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funeralxempire
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21 Sep 2020, 10:06 pm

Wouldn't this describe someone who doesn't broadly meet diagnostic criteria, but displays a few traits typical of ASD with enough severity to be an impairment?


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21 Sep 2020, 11:04 pm

In my opinion, NTs with autistic tendencies are likely NTs that reacts and have similar circumstances with an aspie.

The NTs themselves had no developmental delays, no sensory differences.
But likely have the same aptitudes (apparently NVLD-like is common), same reactions to stimuli (sensitive reactions more like it, in spite of their sensory filters or possibly alexithymic), same point of view of things (non-conformist tendencies or mental health issues), and in some cases same circumstances (bullied, out of place) and social roles (nerdy, loner, introvert, etc.) they're stuck with.

But they're not autistic.
They're NTs who can relate well with aspies.


If BAP means autistics with not enough expressed traits to be diagnosed, that's not an NT with autistic tendencies.
BAP likely had different instincts yet chooses different behaviors, and developmental and sensory profiles that seem coincide more with seemingly less problematic sides, hardwired somewhere, no matter their circumstances and preferences.

NTs are likely still NTs no matter how autistic they behave and relate.
At least they'd be one of the first people an aspie can ever relate to.



I've only known very few NTs with autistic tendencies.

One I happened to know very well because she's my SPED teacher. She fancies herself to be in a spectrum.
She's sensitive so she had to be an introvert. A book lover, a proud nerd, and a bit of a kid at heart. :lol:
The only times I can truly synch with her is when I'm functioning well. Otherwise, it's a one-sided thing with me stumbling behind.
And that's how I know BAP doesn't resonate with me. I have to be in a state of being a full blown high functioning aspergian than leaning heavier to less functioning like states.

At least it's a someone I can truly synch with than, well, almost never.


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magz
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22 Sep 2020, 12:54 am

As long as psychiatric diagnoses are symptom-based, the same person can fit different diagnoses depending on circumstances. Grey areas of unobviousness are largely unnavigable with this approach.

If one day mechanisms behind these diagnoses are understood, we will be able to navigate grey areas better.
It may even turn out you can have asymptomatic autism ;)


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nca14
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22 Sep 2020, 7:55 am

Edna3362 wrote:
In my opinion, NTs with autistic tendencies are likely NTs that reacts and have similar circumstances with an aspie.

The NTs themselves had no developmental delays, no sensory differences.
But likely have the same aptitudes (apparently NVLD-like is common), same reactions to stimuli (sensitive reactions more like it, in spite of their sensory filters or possibly alexithymic), same point of view of things (non-conformist tendencies or mental health issues), and in some cases same circumstances (bullied, out of place) and social roles (nerdy, loner, introvert, etc.) they're stuck with.

But they're not autistic.
They're NTs who can relate well with aspies.

Personally, I have to definitely and obviously disagree with the opinion mentioned above.

I don't think that such "NTs" are not autistic in any way... I think that many of them are probably disabled, maybe even quite markedly! Such "NTs" are closer to Aspies than to "typical" NTs (and IMO are even a group of Aspies/autistics)!

I have NVLD-like symptoms (like problems with nonverbal communication like eye contact and VIQ significantly higher than PIQ), poor tolerance of physical discomfort (but I think that I have no sensory differences), "pathological" nonconformism and mental health issues like severe OCD, I was bullied a lot when I was younger and can be described as "nerdy, loner, introverted". But I received diagnosis of Asperger's syndrome...

I would consider myself as obviously (and in some areas blatantly) autistic (or maybe even better schizoautistic :) - obviously not "mentally typical"), but not having "classic autism" described by Leo Kanner or even somethig related to that autism. I obviously have PERVASIVE (develop)mental difference and I do not consider myself "normal" or just having "SPECIFIC" developmental disorders. I am a blatant "weirdo" since my young age.

I admit that the text quoted at the beginning of that post can even "hurt" me (and maybe also people similar to me) :( I think that people like me can be obviously harmed by classifications of mental disorders used in the USA. I can suppose that they are more "not typical" mentally than more individuals with ASD, at least ASD level 1.



Last edited by nca14 on 22 Sep 2020, 8:09 am, edited 7 times in total.

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22 Sep 2020, 8:02 am

jonahsmom wrote:
What does this mean to you? What separates "NT with autistic traits" from "high functioning autie"? Where is the line, really? ...
There is no "line", it's a spectrum -- acontinuouschangefromoneendtotheother.


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Edna3362
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22 Sep 2020, 8:44 am

nca14 wrote:
Edna3362 wrote:
In my opinion, NTs with autistic tendencies are likely NTs that reacts and have similar circumstances with an aspie.

The NTs themselves had no developmental delays, no sensory differences.
But likely have the same aptitudes (apparently NVLD-like is common), same reactions to stimuli (sensitive reactions more like it, in spite of their sensory filters or possibly alexithymic), same point of view of things (non-conformist tendencies or mental health issues), and in some cases same circumstances (bullied, out of place) and social roles (nerdy, loner, introvert, etc.) they're stuck with.

But they're not autistic.
They're NTs who can relate well with aspies.

Personally, I have to definitely and obviously disagree with the opinion mentioned above.

I don't think that such "NTs" are not autistic in any way... I think that many of them are probably disabled, maybe even quite markedly! Such "NTs" are closer to Aspies than to "typical" NTs (and IMO are even a group of Aspies/autistics)!

I have NVLD-like symptoms (like problems with nonverbal communication like eye contact and VIQ significantly higher than PIQ), poor tolerance of physical discomfort (but I think that I have no sensory differences), "pathological" nonconformism and mental health issues like severe OCD, I was bullied a lot when I was younger and can be described as "nerdy, loner, introverted". But I received diagnosis of Asperger's syndrome...

I would consider myself as obviously (and in some areas blatantly) autistic (or maybe even better schizoautistic :) - obviously not "mentally typical"), but not having "classic autism" described by Leo Kanner or even somethig related to that autism. I obviously have PERVASIVE (develop)mental difference and I do not consider myself "normal" or just having "SPECIFIC" developmental disorders. I am a blatant "weirdo" since my young age.

I admit that the text quoted at the beginning of that post can even "hurt" me (and maybe also people similar to me) :( I think that people like me can be obviously harmed by classifications of mental disorders used in the USA. I can suppose that they are more "not typical" mentally than more individuals with ASD, at least ASD level 1.

:? Did you forgot to take account the pitfalls of behavioral based diagnosis?


As far as I'm concerned, your is reply is exactly why there's a downside of simply enumerating traits.

At the same time, whatever your case is, isn't the same as whatever I'm referring.



I apologize if I hurt you.
And I'd rather pray the mystery of autism be solved than remain tangled in this confusion.


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nca14
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22 Sep 2020, 12:44 pm

Thanks for apologizing me. You (at least rather :) ) didn't hurt me, but it would be irritating for me when someone would say that I have just a specific developmental disorder or personality disorder instead of autism/mental illness. I am too "weird" and too dysfunctional in life to be not counted as someone with certain sort of autism and (or) mental illness.

I think that there are other PERVASIVE developmental disabilities/differences than "bookish" autism or "bookish" Asperger's (which for me looks like "bookish" Kanner's autism without intellectual disability and smaller speech delay, smaller problems with verbal communication than in low-functioning "classic" autism). I think that many with NVLD have certain sort of pervasive developmental disability which is probably something other than a form of "classic" autism or "classic" Asperger's (which are in some way the same).

I think that many people with NVLD and without ASD are truly disabled and may be abused by "more normal" members of the society, like "NT" peers or employers. It is really bad. Personally I think that system of helping people with life dysfunctions can be worse in "capitalistic" US than in poorer Poland. In Poland I have social pension and care allowance because my disdability is enough serious and started enough early.