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Looking at Guillan-Barré syndrome, it appears to be a pretty awful disease that can have what seems to be a lifelong effect. In fact, I remember it coming up in Umechan-sensei, a Japanese drama series about the eponymous woman doctor in the immediate postwar period. It often emerges after certain diseases, such as influenza. It does appear, however, to be pretty rare, especially in the west, where the epidemiology is typically between about 1 and 2 people in 100,000. Nevertheless, studies have overall shown a small effect with influenza vaccines, though I think you're still more likely to get Guillan-Barré syndrome from actual influenza, probably more commonly from severe influenza, as opposed to getting it from the influenza vaccine. Guillan-Barré syndrome tends to be worse the older you get, and is a bit more common in men than women (though the ratio is less than two-to-one). Influenza causes 200,000 hospitalizations and 41,000 deaths per year in the USA. Based on these numbers, if you are in a vulnerable group (such as being very young, being very old, or having other health conditions), I would still recommend vaccination.

AspieUtah, I hope your brother can get a cure at some point.

AspieUtah,

I did read that having had Guillan-Barré syndrome does not mean that influenza vaccines are necessarily any more dangerous, though your brother may want to wait until he gets in a vulnerable group before getting it.

I would like to re-assert, as I have demonstrated on other threads on this subject recently, that there is no substantial evidence for a vaccine-autism or even vaccine preservatives and autism connection. The closest you get are anecdotes and the Wakefield study, which has not been independently verified. Many studies independent of the Wakefield study have not reproduced Wakefield's results, instead showing no effect of vaccines on autism rates.

What happens is that the vaccine in question, the MMR vaccine, which is given between 12 and 15 months, generally occurs a little before the age when autism signs first become noticed by parents. Because of that, many parents assume a causation, but there is no substantial evidence for that. In fact, in autistic people, the first signs tend to appear a good bit before the MMR vaccine, about 6 months, but parents don't often catch them. The current consensus says you are born with autism.

Some parents like to point to rising rates of autism, but that is largely due to improved diagnosis.

In 2012, there was a Cochrane Review, often considered the gold standard in evidence-based care, which showed that the MMR vaccine is safe and effective and should be used globally to eradicate measles.

the research has been done to death. there is zero relationship between vaccines and autism.

Have been working away I am happy enough these days.

Just decided to check in on you guys here.

I feel that the vaccine-autism scare is reactionary and unreasoned. The research seems to suggest again and again that there is no connection. That being said, I still don't like vaccines much. I had them as a child, and I get the big ones (hep, etc.), but I avoid the flu shot every year. It may not have any connection to autism, but that doesn't make it safe. There is a lot of extra junk in that syringe; it seems like I'm putting many bad things into my body to prevent one bad thing. That isn't a good balance. But I decline all medicine unless it's really necessary.

I also identify as a libertarian, and I feel it should be each individual's decision to get vaccinated for themselves. That's the essence of libertarianism: the freedom to make personal choices and the knowledge that said freedom comes with assuming personal responsibility for the consequences of those choices.

Vaccines should be available but not forced. My pharmacist, who is also a trusted friend, has told me that he would not get the flu vaccine if his employer did not require him to. He also says he only recommends it to the elderly or people with compromised immune systems. Healthy people are better off getting the flu than getting the vaccine.

OK, first up I agree that you probably don't need to bother getting vaccinations for diseases you are unlikely to be exposed to, although at the same time there's little reason not to.

So, most if not all of the concerned in this thread are American.

Usually, when Americans express concern about vaccines causing autism, their reasoning is "vaccines contain mercury and mercury is a neurotoxin".

There are two issues there:

1) Vaccines do not contain mercury. They contain thimoseral, which contains mercury. They are not the same thing by any means. Try breathing water - you'll die, even though it contains oxygen (that's what the "oh" in "aitch two oh" represents).
2) The brain damage caused by mercury does not remotely resemble autism.

I didn't take the swine flu vaccine because every time a swine flu vaccine comes around, people get Guillan-Barré syndrome. I fear immobility more than death, so despite belonging to risk groups, I didn't take it. Luckily I didn't get swine flu.


The childhood vaccines don't come with that or similar risks. They are nothing but a good thing, and a high percentage of vaccinated children are necessary in order to gain flock-immunity. For flock immunity to happen, at least 90% must be vaccinated.
It's one thing to take chance with one's own life, but when those chances jeopardize others it's no longer a personal choice.

IMO parents shouldn't be allowed to gamble with their children's lives and deny them vaccine.
In so doing they also jeopardize people who can't take the vaccine for immunity reasons.

Similarly, Jehova's witnesses don't allow their members to have blood transfusions, but here in Norway at least, they do not have the right to deny their children blood transfusion. That's as it should be! Adults can gamble with their own life if they wish, but they should not have the right to gamble with the lives of their children. Real things must always take precedence over beliefs, especially for those in a situation that they can't choose for themselves, like children.

I heard Australia wants to make things harder (revoke financial benefits) for parents who don't have their children vaccinated. That's fine, but it would be better if they made vaccination mandatory.

I got all the vaccinations that were offered when I was a child and teen, and I'm glad for it. I am currently thinking about renewing my tetanus protection.

I have never claimed that "vaccines cause autism." But, I recognize that they might cause autism-related behaviors. Do an Internet search for "drug vaccine induce mimic disease disorder" and see how many diseases and disorders are known to be induced or mimicked as a reaction to certain drugs and vaccines. After that, consider this: Why would autism-related behaviors be the only adverse reactions that aren't caused by certain drugs and vaccines? Even if they are the only excluded adverse reactions, aren't the remaining reactions concerning to us? Shouldn't the medical industry be concerned for those adverse reactions, even if their products "don't cause autism"? There is a reason that the phrase "vaccine-induced polio" is still in use.

Sooo, the school district failed miserably in its work to audit and manage the vaccination records of its students until this week, but it is the parents and students who are expected to snap to it and comply; typical.

Luckily, the parents can simply file a waiver in Washington state.

Me, too. I've been posting about it for the last year & a half.



Yeah, I'm not sure about vaccines - but they may be a contributing factor.

After the backlash in several threads I've posted here over the last year or so, I agree. A number of people have posted in treatment pro/con threads that they're worried they won't feel like themselves or may lose their identity etc. Meanwhile, it's been my experience that I'm simply a happier healthier me & I've gotten to keep pretty much all of the positive traits of autism that I get to better utilize now.



True, and as I've posted before.. I do wonder if the different connective wiring between various regions of an autistic brain during it's development is actually caused by gut dysbiosis w/ the biochemical biproducts of various bacteria acting as a "drug" on the brain, "tripping" it into connecting as it does while it grows. Maybe, maybe not, it's just a theory.

Yes, we can fix our guts - I have - and while my brain is how it is, it still functions WAY better with a better balanced digestive system. There are more signals sent from our guts to our brains than from our brains to our guts, which is why they're now calling the gut the second brain. I don't know for sure, but it's as if probiotics act as neurotransmitters in the enteric nervous system that stretches throughout the entire digestive system & w/o them signals don't fire properly. Load up on probiotics and MOST of my autism symptoms are minimized or disappear completely.

Like I've said many times on here, I'm living a second life for having done this. Just because my brain can't be rewired doesn't mean it's not worth treating what I can - because it is; it is SO worth it. Also, I haven't lost my identity in the least bit - I'm simply a happier, healthier, more productive, wealthier me.

But what if your neighbor's 6 month old dies because you chose not to vaccinate?

You're not just making a choice to take a risk for yourself. You're also making a choice to put everyone you come into contact with at risk, especially very young children and people with certain health problems.

If you want to go live as a hermit somewhere, then not vaccinating should be your choice. But otherwise, you're forcing others to take the risk of contact with an unvaccinated person, and you don't have the right to chose for them.

That would be the result of the child's parents or legal guardians who could have vaccinated the child in the first place (or chosen lawfully to decline such a vaccination; something I respect), now wouldn't it? This commentary explains it all nicely ( https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2015 ... lose-15000 ). I have written here how I accept the risks in my life, and don't try to blame them on others.

Children below a certain age cannot safely be given certain vaccinations, or wouldn't get proper immunity from them.

In addition, certain medical conditions can make vaccination unsafe for a child, or make them lose immunity they got from previous vaccinations. For example, children who've undergone chemotherapy often need to be given all their vaccines over again, because the chemo destroyed the immune cells that had adapted to the previous vaccinations.

So, no, you can't deflect blame back on the parents. They could be doing all they can to protect their children and you'd still put their child at risk.

I'd recommend people read this post which was put up about 10 hours ago:

viewtopic.php?t=279910&start=30#p6571471

It shows the conflicts of interest for Wakefield and shows how his 1998 story was falsified.

Good post.