true friend, who I met and absolutely fell for because a) she understood me, my humour, my interests, my depression; and b) because she's a very touchy-feely person so I took all the hugs and hand-holding to mean that she liked me. Oh yeah, she also said 'I love you, B' one night as she was saying goodbye to me.
Now when I confessed my feelings for her, there was a bit of fallout because she had to say 'no B, I don't like you in that way,' to which my response was 'does not compute.' at the end of he day though, she took the time out to be honest with me. 'I'm already dating guys, yplease don't be upset but you're just not my type.' she was honest, and now it doesn't hurt to see her.

I have realised that my idea of the way relationships work is like some kind of equation rather than a dynamic human thing... Ie, mutual interests + attraction + humour = <3
It's really frustrating when it doesn't work like that, which is always!

Anyway, ending things is difficult. So many variables. I have similar issues with creative projects and events that I'm working on.

I would also like to point out that ever since I first bought The Prodigy's 'Music for the Jilted Generation,' from which the image I posted above is taken, I've been super annoyed with that silly hippie-- cutting the rope on the other side of the post would be a far more effective method of taking that bridge out!

I think, from the way you described those two scenarios, that you are investing your emotions too soon when you meet someone. Maybe take more of a wait-and-see approach before you let yourself fall for someone.

Attraction is complex and it's common that people may give each other mixed signals or misinterpret some things. Plus as you get to know someone more, you may find out things about them that are not compatible with you or that you actually dislike a lot. That's why it's good to hold back your feelings, to allow time to sort that out.

I know this might sound easier said than done. I am the kind of person, once I really open up and get close to someone, I'm unable to hold back or filter very much. I begin to trust that person implicitly, I start saying whatever comes to mind, and I don't hold back my feelings. I think NTs generally are not like that, no matter how close they get to someone, they still hold a big part of themselves back and they filter a lot.

And that's probably where you see a lot of mixed signals come out and seeming like they don't know what they want. They typically DO know what they want, or at least they know what they intend to do (whether that's what they genuinely want or not is another story) but they are simply holding back that information from you. It's kind of like they have a complex system of negotiation, that just comes naturally...they give a little information, they get a little information.

Anyway I've realized this is one of the major differences between me and other people. Most people hold themselves back from things, and filter a lot, but for me it tends to be all or nothing, like a valve that can only be opened or closed. If I really open up and commit to something, I give all of myself. That can be a great thing, but it can also lead to feeling like you get taken advantage of and used. So I've had to learn how to hold myself back more, to be mindful of how much I'm giving, how much I'm investing myself and my emotions, and how much time/space I'm keeping to myself.

A lot of these conflicts about wanting to end things come up because I feel overwhelmed and feel like I can't get enough distance from something. Because it begins to feel like an all-or-nothing proposition.

I think we prefer to think about things in "all or nothing" terms because our conscious thought uses a formal binary logic.

I think NTs prefer to engage in reciprocal negotiations using differing levels of uncertainty because their subconscious thinking (intuition) uses probabilities.

I think that NTs expect us to speak the same language and engage in the "gaming" with them.

For either side of an NT/AS relationship it would be very confusing because many of the responses would seem to be out of place and not make sense. For us, this really complicates the matter of making decisions competently.

I agree, and I think that for the most part their filters are acting within their subconscious, and further, I think these filters are created by, or at the very least heavily influenced by social pressures (mostly subliminal) to be more psychopathic and narcissistic. And yes, it does seem like most things keep coming back to this.

When reverse engineered, most of these social scenarios come back to a relatively small set of logical algorithms.

For example, if you are "gaming" some people but they can easily figure out what is going on and either use this information against you, or decide to end the interaction, then your chances of winning the game have gone away, the gaming interaction dissolves, and thus the logic driving this interaction dissolves with it.
However, if you inject the right amounts of uncertainty into the interactions, then the players will stay engaged, the game continues, you retain your chances of winning, and this logic survives to be repeated and/or spread.

This logic plays out in the NT subconscious, out of sight, and is similar to natural selection that we can observe in nature.

So, I'm suggesting that the difficulty we have consciously deciding when to end something is not really an accidental situation.

I actually don't know how I've made it through life to date, bumbling along quite oblivious to all this, viewing certain things as similar to the motions of a dance/game. Never understanding why the steps of the dance were inflexible, just learning the consequences from the ginormous mistakes.
The all or nothing is quite sad, I actually believed that I could be myself in my marriage, but if everyone holds something back, then I definitely got that wrong too.
My relationships and why I cheese people off makes more sense now, I'm beginning to think that life would be much simpler if I could opt out of everything social...

Thanks to you both, Dianthus and Olympiadis. It sounds like I'm in the middle of some Greek epic now as opposed to some mundane, icky human situation

You're right, Dianthus- I do invest emotions in people far too quickly. I'm unsure how to remedy this other than to focus entirely on my interests for the forseeable future.

I'm not really happy with the way I've left this situation, but I feel that it's just going to drag out ad infinitum if I don't do something. I'm aware that people are likely talking about how weird and unstable I am but it wouldn't be the first time and I'm on the fringe of that particular social group anyway. Hopefully those that I really get along with there might understand how confusing and painful the situation is for me and look past it... Another dimension to why it's hard to end things!

Olympiadis' insight into binary thought is very perceptive. I'm glad to have found this forum and to be a part of a community that doesn't judge me for these confusing internal processes. Or perhaps those that are just aren't saying anything