Whats bothering me lately...

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Well, we have 2 children that have never been vaccinated and they are neither sick all the time or dead, so you're presenting a totally false dichotomy:)
When our first child was tiny, I read several medical books on vaccination and the immune system and there's science arguing both ways. The human immune system is very complex and studying it opened my eyes to the fact that science knows very, very little about how it really works.

Also I found some dodgy-science on both sides of the pro- and anti- fence. For example, people quite frequently get the illnesses they've supposedly been vaccinated against, yet the doctors will not diagnose it, preferring to record a 'non-specific virus' or somesuch. Hence making vaccines look more effective than they really are.

And the big question is "Where's the money???". Big Pharma LOVES peddling drugs to ease our worries and never mind about the true health costs.

So in the end, caught between the decision to intervene or non-intervene in our childrens immune systems, we went with trusting to the millions of years of natural selection ahead of Big Pharma.

Parents have the right to choose, I have no idea why anyone other than a shareholder in a drug company thinks it should be compulsory. Makes sense for human survival - if there is a problem with a batch of vaccine at least not EVERYONE will get ill or die from it. Nature likes diversity - surely most here realise that




I totally agree. That is a load of nonsense and didn't influence our decision at all. There are a lot of very interesting articles on this at neurodiversity.com.



Well, maybe all those jabs you had previously have weakened your immune system? Like if you take heroin or smoke every day, when you stop you'll feel rotten. But it doesn't mean the heroin or tobacco was doing you any good.

Doctors have told me that we should all be immunized for "Herd Protection". Well, obviously the word 'Herd' is a red flag to someone with AS! I would argue that this is not protecting the herd at all, in the long run it is weakening it. Vaccinating does not strengthen our immune systems in a way that can be passed on genetically. We need the drugs all the time to provide immunity. In a future crisis - and who can say that that isn't inevitable - if the vaccines couldn't get through, those who've been immunized for generations will be more likely to get the serious illness. Thats evolution for you...

mm..flu dont kill people unless person is really low immune..it just feels terible(i curently have one )

Vaccinating does not strengthen our immune systems in a way that can be passed on genetically

And you know what will strengthen our immune systems in a way that can be passed on genetically? - natural selection and survival of the fittest ie. weaker members of society not living long enough to pass on their genes - high childhood mortality rates. Do we really want to return to that? (OK as long as it isnt MY children who die you say).

The reason that we have low levels of child mortality nowadays is due to the success of these vaccines and antibiotics. Without them we'd be back in the dark ages. No it isnt natural, but natural is not always best. And vaccination is a lot better than cure. Recent evidence has suggested that there is no link between vaccines and autism. The original research showing the MMR causes autism has been discredited, but it is still hanging around in the mind of sceptics.

I also hate parents who don't vaccinate their children. Vaccinations should be made mandatory, and if parents don't vaccinate their kids, than social services should take them away.

The consequences of vaccines are miniscule compared to the consequences of the diseases they are designed to prevent. Measles can result in encephalitis, which can fry the brain. Rubella can cause birth defects. Influenza, aside from making a person feel awful, can quickly turn into pneumonia, especially in the very young, the elderly and immunologically compromised.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I am a health professional and have seen devestating consequences for children who weren't vaccinated.

Re 'flu vaccine .... there seems to be confusion between a common cold and influenza. The flu vaccine protects from influenza, not the common cold.

Influenza is serious. The common cold is annoying, unless you're immuno-compromised.

I have vaccinated my 3 sons. My older 2 have Asperger's .... genetic ... nothing to do with vaccinations.

In Australia we had some epidemics of childhood diseases in the 90's because the vaccination rate fell dramatically. Most people stopped vaccinating out of neglect, not a conscious objection to vaccinations.

The government took measures to increase the rate of vaccinations .... and these diseases were then rarely seen.

Helen

Ding ding ding we have a winner for what do you ask? well for the stupidest post in this thread is all.

First of all if vaccinations were mandatory than parents would have to vaccinate their kids no choice about it
Also I've only had 3 vaccines in my life and my sister hasn't had any so suddenly the government should take us away from our parents over something as stupid as vaccines In addition I am very healthy never had very major illness except right after birth haven't been to the hospital since then the one time I remember having a long and serious illness in recent times was brought on by stress and therefore a weakened immune system.

We don't have a choice. Evolution is a natural law of the universe that (like gravity and our need for clean air) we can't opt out of. It's what made you as strong as you are today! Don't forget that not one of your thousands of direct ancestors ever died in childhood



Are you sure of that? There's evidence that improved mortality rates of the 20th century follow the HUGE improvements in general hygiene such as clean water, clean air and better diet. Until the latter half of the 19th century people had no concept of hygiene or germ transmitted disease as we do. Doctors didn't even wash their hands between operations.

I've heard of villages in Africa where Western charities donate (with much advertising press) vaccines and even laptops yet will do nothing to improve their diseased water supply.

There are those who believe that the 1918 flu epidemic was caused (or at least worsened) by poor quality vaccination programs. Go search Google on something like "vaccination scam diptheria" and maybe that just may cast an ounce of doubt on your certainties. Or for some fun, try "Jenner charlatan". Jenner was the 'inventor' of immunisation.

Fair enough, a lot of that stuff sounds like the rantings of cranks, but amidst that there is real evidence of damage done by vaccination gone wrong. There are recent cases of soldiers made (allegedly) ill by an anthrax vaccine. In 1850, if you thought disease was caused by germs, then YOU were the crank and derided by the doctors of the day. Look at Ignaz Semmelweis who really laid the foundation for modern health and hygiene but was persecuted by the medical establishment.

On the other hand you have the health industry which (to me) sounds equally cranky in their emotion-laden rantings about "protecting the herd". And, hey, it's not like the big medicine corps aren't frightened of buying research that proves their drugs are safe. Witness recent allegations of them covering up the reality of the increased suicide rates and devastating withdrawal effects of anti-depressants(which I can verify by experience).

It just isn't 100% clear cut either way.



Why do you have such an intense reaction? Most parents I know have vaccinated their children, but some don't. Either way, their level of child vaccination doesn't influence how much I like them at all. However, I would totally support a mandatory vaccination against ignorance and irrational hatred as these are far more dangerous to our species survival than any virus.

I'm glad someone brought this up.

I do think too many people tend to get so fixated on one small part of the issue to the exclusion of all the facts surrounding the greater issue.

Staying home when sick, simple washing of hands (plain water not all those antimicrobial soaps), can do a lot towards the stopping of the spreading of disease.

While some vaccines and the antibiotics are helping to keep some people alive.. there really are other equally important factors to consider.

I don't get shots, I have a religious exempention. I also have aspergers. I'm not sick from not getting shots.

I think that it is the parents choice weather of not their children get shots.

I agree that hygiene has played a huge role. There is nothing nicer than having a doctor use the same instruments that he just used for a necropsy for your whatever. I think that life span was significantly longer during the greek/roman period due to improved hygiene as well.

I agree that people are downplaying the possibly danger of influenza. It can be really nasty. When I was twelve, I had the flu, and it inflamed my appendix. Well, then my appendix got blocked up and I developed appendicitis. Because my parents figured my flu had just turned really nasty, they didn't take me to the doctor again immediately (I'd been to the doctor for the flu the day before the abdominal pain started). Well, then my appendix ruptured, and in the end it was a full week before I finally had surgery. By which point I had multiple abscesses in my abdomen as well as peritonitis. Because of a case of flu gone bad, I had to spend a month in the hospital. I'll take a flu shot any day over that experience.

Plus, when I had the chicken pox, I had a fever of 105, so that can be fairly bad as well.

Well, I understand opting out of flu shots. As long as it's not bird flu then there's generally nothing to worry about.

However, opting out of vaccines altogether because they hypothetically can cause someone to be autistic? That's kind of silly, especially since no scientific study has actually proved it. True, there was one cause where a vaccine aggravated a pre-existing condition that has some autistic-like traits. But such aggravation was probably inevitable anyways. But as far as vaccines directly causing autism goes, nothing has been proven.

I have a distrust of the government and of the pharmaceutical companies, but would be afraid not to vaccinate a child. Dying from polio or tetanus would be a horrible thing.