Are gay NTs more accepting of aspies?

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undefineable
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03 Dec 2008, 4:47 pm

nothingunusual wrote:
I'd tend to agree with both points here. Just because two groups are in a minority which may be discriminated against, it doesn't mean either will be sympathetic of each other circumstances. Especially if they're wildly different. For instance, a group of people with neurological differences and a group of people with sexual preferences outside the mainstream - I'm not seeing where the empathy is going to lie considering the two situations are very different.

No doubt someone will call me ignorant and claim homosexuality is a neurological difference, but I don't hold that opinion.


Well homosexual preference from childhood is reckoned to be based on a neurological difference, unless you're some1 like my parents who thinks we're really 'souls' & that the brain is only there 4 maths :P

The difference often (not always perhaps) seems to be that a gay person's brain has strong characteristics of the brain of a typical brain of their opposite gender. If it's true that auties have an 'extreme male brain' in some ways, then it'd make more sense for female aspies and lesbians to sympathise with each other, than 4 male aspies & gay men 2 get along_



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03 Dec 2008, 5:12 pm

FireFox wrote:
Are they?



My best friend is gay, but I really don't think it has any link to anything.


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03 Dec 2008, 5:14 pm

donhz wrote:
No, I don't see this at all. Homosexuals discriminate against all who don't agree with their lifestyle, especially Christians.


lol and what lifestyle would that be, could you tell us? I wasn't aware that homosexuality forced one to adopt a particular lifestyle?

(edit)

Sorry, that aside, to respond to the OP: I think that within certain bounds there are (in the UK at least) a group of sub-cultures which maintain an uneasy sort of brotherhood but it is only uneasy; human nature, as Callista said. Pick a bunch of Goths and a bunch of Furries (replace with subcultures of your choice) and, well, there'll probably be some overlap between the two; but generally you'll find someone or someones who look down on the others; all depending on time and circumstance, as well. So more likely? Yes, but only just.


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nothingunusual
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03 Dec 2008, 5:58 pm

undefineable wrote:
Well homosexual preference from childhood is reckoned to be based on a neurological difference, unless you're some1 like my parents who thinks we're really 'souls' & that the brain is only there 4 maths :P

The difference often (not always perhaps) seems to be that a gay person's brain has strong characteristics of the brain of a typical brain of their opposite gender. If it's true that auties have an 'extreme male brain' in some ways, then it'd make more sense for female aspies and lesbians to sympathise with each other, than 4 male aspies & gay men 2 get along_


My opinion isn't based on religous dogma just so you know. The fact that sex is serves one main purpose - Reproduction, is enough for me to see it as unnatural and disharmonious with nature. As unnatual as my own boarderline asexuality, for instance.

Based on your comment about Homosexual preference since childhood, I take it you don't believe children are asexual until they have matured physically?



donhz
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04 Dec 2008, 1:35 pm

DentArthurDent wrote:
What a bizarre thread. I don't see any correlation between homosexuality and increased tolerance

@ donhz; there are 'gay' christians and I am sure that like the rest of their community they get angry with fools who take the bible to be the literal words of god


The thing that interests me in the debate is that homosexuals used to be more classy in how they handled things. Now they have become as bad (or worse) than Christian Fundamentaists when it comes to twisting people's arms to get them to convert to the idea that homosexuality is somehow okay. If you don't accept homosexuality on their terms, it seems homosexuals are ready to burn you at the stake, in their own way.

But I agree... this is one bizarre thread. Must be an Aspie thing. :)



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04 Dec 2008, 4:21 pm

donhz wrote:
The thing that interests me in the debate is that homosexuals used to be more classy in how they handled things. Now they have become as bad (or worse) than Christian Fundamentaists when it comes to twisting people's arms to get them to convert to the idea that homosexuality is somehow okay. If you don't accept homosexuality on their terms, it seems homosexuals are ready to burn you at the stake, in their own way.

But I agree... this is one bizarre thread. Must be an Aspie thing. :)


Donhz, you keep considering "homosexuals" to be a bloc. They aren't. I suggest that you have issues with those groups of homosexuals who are particularly "in-yer-face" about it; you should not generalise their actions as being representative, or even vaguely connected, with the reality of homosexuality.


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neshamaruach
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04 Dec 2008, 5:35 pm

I don't know that gay men and women tend to be more accepting of difference--some are, some aren't. I always feel that minorities *should* be more tolerant of difference (growing up Jewish, my parents made sure I had *that* particular characteristic), but it isn't always the case.

That being said, I have always had really wonderful friendships with openly gay men. I feel very comfortable with my gay male friends, and can joke and talk about serious things, and don't feel a lot of awkwardness. When I see someone of a minority group being proudly and openly who they are, it puts me at ease. I don't worry so much about being misunderstood or "weird," because I'm with a person that many people on this strange planet still consider "weird" as well.

There's a safety issue here, too. Given that I'm unable to read people's nonverbal signals, I usually stay very vigilant about my social responses to straight men, because I have a tough time knowing whether someone is coming on to me or not, or whether I could be misconstrued as coming on to them. With gay men, there's no problem with that.



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04 Dec 2008, 10:04 pm

Quote:
Based on your comment about Homosexual preference since childhood, I take it you don't believe children are asexual until they have matured physically?

8O Huh? Say what? 8O
http://www.parenting-ed.org/handout3/Specific%20Concerns%20and%20Problems/masturbation.htm
I had to find that to prove I wasn't a freak for liking people on Sesame Street when I was 5.

I am a Christian who reads the bible A LOT and doesn't believe it condemns homosexuality.

As for the OP "are gays more tolerant of AS/ASD?" :
I think it is a lot easier for a bisexual AS male to find a gay lover than a girlfriend.



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04 Dec 2008, 11:23 pm

No, Gay people in general are very social, and they expect all people to be as highly social. Being autistic around gay men is like being like acting like a wolf amoungst sheep.



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04 Dec 2008, 11:34 pm

I think it depends on how the person was raised.



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05 Dec 2008, 11:07 am

donhz wrote:
The thing that interests me in the debate is that homosexuals used to be more classy in how they handled things. Now they have become as bad (or worse) than Christian Fundamentaists when it comes to twisting people's arms to get them to convert to the idea that homosexuality is somehow okay.
This is a deeply flawed analogy.

People who are trying to convert you to their religion are, well, trying to convert you to their religion. Gay people do not go around trying to make other people gay.

And unlike religion, sexuality is not a conscious choice.

IdahoAspie wrote:
No, Gay people in general are very social, and they expect all people to be as highly social. Being autistic around gay men is like being like acting like a wolf amoungst sheep.
I think this is nonsense. It is no more reasonable to generalize about "gay people" than about "straight people".



neshamaruach
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05 Dec 2008, 12:49 pm

dougn wrote:
donhz wrote:
The thing that interests me in the debate is that homosexuals used to be more classy in how they handled things. Now they have become as bad (or worse) than Christian Fundamentaists when it comes to twisting people's arms to get them to convert to the idea that homosexuality is somehow okay.
This is a deeply flawed analogy.

People who are trying to convert you to their religion are, well, trying to convert you to their religion. Gay people do not go around trying to make other people gay.

And unlike religion, sexuality is not a conscious choice.

IdahoAspie wrote:
No, Gay people in general are very social, and they expect all people to be as highly social. Being autistic around gay men is like being like acting like a wolf amoungst sheep.
I think this is nonsense. It is no more reasonable to generalize about "gay people" than about "straight people".


It's total nonsense. Read my post in this thread. My best friendships are with gay men. (I am a straight female Aspie.)



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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05 Dec 2008, 1:43 pm

IdahoAspie wrote:
No, Gay people in general are very social, and they expect all people to be as highly social. Being autistic around gay men is like being like acting like a wolf amoungst sheep.


I have known gays that aren't friendly and some that are and some that aren't social. You can't stereotype people in ways that are superficial, although I think you can stereotype primal behaviour and needs. It's pretty much the same for everyone.



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05 Dec 2008, 4:53 pm

The guy who owned the local craftstore and the guy who owned a local hardware store were rumored to be gay. They seemed annoyed with me just like all the straight guys but then I don't know if they were really truly gay or not. A lesbian on a messageboard seemed to love to pick on me for having AS and tell me I am using it as an excuse. But then this girl would probably be a b***h if she was straight. Some people are just nastier than others reglardles of orientation. Being gay or straight has no diffrence on how someone treats others that are diffrent.



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05 Dec 2008, 7:01 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
I have known gays that aren't friendly and some that are and some that aren't social. You can't stereotype people in ways that are superficial, although I think you can stereotype primal behaviour and needs. It's pretty much the same for everyone.


Maybe so; explaining people must be a scientist's nightmare :? :lol:

So what explains variations in how individual people treat other people? I'm not into this 'good people and bad people' distinction; people have a choice based on their experience_ _

My old school bully used to say 'different people should be treated differently' - Why not?
{Answer (I guess!) - Every1 ends up getting treated like s#*@-?!}



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05 Dec 2008, 11:30 pm

I met one homosexual individual who said the strangest thing,

She said that there are all these programs for autistics to go to but NTs don't go to any.


It was so refreshing to hear that from an NT -I never thought I would.

Maybe she said it because she knew what it was like to be treated badly because she's different or maybe she said it because she's just really insightful. Whatever the reason, I think they understand what it's like to be treated badly by everyone else and so maybe have a better chance at understanding at least one point of an autistic life.