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CrisChalcedony
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19 Nov 2021, 12:02 pm

I do this all the time, and no amount of therapy ever helped. Finally found a behavior skills coach who explained my outsized reactions were RSD--Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria, which is mostly associated with ADHD but shows up a lot in autists and in NTs with a history of trauma as well. Basically my brain misreads interactions as rejection or hostility when they are not, and even when they are it produces an out-of-proportion response to the situation. My understanding is that there's no way to "cure" this and traditional kinds of therapy don't help anyone who suffers this, autistic or otherwise, but as others in the thread have stated, carefully requesting more information about the interaction can help clarify and put things in context. Or make it worse, depending on how the other person reacts.



Fnord
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19 Nov 2021, 12:23 pm

SharonB wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Maybe it's my flat affect, or maybe it is the fact-based replies or honest opinions, but people whom I think are NTs suddenly become furious with me, asking me "What do you mean by that?" or accusing me of "covert bullying".  This happens most especially when my opinions turn out to be correct.
As another data point, I am very expressive (minimal flat affect) and it still happens, although in my case I am shunned or disregarded rather than confronted (and when I am right, someone else gets credit). My therapist suggests I must solve two problems when working with NTs: the problem on hand and the problem of their ego. ---Who has time to do three times the work?
I have lost count of the number of times that people have told me to address their feelings first before offering solutions to their problems.  This does not work because (1) I am not an appropriately-trained and licensed mental-health professional, and (2) I am an appropriately-trained engineer and trouble-shooter.

I have asked employers if they would be willing to subsidize my tuition toward a Master's degree as a clinical psychologist, but they always say "No, we hired you to be an engineer".  When I ask why they want an engineer to perform the work of a clinical psychologist, they get all uptight and bothered by my "bad attitude".

Then they leave me alone (for a while).



Dear_one
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19 Nov 2021, 12:32 pm

^^ Apparently, staying aware of everyone's feelings is considered as basic as literacy. Training is ubiquitous, not only in psychology courses. However, it uses up too much brain to allow advanced engineering work. Perhaps your employer should provide an interface helper who can understand both yourself and your colleagues.



Fnord
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19 Nov 2021, 12:35 pm

Dear_one wrote:
^^ Apparently, staying aware of everyone's feelings is considered as basic as literacy. Training is ubiquitous, not only in psychology courses. However, it uses up too much brain to allow advanced engineering work. Perhaps your employer should provide an interface helper who can understand both yourself and your colleagues.
Her job title is "Departmental Manager's Assistant".



Dear_one
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19 Nov 2021, 12:40 pm

Fnord wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
^^ Apparently, staying aware of everyone's feelings is considered as basic as literacy. Training is ubiquitous, not only in psychology courses. However, it uses up too much brain to allow advanced engineering work. Perhaps your employer should provide an interface helper who can understand both yourself and your colleagues.
Her job title is "Departmental Manager's Assistant".


So, how are you still getting in trouble? Forgot to use the interface? "I'm sorry, I'll have to get my assistant to format that information to suit you."



Fnord
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19 Nov 2021, 12:43 pm

Dear_one wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
^^ Apparently, staying aware of everyone's feelings is considered as basic as literacy. Training is ubiquitous, not only in psychology courses. However, it uses up too much brain to allow advanced engineering work. Perhaps your employer should provide an interface helper who can understand both yourself and your colleagues.
Her job title is "Departmental Manager's Assistant".
So, how are you still getting in trouble? Forgot to use the interface? "I'm sorry, I'll have to get my assistant to format that information to suit you."
People who demand answers immediately without first doing their own research and going through proper channels.



SharonB
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19 Nov 2021, 3:19 pm

Fnord wrote:
I have asked employers if they would be willing to subsidize my tuition toward a Master's degree as a clinical psychologist, but they always say "No, we hired you to be an engineer".  When I ask why they want an engineer to perform the work of a clinical psychologist, they get all uptight and bothered by my "bad attitude".

Then they leave me alone (for a while).[/color]

ROTFLOL. :lol: My ability to do some people pleasing stands out in engineering. Although it's crappy for my esteem. You remind me of a director in Architecture in my former company. She scared me, but I was not offended. As I gained expertise she became less scary - not sure if that was on my part or hers. Probably both. I fanaticize all the time about just telling it how it is and not doing these dances. Then my esteem would be much better, but others around me would suffer. Mhaaa haw haw.



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19 Nov 2021, 4:30 pm

Fnord wrote:
SharonB wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Maybe it's my flat affect, or maybe it is the fact-based replies or honest opinions, but people whom I think are NTs suddenly become furious with me, asking me "What do you mean by that?" or accusing me of "covert bullying".  This happens most especially when my opinions turn out to be correct.
As another data point, I am very expressive (minimal flat affect) and it still happens, although in my case I am shunned or disregarded rather than confronted (and when I am right, someone else gets credit). My therapist suggests I must solve two problems when working with NTs: the problem on hand and the problem of their ego. ---Who has time to do three times the work?
I have lost count of the number of times that people have told me to address their feelings first before offering solutions to their problems.  This does not work because (1) I am not an appropriately-trained and licensed mental-health professional, and (2) I am an appropriately-trained engineer and trouble-shooter.

I have asked employers if they would be willing to subsidize my tuition toward a Master's degree as a clinical psychologist, but they always say "No, we hired you to be an engineer".  When I ask why they want an engineer to perform the work of a clinical psychologist, they get all uptight and bothered by my "bad attitude".

Then they leave me alone (for a while).
Trouble...
Shooter? That's indeed scary.

Do you troubleshoot your wife? Or romance is the proper job for the outpout of your emotion support skills?

No offense but your rigidity comes across as stubbornness rather than genuine hardship. As maybe it comes across to them. Which is why they probably get into a 'cut the crap' position and think this is childish and taken too far.

Though I struggle with sometimes input for emotional health and reassurance I don't find it that impossible except on demand or with strangers but it seems normal to do with strangers on a job, at least the ones i had. And I enjoy it with people i like and coworkers as i see it as a team. Gets hard with people who badmouth me though. I only do it because I believe it helps.


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20 Nov 2021, 3:20 pm

Jayo wrote:
I know it's often been said that Aspies lack the nonverbal fluency to tell if someone is being subtly hostile with them (like, micro-aggressions, veiled insults, petty put-downs or faint praise, etc.) which can get us into some unpleasant or embarrassing situations...but what about the reverse?? Has your experience been one of detecting some sort of hostility or contempt which wasn't really there?? Sort of like a false positive, rather than a false negative?

In hindsight, I think I've had this a few times... or it's remained ambiguous, i.e. I confronted a fake friend about indirect put-downs or less obvious mean-spirited behaviours... and he denied it, saying I was just being paranoid or that I'd misinterpreted things. On more than one occasion though, this former fake friend / housemate had narcissistic personality traits so it was clear that I was being gaslighted :evil: and that my feelings didn't matter.

But I can also recall a couple of times when I'd thought someone was being subtly hostile to me, and their response was something to the effect of "well...sigh...maybe I might come off as somewhat harsh at times, but...you're really not the easiest person to get along with." (and of course, intentions don't matter). :x :(

And there were at least a couple of others times where the perception of hostility was misplaced. I didn't abruptly confront them, I brought it up carefully - and then in hindsight realized it wasn't there.

You have to be REALLY careful in confronting someone with such accusations, especially for that "volatile" age group of young males around 17-24, because it could escalate into yelling and violence. Think of that stereotypical meme of the "Chad" who confronts anyone over perceived micro-insults, offending him or his woman, etc..

But I suppose that stems from a lifetime of hypervigilance, and dealing with fairly regular abuse - it's almost like we're waiting for "the other shoe to drop". 8O :(
Of course but that's more to do with ptsd psychosis than autism.


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