Mobbing in the Workplace - a danger for us?

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B19
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06 Sep 2015, 6:46 pm

Thank you all for the responses posted to date on this thread - what painful yet illuminating reading on this normally side-lined topic.

I'm not ready yet to post replies to the responses, I want to think about this whole topic some more before doing so.

For any of us that have every experienced this, the memories can react some of the feelings that are encoded with the events of the past, and if you are a responder who is experiencing this so painfully that it is temporarily unmanageable, take great care of yourself (ie rest, go to bed, sleep if you can) and, when ready, talk with others who are safe and whom you know will understand. It may be an opportunity to start a healing process that was stalled in the past. There is such tremendous pain from this that people have suffered.



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06 Sep 2015, 7:43 pm

B19 wrote:
I'm not ready yet to post replies to the responses, I want to think about this whole topic some more before doing so.


Somewhat OT, but this is one aspect of WP that I truly enjoy and appreciate. So much of our interaction with the outside world is forced to be done in real time which is sometimes just not going to happen.


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B19
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06 Sep 2015, 7:55 pm

In the meantime, a link that sheds some light into the dark phenomenon and who the targets are:


http://www.researchgate.net/publication/228079779



B19
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06 Sep 2015, 11:09 pm

Thank you Adamantium for the link you posted on the previous page. It's another good contribution to this discussion.

This passage gave me a lot of food for thought:

One person who has paid attention is Purdue psychologist Kipling Williams. In his book, Ostracism: The Power of Silence (The Guilford Press, 2001), Williams suggests that shunning and ostracism are particularly prevalent in the workplace when a worker has reported wrongdoing, because it is more difficult to prove retaliation when the aggressive act is a non-act. Yet the power of that non-action to wound a worker is profound, as Williams’ research has shown.


As Professor Tony Attwood and others (numerous others) have noted, persons with Aspergers are (for the vast majority) geared primarily to truth, not social convention of conformity. I would add to that: for some reason many are born with this innate moral compass, which does not spring from developmental learning. From whence does that come - it's a mystery. Later in the link, he states on a number of occasions that 99% of whistleblowers experience mobbing. That is a huge percentage for a social scientist to identify. It chills my blood to read it.

What then are the percentages of the mobbed who commit or attempt to commit suicide after mobbing? I haven't yet found nor looked for data on this. My own intuition - and experience - suggests to me that the true rate would be very high, relative to most other kinds of trauma (not all kinds - kidnap and torture would be worse).

The other thing that really bothers me this afternoon - it is about 4pm here - is why is this phenomenon left so much out of the professional and layperson's psychological, sociological, ergonomical, health and safety narratives and discourses. There are a few lonely voices like this professor whom I have quoted. But generally, there seems to be this commitment to silence - and I don't think for a moment that it is an accidental silence.
It is like the contrived silence around sexual abuse in the 1950s.



B19
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06 Sep 2015, 11:24 pm

And another resource piece - this one has a particularly good section on the PHASES of mobbing in the workplace - it really gelled with my own experience, those things happened in that sequence - he is more or less describing what I endured too. And no doubt many who venture into this thread..


http://www.mobbingportal.com/LeymannV%26V1990(3).pdf



trayder
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06 Sep 2015, 11:33 pm

B19 wrote:
Thank you Adamantium for the link you posted on the previous page. It's another good contribution to this discussion.

This passage gave me a lot of food for thought:

One person who has paid attention is Purdue psychologist Kipling Williams. In his book, Ostracism: The Power of Silence (The Guilford Press, 2001), Williams suggests that shunning and ostracism are particularly prevalent in the workplace when a worker has reported wrongdoing, because it is more difficult to prove retaliation when the aggressive act is a non-act. Yet the power of that non-action to wound a worker is profound, as Williams’ research has shown.


As Professor Tony Attwood and others (numerous others) have noted, persons with Aspergers are (for the vast majority) geared primarily to truth, not social convention of conformity. I would add to that: for some reason many are born with this innate moral compass, which does not spring from developmental learning. From whence does that come - it's a mystery. Later in the link, he states on a number of occasions that 99% of whistleblowers experience mobbing. That is a huge percentage for a social scientist to identify. It chills my blood to read it.

What then are the percentages of the mobbed who commit or attempt to commit suicide after mobbing? I haven't yet found nor looked for data on this. My own intuition - and experience - suggests to me that the true rate would be very high, relative to most other kinds of trauma (not all kinds - kidnap and torture would be worse).

The other thing that really bothers me this afternoon - it is about 4pm here - is why is this phenomenon left so much out of the professional and layperson's psychological, sociological, ergonomical, health and safety narratives and discourses. There are a few lonely voices like this professor whom I have quoted. But generally, there seems to be this commitment to silence - and I don't think for a moment that it is an accidental silence.
It is like the contrived silence around sexual abuse in the 1950s.


Contrived to the extent that it is a necessary evil as far as the system of social economy we live under requires. When commercial necessity comes up against socialised functions, the latter invariably has to give way.

The silent treatment was pretty much what I got in my last legal job. Many of the workplace rules in New Zealand are pretty much ornamental. I knew nothing about my cognitive issues then...but I was married to an occupational therapist at the time who did not pick up on them as well, especially when I was experiencing the mobbing at work. Doesnt say much for the therapies.



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06 Sep 2015, 11:44 pm

Thank you for that input (made another shiver run down my spine). I agree with you about the protections in New Zealand law - we have a plethora of statutes, commissions and guidelines now on all sorts of workplace mental violence, (for example workplace ageism and the lip service paid to equal pay for equal work but sustained discrimination against even professional women in that area). These protections though extensive are exactly as you say: largely ornamental. They provide employment for others, not protection to the mobbing targets. These commissions, institutions, government departments etc to a large extent exist to provide a service to themselves (this is basically true of any institution, there is always a self-serving element, even in charities. Only the size of their derived benefit varies across institutional settings and bodies).

Are you a New Zealand person? Did your experience take place here? If so, could you perhaps PM me and tell me which city? Auckland and Wellington are probably where mobbing is more frequent and claims more victims..



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07 Sep 2015, 12:28 am

B19 wrote:
Later in the link, he states on a number of occasions that 99% of whistleblowers experience mobbing.


What I experience in my job is not mobbing...it's field sales, so it's really not possible for people to gang up on each other. The problem is more that the job is very isolating by nature, and most of our contact with the company comes through one supervisor, who can single-handedly make or break the work environment (usually, break).

But things definitely took a turn for the worse for me earlier this year, after I spoke up about a safety issue...which to my disgust, they were already well aware of it (why weren't WE told? and why wasn't anything being done about it?) so apparently I wasn't the first person who spoke up about it. However I'm probably the only person who spoke up as strongly as I did, and essentially refused to use this unstable fixture that could have injured someone.

My supervisor had a very blasé attitude about it, and did not take me seriously. I had to go over his head to his manager to make myself heard. Since then, of course, things have sucked ass. So much has happened, that I keep forgetting this is what really set things off to begin with.



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07 Sep 2015, 12:37 am

dianthus wrote:
My supervisor had a very blasé attitude about it, and did not take me seriously. I had to go over his head to his manager to make myself heard. Since then, of course, things have sucked ass. So much has happened, that I keep forgetting this is what really set things off to begin with.

Yeah, the hierarchy gets majorly chafed when the chain of command is broken, especially when it's for the right reasons.



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07 Sep 2015, 1:01 am

You know with hyenas, how there's always a lone male everyone picks on?

A person with an ASD is that lone individual in a group environment.

It's the story of my entire existence around groups of people.

Expect it.



trayder
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07 Sep 2015, 1:16 am

Dillogic wrote:
You know with hyenas, how there's always a lone male everyone picks on?

A person with an ASD is that lone individual in a group environment.

It's the story of my entire existence around groups of people.

Expect it.


Hyenas have an excuse. They are driven by instinct and are basically on auto pilot. Humans are conscious and self aware.



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07 Sep 2015, 2:31 am

B19 wrote:
I was very moved as I read this article on workplace mobbing:

http://www.kwesthues.com/ohs-canada.htm


"The impulse to gang up, to join with others against what is perceived to be a common threat, lies deep in human nature."
http://www.kwesthues.com/ohs-canada.htm

This is a neurotypical disease incorporating a base mindset derived from the primitive "reptilian" brain...
It is part of the mob-mentality/tribalism to which so many NTs are susceptible...
You would be hard pressed to find those on the spectrum behaving in this way...
To the contrary, autistic individuals seem to have a genetically inspired aversion to bullying/mobbing...

Bad bad neurotypicals... :mrgreen:



B19
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07 Sep 2015, 2:50 am

Lehman appears to be the most advanced researcher on mobbing, its context, features and consequences.

I searched for suicide percentages of mobbed people and his was the only one I could find, on the Wikipedia "mobbing' page:

"In mobbing targets with PTSD, Leymann notes that the "mental effects were fully comparable with PTSD from war or prison camp experiences. Some patients may develop alcoholism or other substance abuse disorders. Family relationships routinely suffer. Some targets may even develop brief psychotic episodes, generally with paranoid symptoms. Leymann estimated that 15% of suicides in Sweden could be directly attributed to workplace mobbing.[5]"


15% is a shocking, alarming estimate. (It may be higher in New Zealand, as we seem to be one of the most efficient amongst the OECD countries in driving our citizens to suicide, as does the USA). I suspect both are more efficient at doing that than Sweden. So maybe the rate is even something like 20% of all suicides here.
The thing is: unlike other kinds of suicides, (gruesomely reported as due to mental illness, domestic violence, post-war trauma for example) the causes of mobbed-suicides are the ones that people never hear about, never read about, coroners don't report the true causes to the public, the police fail to investigate - you get the picture, I'm sure: the institutional level of denial is almost 100%.

I began this thread with the title: Mobbing in the Workplace - A Danger For Us?
Having read today all the research material I could find, my answer is an unequivocal YES. However I don't want people to panic over this. Some kinds of organisations have been identified as far more likely to mob than others - government departments for example - and forewarned, armed with knowledge, no longer naive, these are all part of a self-education process we can undergo. In circumstances like these - I LOVE the internet and the ways it can empower people.

To those of us here who survived mobbing, including the member who chose to message me privately rather than here - you are all brilliant survivors, I want to acknowledge your courage, resilience, souls and hearts. They wanted to destroy you. You survived them because you were a far better human being than they are, or were or ever could become. That's why they hated you in the first place.

I think of two sayings re the themes in this thread:
1) "Hell is other people" - Jean-Paul Sartre
2)
"If the world hates you, you know that it has hated Me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you.…" Christ's teaching reported by John in the Gospel of John, 15:18 New Testament



Last edited by B19 on 07 Sep 2015, 2:56 am, edited 2 times in total.

trayder
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07 Sep 2015, 2:52 am

Pepe wrote:
B19 wrote:
I was very moved as I read this article on workplace mobbing:

http://www.kwesthues.com/ohs-canada.htm


"The impulse to gang up, to join with others against what is perceived to be a common threat, lies deep in human nature."
http://www.kwesthues.com/ohs-canada.htm

This is a neurotypical disease incorporating a base mindset derived from the primitive "reptilian" brain...
It is part of the mob-mentality/tribalism to which so many NTs are susceptible...
You would be hard pressed to find those on the spectrum behaving in this way...
To the contrary, autistic individuals seem to have a genetically inspired aversion to bullying/mobbing...

Bad bad neurotypicals... :mrgreen:


If as you say, the reptilian brain is more pronounced in NTs, then clearly this is a function of evolution. Obviously this does not make our lives any easier but then again, anger is rather pointless, a little like scolding a child for not budgeting the family spending.



trayder
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07 Sep 2015, 3:01 am

B19

I suspect that these skewed patterns are more a function of our skewed social relations than some predisposition to be nasty or malevolent. In addition, there is the other issue of consciousness and where it is in the spectrum between subjective instinct driven behaviour and pure logic.

Admittedly this gives little comfort when dealing with these behaviours but alerts us to the fact that we are dealing with a particular state of being. These group behaviours are curious to say the least in a species that is supposedly self aware.



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07 Sep 2015, 3:03 am

trayder wrote:
Hyenas have an excuse. They are driven by instinct and are basically on auto pilot. Humans are conscious and self aware.


We still have that whole hundreds of thousands of years of group and social dynamics in our evolutionary path, though.

The weak are shunned, and people won't even know why they do it.

The odd person will want to care for the weak, but if the weak are slowing the group, then...there we are. Since we don't experience those events as much (based on survival), the same behavior crosses over into our current day social dynamics. Hence, group bullying at school and work for all the same reasons.