ABA and other intensive therapies
03 Mar 2017, 1:37 pm
ASPartOfMe wrote:
ScottieKarate wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
Going to take a guess with the babies problem. It could be sensory sensitivities, he might be reacting to thier smells or how noisy they can be. Misbehaviors by Autistic people are very often mistaken for attention seeking when it is often sensory overload or frustration trying to communicate, poor ability to handle change or some combination of the above. Many of us autistic adults get accused of bieng attention seekers.
That he is allowed to say no is very good, the accusation of attention seeking without the appearent consideration of the other possibilities mentioned above shows a lack of knowledge of current understanding of causes of Autistic behavoir.
That he is allowed to say no is very good, the accusation of attention seeking without the appearent consideration of the other possibilities mentioned above shows a lack of knowledge of current understanding of causes of Autistic behavoir.
Thanks for the reply! You might be right. My first thought was that he doesn't like the crying. They did a behavioral analysis and that's what they came up with, so we are going to treat it as an attention thing and see if he makes progress. They think he likes th e attention, even the scolding, so they don't scold him when he does it. They just ignore it and don't give him attention. So, I get some funny looks when I'm in public and he attacks a baby and I don't scold him for it.
The school district is supposedly doing their own analysis as well. We will see what they come up with.
I think there is a very good chance people doing the analysis are not autistic. It is somewhat equivalent to white people making all of the decisions for an all black school. No matter how good the intentions are or how nice the white admistrators are avoidable mistakes will be made. In the example of the white administrators at a minority school while economic, social, and cultural backgrounds would be different at least the brain wiring would still be typical. These days there are usually black people having input in racial policies, LBGTQ people having input in decisions made for LBGTQ people, I believe this is pretty much true for physical disability decisions, this usually is not the case for autistics.
That's a solid point. They do tend to see things only through their professional glasses.
03 Mar 2017, 1:40 pm
somanyspoons wrote:
What I'm hearing in the way you speak about his program, OP, is that it's an OK program for him, but it's unbalanced.
It's OK to spend part of the day learning this stuff. You seem confident that they aren't using the more abusive aspects of ABA. But they aren't encouraging his creativity. They aren't discovering ways in which he is comfortable connecting with other people. They aren't working on bringing your son's individual gifts to the surface. They are training him to be their kind of normal.
There's a certain amount of this that's fine. We all have to wash our hands after we use the bathroom. And it is rather handy to know when you are seeing an "F" and when you are seeing an "A." But that's not all that life is about. I hear you saying that you are worried that your son's program is unbalanced, and I have to agree, based on the little information we have here.
It's OK to spend part of the day learning this stuff. You seem confident that they aren't using the more abusive aspects of ABA. But they aren't encouraging his creativity. They aren't discovering ways in which he is comfortable connecting with other people. They aren't working on bringing your son's individual gifts to the surface. They are training him to be their kind of normal.
There's a certain amount of this that's fine. We all have to wash our hands after we use the bathroom. And it is rather handy to know when you are seeing an "F" and when you are seeing an "A." But that's not all that life is about. I hear you saying that you are worried that your son's program is unbalanced, and I have to agree, based on the little information we have here.
I certainly agree, but there aren't really any alternatives available that would hit that balance. So, we try the best we can to do that kind of thing in the home.
03 Mar 2017, 2:46 pm
ScottieKarate wrote:
Thanks for all of your thoughts. You've given me a lot to think about.
He also stims a lot. Not that it is harmful, but it prevents him from learning and participating in other activities. They don't necessarily discourage stimming, but they teach him to get up and run and take breaks when he needs them, so when he has to sit and concentrate, he's more able to do so.
I ask him every single day how is day was. He hasn't yet answered. I can ask him yes or no questions, but not sure how truthful his answers are. "Did you have fun today, yes or no?" He usually answers yes. "Do you like Sholto (today's therapist)?" "Yes."
Some highlights of the things he has learned so far:
-self-advocacy - yes or no. It's a big deal. If he doesn't want to do something, he can say no, and as of right now, they'll honor the no every time. Now, there is some scripting here. He used to scream "nooooooooooo". Now he'll say "I don't want that." When he screams, they say "you can also say 'I dont wan't that'."
-pretend play (this is totally scripted. they play with a train track and he has to push the train around the track and make it stop, etc. If left alone, he would just roll the train across his stomach and watch the wheels. The hope here, again, is that he starts to enjoy playing with the train the right way, and will play with friends that way)
The thing I wrestle with, is that I don't to have him spend his whole day not being himself. I want him to be creative and comfortable and let him explore things his own way. That being said, I really have no idea how to teach him to acquire skills. I try, I'm just quite unsuccessful at it. Every day he comes home with something new that they've taught him to do, or a new response to a situation. That part is kind of cool, but not sure how essential it is.
He also stims a lot. Not that it is harmful, but it prevents him from learning and participating in other activities. They don't necessarily discourage stimming, but they teach him to get up and run and take breaks when he needs them, so when he has to sit and concentrate, he's more able to do so.
I ask him every single day how is day was. He hasn't yet answered. I can ask him yes or no questions, but not sure how truthful his answers are. "Did you have fun today, yes or no?" He usually answers yes. "Do you like Sholto (today's therapist)?" "Yes."
Some highlights of the things he has learned so far:
-self-advocacy - yes or no. It's a big deal. If he doesn't want to do something, he can say no, and as of right now, they'll honor the no every time. Now, there is some scripting here. He used to scream "nooooooooooo". Now he'll say "I don't want that." When he screams, they say "you can also say 'I dont wan't that'."
-pretend play (this is totally scripted. they play with a train track and he has to push the train around the track and make it stop, etc. If left alone, he would just roll the train across his stomach and watch the wheels. The hope here, again, is that he starts to enjoy playing with the train the right way, and will play with friends that way)
The thing I wrestle with, is that I don't to have him spend his whole day not being himself. I want him to be creative and comfortable and let him explore things his own way. That being said, I really have no idea how to teach him to acquire skills. I try, I'm just quite unsuccessful at it. Every day he comes home with something new that they've taught him to do, or a new response to a situation. That part is kind of cool, but not sure how essential it is.
You seem intelligent and well informed about your son and his schooling and therapies. I think it's great you are willing to listen to what Aspies's are saying, but at the end of the day, you must really go with what works best for you and your son. If you are seeing good results and you have an overall great feeling about this course of action and you are confident in the people working with your child, then stay the course. It seems like there might be a few things you don't like as well or see the value in. Perhaps you could approach the person in charge and talk about these issues. They can ease your mind or maybe you can rework them into something better.
Now for some of my personal opinions.
You said that they are teaching him to play with the train the "right way". To me this is all kinds of bullsh*t. How is there ever a "right way" to play? My child plays in his own way and I can see that it makes him intensely happy. He used to line up cars. He found joy in that. But if I forced him to drive the cars, would he ever find true joy in it? Maybe after some time he would forget the thing that made him truly happy and he wouldn't have that anymore. We all do our own thing in our downtime. I understand how playing with trains the right way might help him get along with his peers....but if your kid is an Aspie, then your kid is an Aspie, right? I mean, he's weird, or a little difficult to socialize, or whatever. Don't make him fake. I say this with good intentions and not in some accusing way. I don't know the inns and outs of your life.
I know that people say stimming is distracting and maybe it is in some cases, but for me, I am focused when I am stimming. I am not zoned out. I am intensely focused on one thing.
As far as scripted speech I sometimes find this helpful and it will probably develop into his own expression of the same sentiment. I have personally used this with my son and myself. (No one taught me to do this, I just noticed that it was helpful). One example is that I used to laugh when someone got hurt. The action was, and still is, very funny to me. Of course that is not socially acceptable and my family thought I was a big a$$hole for doing it. I only laughed or thought it was funny when it was clear the problem was minor. Anyways, I trained myself and my son to say first, "Are you okay?" The way we say it is totally scripted and sounds robotic. Maybe it always will. But we've quit laughing at it altogether, which is probably for the best.
I wonder if there are times when you can take long breaks from this therapy and see what happens. Does your child regress? Is he happier? Does he continue using what he learned? It might be nice and relaxing to just be out of the spotlight for a bit. I know I find it extremely stressful to always have professionals judging and assessing my kid. I just want to stop for a while.
I hope you figure out a course of action that you are good with. Soon, your son will be able to give more input maybe.
