Page 2 of 3 [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

2ukenkerl
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Jul 2007
Age: 65
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,277

26 Jan 2009, 5:58 pm

NocturnalQuilter wrote:
Greentea wrote:
They don't think they're "better" than us. They do think, though, that they're BETTER ADJUSTED TO SOCIETY than us. And since, for them, being well adjusted to society is top priority, they consider themselves better off than us.


You give "NTs" WAAAAAAAYYYYY too much credit for thinking that abstractly.
The collective "NT" mind doesn't even know that Asperger's exists (much less what it is) let alone taking the far-fetched leap at cognitive/presumptive social elitism.


As I said before, it is not AS per se, but the fact that we are "weird".



mitharatowen
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Oct 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,675
Location: Arizona

26 Jan 2009, 6:37 pm

Well I guess I can relate this to what I thought several years ago. I had only heard of LFA as being 'autistic' and that is generally regarded as a sad condition to be in because you're 'trapped' in your head and can't take care of yourself. So I heard that a girl I went to highschool with was thinking her son was autistic and I though 'oh how sad, that's gotta be hard' because I automatically assumed LFA which is equatable to ret*d in general society.

But now I know more and how varied autism can be and I don't feel so bad about it. I do think there are definate drawbacks to our condition but a few benefits as well. However, if it was just different but equal to everyone else, it wouldn't be a disability.



irishwhistle
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 30 Sep 2006
Age: 53
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,272

26 Jan 2009, 7:05 pm

Well, now, my guess as to what NTs are thinking when they look at us would depend on the NT, the situation, what they know of AS, what they know of the particular person, when they look and for how long, what they had for lunch, how old they are, where they come from and where they live now...

But to take a narrow slice of the vast number of NTs, here are a couple of possible scenarios:

Thoughts of NT who doesn't know me waiting in line in the grocery store behind me:
"Wow, she has a full cart. Maybe she'll let me go ahead of her with my onion. If I could just catch her eye... dang it, she won't look up! Screw it, I'll go to the self-checkout."

NT who knows AS behind me in a line:
"She must be one of those Asperger's people, she never looks at anybody. Or she's just rude."

NT passing by saying hi:
"Wow, she never answered me. That's so rude... oh, I am so stupid. She's deaf!"

NT passing by in a Target:
"She should smile more, if you just keep smiling eventually you feel like smiling."
Alternately:
"What's her problem? Maybe I didn't smile enough."

NT who knows AS saying hi or passing by anywhere...

Completely forgets everything they know when you don't greet them or make eye contact and assumes that you're rude or that it's about them.

We all know about the smile one, they think you're unhappy if you aren't sporting a cheshire cat grin.

Finally...

NT who knows you and knows you have AS:
"I think it's just an excuse for being rude. How hard would it be to just smile? She was always fine before she got diagnosed, she just doesn't want to have to try."

Wow, how dark of me... I set out to be funny with a kernel of truth and got too much truth. My trouble is that I don't so often seem to run into people who are understanding or AS, even enough to pity someone who has it. What I run into are people who think that a reason is an excuse, and that an excuse is an invitation to meddle. They are mercilessly chirpy people who think you want to be like them, you just don't know how. And if you don't know how, what kind of people would they be if they didn't share their secrets?

Me, I'm thinking of having a bumper sticker made in the shape of a puzzle piece that says, "Cure what?" in the middle. I think we're just different varieties of the same thing: humans. I'm kinda getting sick of having a name put on it at all. It's something schools do to get funding for having to find more than one way to teach kids. Stupid, to suggest that all kids learn the same.

I hope the NTs don't pity. They'd be wasting their time.


_________________
"Pack up my head, I'm goin' to Paris!" - P.W.

The world loves diversity... as long as it's pretty, makes them look smart and doesn't put them out in any way.

There's the road, and the road less traveled, and then there's MY road.


Katie_WPG
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 7 Sep 2008
Age: 39
Gender: Female
Posts: 492
Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada

26 Jan 2009, 7:13 pm

Well, when NTs look at ME, they also assume that I am 'NT'. So that's not really a problem. I assume that it would be the same for most people with AS (unless they're particularily severe).

When you get into more complex situations (like, the 'NTs' KNOW what AS is, and they KNOW that you are AS) then there is a very real possibility that some might look down on you. Simply because they only see the negative, and assume that the negatives are so great that your positives can't possibly compensate. For SOME with AS, this is kind of true. Heck, even *I* feel like talking down to some of the lower-functioning members of my provincial Asperger organization. I know that sounds horrible, but I'm just stating my first instinct when meeting them.

But fortunately, AS is not a visible disability and people won't talk down to you unless you've given them a reason to. So when in doubt, keep quiet. :wink:

My cousin has it rather bad. People automatically talk down to him, just because he has mild cerebral palsy and a speech impediment. Even to the point when nurses at the hospital actually spoke to my sister instead of him, when it was his own mother that was dying. My sister had to remind them that *he* was the next of kin, not her (or my father). I must say that I'm eternally grateful that that will never happen to me.



CelticGoddess
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2006
Age: 51
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,968

26 Jan 2009, 7:48 pm

What it really boils down to is that people judge other people no matter what side of the diagnosis pond you're on. There are jerks in every category. I do my best not to judge anyone, unless they commit a criminal act. That's where I draw the line :wink: But if you're a jerk, you're a jerk. I don't care if you're AS or NT. If you're mean, I can't say I'll want to hang around you. But if you have quirks, sensory issues, tics, I really don't see those things. I see the person behind all the superficial stuff.



tweety_fan
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Oct 2007
Age: 41
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,555

26 Jan 2009, 7:52 pm

there are jerks everywhere.
people that come up with any reason not to like a person.



NocturnalQuilter
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Oct 2008
Age: 57
Gender: Male
Posts: 937

26 Jan 2009, 8:02 pm

2ukenkerl wrote:
WOW, what a DUMB psychobabble thing to say! YES, some NTs DO think they are better than people that act odd, such as AS. Sorry, but that is FACT! And just because somone realizes that does NOT mean that they feel that way about themselves.

HAVEN'T you EVER thought about your stupid logic? Turned around, and used in the most common way, you must have AS, ADHD, LFA, etc.... Because many say you won't say such things against another unless you are like them. Then again, that means that those speaking against NTs must be nts! Pretty stupid reasoning, huh? GRANTED, perverts and homosexuals tend to be the ones stating that "logic" to that degree, and that clearly, but it is the SAME reasoning that you now do.


You never cease to bore me with your consistent attacks on my opinions OR my sexuality.
(insert yawning emoticon here)



KazigluBey
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 3 Jan 2009
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 405

26 Jan 2009, 8:17 pm

Joshandspot wrote:
Do you ever feel the NT's look at us and think they're better than us?


No, but I have sort of a fun-loving arrogance about me and tend to be a bit of a blow hard.

Quote:
Than I wonder, are they actually better than us or just defining it as such?


They? No. Some? Possibly.

As far as defining it that way? Hmmm, I'd say they (as in those that do) define only what is permitted to be defined. For instance, people at work know me as quirky, but despite my idiosyncrasies they depend on me to get certain things done--thus, I get a hand in the defining.

Quote:
Are we really supposed to come to terms with the idea that we're less?


No; life is a continual improvement. People lose legs and still win marathons and such. Likewise, a disability (for lack of better word) only keeps you unable to do something if you let it. Beethoven continued to compose music even after he started going deaf.



ruveyn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Age: 89
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,502
Location: New Jersey

26 Jan 2009, 8:40 pm

Joshandspot wrote:
Do you ever feel the NT's look at us and think they're better than us? I do. Than I wonder, are they actually better than us or just defining it as such? I have trouble coming to terms with the idea that because I'm Aspie, I'm less than everyone else or I generally have less than everyone else in many areas of my life. Are we really supposed to come to terms with the idea that we're less? that we're the lowest on the food chain of humans or is there something that the NT's are missing when judging us?


Why are you so concerned? You are what you are, so be what you are. You haven't much choice.

ruveyn



2ukenkerl
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Jul 2007
Age: 65
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,277

26 Jan 2009, 9:41 pm

NocturnalQuilter wrote:
2ukenkerl wrote:
WOW, what a DUMB psychobabble thing to say! YES, some NTs DO think they are better than people that act odd, such as AS. Sorry, but that is FACT! And just because somone realizes that does NOT mean that they feel that way about themselves.

HAVEN'T you EVER thought about your stupid logic? Turned around, and used in the most common way, you must have AS, ADHD, LFA, etc.... Because many say you won't say such things against another unless you are like them. Then again, that means that those speaking against NTs must be nts! Pretty stupid reasoning, huh? GRANTED, perverts and homosexuals tend to be the ones stating that "logic" to that degree, and that clearly, but it is the SAME reasoning that you now do.


You never cease to bore me with your consistent attacks on my opinions OR my sexuality.
(insert yawning emoticon here)


I said the homosexual thing BEFORE I realized who you were. It is TRUE, so it doesn't matter ANYWAY! I have been called homosexual HERE because I said I don't like the idea. I DON'T go out of my way to say such things though. Sorry you feel differently.



sunshower
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Age: 126
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,985

26 Jan 2009, 11:35 pm

MegaAndy wrote:
Looooooads of poeple on this site use the word "NT" and i havent a clue what it stands for though i suppose i get what it means in context.
im new to this aspergers lingo ive known ive had it since i was 6 and ive never heard it being called "aspie" until a few days ago


NT = neurotypical (a.k.a. non-aspergers people/so called "normal" people, although it's all stereotyping and generalization really)


_________________
Into the dark...


outlier
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 16 Oct 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,429

27 Jan 2009, 5:05 am

There's another thing I've seen some people do: pity traits that are considered talents. They use such words as "sad" if they see something like an intricate drawing, or if someone loves to learn about obscure or technical subjects. From some people's perspective, such things are genuinely pitiable.

Conversely, there are some people who are easily awestruck. They hear the name of an obscure interest and think you're a genius when you're really just adequate at it.



Prosser
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 9 Nov 2008
Age: 34
Gender: Male
Posts: 941
Location: Perth, Westen Australia

27 Jan 2009, 6:03 am

:? Honestly I'd say most people I've met think they're better than me. And most people I've met are NT. I'm not making any rushed conclusions but I DO see a pattern. *sigh*


_________________
I wandered though the weird and lurid landscape of another planet.


Last edited by Prosser on 27 Jan 2009, 6:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

Inventor
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,014
Location: New Orleans

27 Jan 2009, 6:25 am

The lower they are in the pecking order, they more they seek someone they can think is less than them.

Those higher in the pecking order look down on everyone equally.

Since 75% of people are sure they are in the top 25%, it gets confusing.



b9
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 14 Aug 2008
Age: 54
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,003
Location: australia

27 Jan 2009, 6:27 am

i can not say how NT's see me. for me to know that i would have to be NT.

i know i am not liked by anyone much (except my girfriend and one other friend who finds me entertaining in a way i do not understand). why i am not liked by people, i do not really know.

people do not dislike me, they just seem to see me as kind of less deep and real than normal people.

the use of the term "NT" for me means "the rest of the world" because i never met anyone that had AS (if i did, i did not know it). i know that it is a silly and "chip on the shoulder-ish" term, and i know that NT's are all quite individual.

but they all have a sense that i do not have, and they all find it crucial to connect with others through that "sense", and that leaves me out of their world. i will use the term "NT" because it is shorter than saying "average people" all the time.

people may sit and listen very interestedly at what i describe, but they do not have the sense that they are talking to a real person who has feelings.

even if i am in a very detailed and attentive conversation with someone, if another NT starts to say something to them, i am instantly cut off and ignored in preference for the other person, even if they are just saying stuff like "god it's hot".

it is like i am an interesting android, but i do not elicit feelings of "brotherhood of man" or whatever from people.

i know the "robot" analogy relating to AS is hackneyed, but it is rather true in a way.

imagine in 1,000 years, you are talking to an android that is so advanced in it's programming, that it can hold spontaneous conversations (not just "hard wired" utterances). you are very entertained by it's ability to introduce relevant and interesting things to the conversation. but then a real person comes along and says something and the android is instantly ignored in favour of the real human.

it is like i am not a "whole" person to them.
they do not feel in "company" in my company.

whatever.

i do not care how people (including AS) see me.

it is not against the law to be me, so their perceptions are irrelevant.

i often wonder how my kookaburra's see me. what goes through their minds about me?

it is mysterious, but not as mysterious as what goes through "peoples" minds about me.

i may be talking to one kookaburra and he hears another kookie start laughing in the distance, and he is instantly affixed to that sound instead of my voice.

anyway... to summarise...i have no idea.



Hovis
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 9 Jul 2006
Age: 52
Gender: Female
Posts: 936
Location: Lincolnshire, England

27 Jan 2009, 2:39 pm

outlier wrote:
There's another thing I've seen some people do: pity traits that are considered talents. They use such words as "sad" if they see something like an intricate drawing, or if someone loves to learn about obscure or technical subjects. From some people's perspective, such things are genuinely pitiable.


In their eyes:

Someone being a mathematics genius, or speaking several different languages, or simply having quite a bit of knowledge about an interesting and potentially useful subject = sad.

Someone whose favorite hobby is going out and spending £100 on alcohol, only to round off the evening by vomiting most of it on the pavement = cool.

:roll: