Aspie and NT communication patterns

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Isn´t that what we are already doing - in a more modest scale? I have seen people look baffeled and a little hurt, when I can´t remember, what they told me about their sisters boyfriends cousins boy two moths ago.

Yep.....classic small-talk!

Strenuous, but less so than the african way?

Really interesting jbw, thanks for posting this.

These are definitely true of me.

I am not so good at having deep knowledge of an interest though, I think because I have memory problems and I just don't retain information very well.

I also have this problem with small talk because I can't remember all those little details of a person's life that people usually ask each other about. I might have a vague recollection, a relative was in the hospital, they had car trouble, something something, and I just hesitate to offend them by showing how little I remember about it. Not to mention, sometimes I'm not even sure who the person is that I'm talking to.

I'm curious too, NurseAngela, about why some people don't choose to learn a little about a lot of things, in addition to their interests. Still, we need some people in the world who are hyperfocused in very technical areas, as they take serious dedication. As for not answering questions, I get that a lot, from all kinds of people, mostly busy people though.

JBW, very interesting thread. I actually know a lot of detail-oriented people, and there seem to be different ways of being detail-oriented. Some go for technical or precise details; others go for chronological details in the stories they tell; others like emotional details. I like details when they bring a deeper understanding, but not if I don't appreciate the basics first, and not if they don't relate to the point of the story. Do you know what I mean?

Also JBW, about verbal vs. nonverbal, I think that depends on your learning style. I find that writing allows for more time to think things through, where verbally, you tend to get more of my gut reaction, which isn't always as clear or thoughtful. It's often my first thought or impression.

As for small talk, I try and get to a point where I can learn someone's likes and dislikes and go from there. I do comment on the weather/our surroundings to break the ice with someone new though. Do you consider asking about someone's day to be small talk? Depending on what they say, it can lead to helping someone, or learning about how someone feels, and getting to know them better as people. That stuff gets pretty deep once people feel comfortable sharing, if that happens.

In my experience, many organisations and people seem to be in busyness rather than in business. As a result employee engagement statistics are at an all time low, and many people don't think that the job they are tasked with creates any real value for society.


I think I understand. On the one hand there is detail-oriented in the sense of getting side-tracked by one particular issue that may not be at the centre of the problem at hand, and on the other hand there is detail-oriented in the sense of validating that (a) there is a shared understanding of the problem that needs to be solved and (b) that the problem is within the scope of applicability of the solutions that are being considered.

It is often claimed that "Aspies are detail-oriented and don't see the bigger picture". This generic observation is untrue in my experience, and it is one of the negative stereotypes that can affect Aspies at work. The incorrect and implicit assumption is that the bigger or biggest picture is always the social [hierarchy] context.

Yes, I agree about the untrue/misunderstood stereotype and the busy, unhappy people. Yes, you understand regarding details. I would add the element of details in the stories people tell, as that's really, really important to a lot of people. Personally, my stories are more detailed if I find them more interesting and think others are likely to agree. I'm wary though because I know that people might not interrupt a story, even if they're bored out of their minds. Maybe I should say, "Feel free to interrupt if it's not what you were looking for," now and then.

So true...so true...and assuming that the people at the top of the hierarchy have the broadest perspective.

I had something else happen over at the other Aspie forum. They were all saying that they wanted friends and didn't know how to get them. When I explained what a friendship took, they said that they still wanted to do their personal "obsession" projects and they would call their friends of they wanted to talk. In other words, "don't call us we will call you". To me that sounded like they wanted someone at their beckoned call. That's not what friendship is. One woman Aspie finally said she saw how self - centered that was, but wasn't going to change. Friendships don't go anywhere unless you show interest in someone and have some communication that's more than once a year or whatever. Friendships take time. And they didn't want to do anything with anyone unless it was something they wanted to do or talk about anything that wasn't within their scope of interest. What happens if they were to do or talk about something that doesn't interest them - does their head explode? It was all that they could get out of a friendship - no giving. That doesn't work with NT's. I just don't get that.

Friendships between Aspies work by Aspie rules, which are different from neurotypical friendship rules. A friendship may be entirely online and communication asynchronous. Even in the physical realm a friendship may focus entirely on shared special interests. The following pictures illustrate two forms of Aspie friendships that are difficult to understand and appreciate from the outside:



There is zero room for small talk in this scenario, and yet both Aspies can be extremely happy and value the friendship.



A near perfect overlap in interests is very rare, but I've experienced something close to it once. Again small talk only plays a minimal role. There are much more important things to talk about.

I concede that Aspie - NT friendships are a real challenge. In my experience it is mandatory that the NT has a shared special interest, usually in the realm of professional expertise, otherwise the basis for friendship is limited.

That doesn't tell me why they can't do someone else's interest with them and what happens? Do they just get bored, or do they have a meltdown? Aspies learn new things all the time. How do they know they won't enjoy another person's interest? Do they just dismiss even trying because it's not in their interests?

I find topics such as team sports extremely boring. Social hierarchies are also of no interest, which means I don't have a clue about most of the small talk topics that people use. Talking about the weather is fine, because sailing is part of my interests. Many people perceive my interests as "academic".

Am happy to talk about and learn more about nearly all scientific topics. I even find small talk interesting from an academic perspective. But as indicated above, regarding other topics I am very direct when someone asks whether I saw the latest game of xyz – my answer is that I have no clue, and I'm not interested.

In my case it seems to be more of an ADD thing, although in this case I certainly am not speaking for all aspies. If someone were to talk to me about something I have no interest in like fashion or sports then it would be hard for me to focus on it and stay involved. My mind will keep trying to pay attention to other things like my special interest, something that's been on my mind lately, or something in the environment. I can pay attention if I need to, but it's really mentally draining and I can't do it for very long. This is not to say that I don't try, it's just hard and sometimes it looks like I'm not trying even when I am.

I think that it's partly because we absolutely love the things that we love and we assume that you love what you love with equal intensity. I feel like I'm being fake if I try and participate in something that I hate.

It seems to me that NT women want to socialise by doing things that I despise, like going to musicals. I'd rather be shot that have to suffer bad music. I don't need friendship enough to put myself through that kind of sensory pain. So other women stop inviting me to the kind of horrible things that they like and assume that I don't want to go because I don't like them as people. That's not true it's just that their interests are booooring. Why do people like soap operas for instance?

It seems to me that NTs will do something that they don't really enjoy just for company. Part of being an aspie is having stronger reactions to sensory things that other people do. I can't force myself to do things I don't enjoy. I will not go and see that terrible band with you. I like you, I just hate what you want to do.

It makes me feel lonely because I have no one to share my love of post punk and melodic heavy metal with when all the boring women want to go and see Adele or Beyonce... shudder.

I have found other spectrumy women. We do actually only get in touch with each other for specific reasons. We don't text or phone each other regularly. What we do is send a text once in a while and say, "hey do you want to go to a museum or grab a coffee or go for a walk?" We do only arrange to see each other and talk once in a while. I don't understand what NTs have to talk about when they see each other and text each other every other day.

NurseAngela, have you ever had a friendship, or perhaps an association you didn't label as friendship, based solely on interests? I've had these, and they're a lot of fun for their own sake. The only problem arises when I want to get to know some of those people on another level. It's like I'm breaking the ice all over again, and they don't always respond with much more than superficial details about their lives. I'm totally cool with this when it happens online. I feel sad sometimes when it happens with multiple people in an interest-based, in-person group, like a book club or a tabletop RPG though.

Also, NurseAngela, haven't you ever struggled with conflicting values or priorities in your life? It sounds like that's part of what might be happening to the woman you mentioned. Maybe she'll make slow changes to spend more time on finding and nurturing friendships. Maybe she's tried that and given up for reasons she didn't share with you. Maybe she'll come to believe that her loneliness (if that is indeed what she's feeling) as partially the result of her own choice not to connect emotionally. Maybe she'll continue in conflict/frustration until something happens that leads her to change. Regardless, I get the sense that you might be judging her. If so, why? She's human like everyone else.