The dif between empathy and sympathy

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C2V
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27 Aug 2015, 2:18 am

"Rarely can a response make something better. What makes something better is connection."

To reverse that from an autistic perspective, I find that completely untrue. If I'm relaying a problem to another person, it's largely guaranteed that I am information gathering to form a solution. I'm telling that person because I believe for whatever reason that their insight will help me to solve my issue. If someone was to respond the way they're implying is the correct, empathic neurotypical response - "wow that's bad, I'm glad you shared that with me, have a hug," that does me absolutely no good whatsoever. If they respond with A) they understand the problem B) they offer constructive advice about how to resolve said problem and C) they offer their assistance to do so, that to me is much better than a "connection."
I'm probably completely missing the boat ...

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Astro77
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27 Aug 2015, 2:50 am

C2V wrote:

I agree with you, but I think you're talking about compassion rather than sympathy or empathy.

dianthus
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27 Aug 2015, 5:01 pm

The way I look at it, sympathy is something you feel. Empathy is something you do.

Adamantium
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27 Aug 2015, 9:37 pm

elkclan wrote:

I don't want to be too dismissive here, but I think it's rather illustrative that a big part of the discussion here is about the definition and etymology of sympathy and empathy rather than what Dr Brown was trying to say about empathy. I agree that sympathy has its place and it's not a BAD thing. It IS distancing though if you think about it from another perspective - when you feel sympathy but don't display empathy you're not sharing the experience and you're generally quite happy you're not in that place. I learned a lot from that video and I really check myself on the 'at leasting' of people now. I see it now as a way of minimising someone's pain and not respecting their emotion - not really hearing them. It was a habit of mine because my mother did it to me all the time (still does!! !). There's a time to count your blessings, but sometimes there's a time to acknowledge your feelings.

Fine to establish what she wants to say about empathy, but to do it by contrasting empathy with a false, straw-man version of sympathy is simply wrong. I have no sympathy for that approach. It is disrespectful to the rich history of language and meaning in the English language.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sympathy

Quote:

Sympathy (from the Greek words syn "together" and pathos "feeling" which means "fellow-feeling") is the perception, understanding, and reaction to the distress or need of another human being. This empathic concern is driven by a switch in viewpoint, from a personal perspective to the perspective of another group or individual who is in need. Empathy and sympathy are often used interchangeably. Sympathy is a feeling, but the two terms have distinct origins and meanings. Merriam Webster defines empathy as "the feeling that you understand and share another person's experiences and emotions : the ability to share someone else's feelings." Their definition of sympathy is "the feeling that you care about and are sorry about someone else's trouble, grief, misfortune, etc. : a feeling of support for something : a state in which different people share the same interests, opinions, goals, etc." See professor Paul Bloom on empathy

http://www.bostonreview.net/forum/paul- ... st-empathy

Quote:

The word “empathy” is used in many ways, but here I am adopting its most common meaning, which corresponds to what eighteenth-century philosophers such as Adam Smith called “sympathy.” It refers to the process of experiencing the world as others do, or at least as you think they do. To empathize with someone is to put yourself in her shoes, to feel her pain.

The definition of sympathy as merely "Feeling sorry for someone" is an impoverishment of the language. To choose to ignore the more subtle connotations of usage of both sympathy and empathy and promote this crude dichotomy of words whose meanings are subtly intertwined is to do violence to meaning and communication.

I do not mean this simplistic thing when I use the word sympathy and I know that it is not used this way by many others. To insist that it means only the "least common denominator" of it's definitions is to engage the language of others without empathy. I am not in sympathy with this position. It is a barbarian's approach to language.

Earthling
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27 Aug 2015, 11:10 pm

Very informative video. Thanks for sharing!

I find accepting other people's perspectives as their truths the most difficult to do, because most of the time I see alternatives to their situation which seem "better" to me.
I find it very hard to not try to "fix things" because from my perspective it seems that their misery is a waste of energy.
I ignore people's present feelings in favor of doing that, yet I'm aware of the fact that I'm failing to make a connection... and I hate that. :cry:
My way of showing that I care is by trying to fix (= change) the other person, which in turn is invalidating their feelings.
I can't help it, but I hope I can get over this one day. :cry:

eggheadjr
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28 Aug 2015, 1:42 pm

Sympathy --> you care.

Empathy --> you get how they feel without them having to say a word.

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Earthling
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28 Aug 2015, 5:45 pm

eggheadjr wrote:

Empathy --> you get how they feel without them having to say a word.

I guess my bad eyes might be a contributing factor in not being able to feel empathy...
Acoording to an online test my ability to read faces is average however most of the time I'm unable to see my conversation partner's face properly.
Dunno about body language, I can tell from posture if someone is sad or happy or angry etc...

One much more interesting factor is that I somehow don't trust that people are actually feeling things according to what I can read because I
-Have the somewhat illogical postulate that their mind is not attached to their body or they are autistic and they are making weird movements as a way of stimming that have nothing to do with directly expressing complex feelings.
It's often happened that I did stim (like start repeating words) and NTs would ask me what the matter was. Nothing was the matter, lol.
OR
-Assume they are using their body as a tool to intentionally screw me over, to manipulate my and other people's behavior. Cry to get their way, get angry for the sole purpose of getting attention etc...
Cute baby-like things look as if they couldn't do any harm, simultaneously creating the need in me to care for them... because they seem so helpless; or so it SEEMS! Can't be sure. :twisted:

I'm kinda paranoid about this I suppose.
OTHER TIMES
-I just don't care, but that can happen to even the most compassionate NTs.

Anyone thinking similar things? Pls let me know if I'm alone with this.

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28 Aug 2015, 8:08 pm

Adamantium wrote:

gamerdad wrote:

I think the portrayal of empathy is accurate, but the portrayal of sympathy seems overly dismissive to me. Everything here portrays sympathy as complete superficial, which I don't think is accurate. One can care deeply about someone and be sincerely concerned for their feelings without feeling those feelings themselves.

I agree but think you have understated it. The portrayal of sympathy is wrong.

If you google "sympathy" you'll get two definitions:
1. "feelings of pity and sorrow for someone else's misfortune. "they had great sympathy for the flood victims""
2. understanding between people; common feeling."the special sympathy between the two boys was obvious to all"

It's not shallow understanding between people, or distant understanding between people. The example isn't "the Special sympathy between the two boys obviously meant very little in the grand scheme of things"

The sympathetic nervous system was not so named because sympathy implies distancing!

"sympathy drives disconnection" is bull dung. Boos and hisses to Brene Brown for being dishonest to make a good soundbyte.

I see a good comment on Youtube by a person named Stephen Heron. That person gives the OED definition and goes into the roots.

They're talking about something I do see, but I'm not sure sympathy is the word for it. I'm not sure we have a word for it specifically...

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