Why The Hell Do People Say This?

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27 Jun 2009, 4:48 pm

I think you're confusing acceptance with condoning. Nobody would like it, of course, but they would know what's going on and react to what's really going on, in an effective way, rather than react to the literal words and fail to help themselves, with a lousy feeling on top of it.

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Greentea
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27 Jun 2009, 5:03 pm

Hartz, another thing...many people nowadays are overloaded with work so that the employer can reduce costs in salaries. They're not allowed to complain about the overwork, they tell themselves that they should be grateful they have a job at all. They have to bring your expectations down because they're only human and can't do more than a human can do. Some may be better at getting out of helping part of the public, and some may be less adept and come up with responses as silly as the one you got.

It's all an NT game - the powers that be create an economic crisis and hide their hand in it; as a consequence, the employers overwork their employees and, to hide their hand in it, they instill in the employees fear of complaining; the employees get part of the work off their backs and hide their hand in it. On the surface, everything appears fine and like everyone is doing their best. This is the "smooth flow of society" that NTs adore. An illusion. And they all know how to play the game. The fact that we Aspies don't like their game and don't know how to play it doesn't mean that the NTs should behave more like we Aspies want them to.

Personally, I despise the NT need to live life in illusion. But I live and let live.

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crysthewolf
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27 Jun 2009, 7:19 pm

Greentea wrote:

I'm really failing to see how Hartz did that. I actually think that calling and complaining about the situation had a much, much better effect than doing nothing and brushing it off as "Well, they don't get paid very well and people don't have much incentive to do a good job and besides, life isn't fair anyway." It looks to me an awful lot like Hartz DID help herself and DID go on in an effective way, as well as getting frustrated by behavior that was, frankly, very rude.

crysthewolf
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27 Jun 2009, 7:20 pm

Greentea wrote:

Which is a fine explanation, and the only qualm I have with it honestly is the implication that anyone is asking them to BE anything other than "human".

hartzofspace
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28 Jun 2009, 12:18 am

Greentea wrote:

I don't think that I am confusing acceptance with condoning. And, after I reacted to what was going on, I did go on and help myself. I explained that a couple of posts back.

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hartzofspace
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28 Jun 2009, 12:21 am

Greentea wrote:

I don't think that I am confusing acceptance with condoning. And, after I reacted to what was going on, I did go on and help myself. I explained that a couple of posts back. Hopefully, I've got the problem resolved.

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Greentea
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28 Jun 2009, 1:04 am

That was my answer to crys.

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tweety_fan
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28 Jun 2009, 2:54 am

that is a ridiculous increase in rent.
you have every right to complain.

marshall
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28 Jun 2009, 6:16 pm

Greentea wrote:

Without economic growth we are currently living in a zero sum game. Society always adapts rules, be they social, cultural, legal, bureaucratic, or even religious, rules devised to try and hide the zero sum nature of our present reality.

I think it's wrong to see all of this as an NT vs. AS issue though. Can you prove that NTs adore the system? Other than the ones at the very top of the social food chain? People just put up with it as long as they still feel like they have something to lose if they refuse to capitulate.

Unfortunately things will have to get worse before they get better. It takes an absurd amount of time for the masses to realize just how badly they are being f*cked. It also takes massive numbers of people who feel they have nothing left to lose. That's the only thing that can strike fear into the ones at the top who refuse to sacrifice and pay their dues, rather than continually pass the buck on to those below them.

I can live and let live in some cases but I refuse to be pushed around and taken advantage of. I'd rather put someone else's head on a stake. I have no respect for humanity as a whole. We are a stupid species.

Last edited by marshall on 29 Jun 2009, 1:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

hartzofspace
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28 Jun 2009, 8:51 pm

Greentea wrote:

That was my answer to crys.

Thanks for clarifying that!

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crysthewolf
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28 Jun 2009, 11:00 pm

marshall wrote:

Greentea wrote:

Without economic growth we are currently living in a zero sum game. Society always adapts rules, be they social, cultural, legal, bureaucratic, or even religious, rules devised to try and hide the zero sum nature reality.

I think it's wrong to see all of this as an NT vs. AS issue though. Can you prove that NTs adore the system? Other than the ones at the very top of the social food chain? People just put up with it as long as they still feel like they have something to lose if they refuse to capitulate.

Unfortunately things will have to get worse before they get better. It takes an absurd amount of time for the masses to realize just how badly they are being f*cked. It also takes massive numbers of people who feel they have nothing left to lose. That's the only thing that can strike fear into the ones at the top who refuse to sacrifice and pay their dues, rather than continually pass the buck on to those below them.

I can live and let live in some cases but I refuse to be pushed around and taken advantage of. I'd rather put someone else's head on a stake. I have no respect for humanity as a whole. We are a stupid species.

Exactly.

cubedemon6073
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28 Jun 2009, 11:57 pm

Greentea wrote:

Of course it's not fair. But society is not about fairness, it's about survival and competition, especially when it's work that's at stake.

Besides, don't forget that if Hartz was an NT, she would've been perfectly content with that kind of indirect talk by the counselor. NTs do this to each other all the time and they agree that's the best way to keep society a smooth place to live in. They call it politeness and white lies. See my recent thread about it, "Bluntness and honesty vs. politeness and white lies" for some genuine, heart-wrenching NT testimonies.

I have a question. How is NT society smooth if there are wars all over the planet and rumors of wars all over the planet. Look at Iraq. Look at North Korea. How can NTs call their societies smooth? I don't get it. Maybe I'm the one who is extremely mentally ill.

Greentea
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29 Jun 2009, 12:07 am

NTs don't claim that society IS smooth. They support phoniness as a way to make it LOOK smoothER.

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marshall
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29 Jun 2009, 1:12 am

Greentea wrote:

NTs don't claim that society IS smooth. They support phoniness as a way to make it LOOK smoothER.

It isn't NT's as a whole. It's always the people with power who support phoniness the most. Phoniness is always instituted from the top down.

Phoniness is insulting to aspies and NT's alike. Look at what's happening in Iran. There are now large numbers of people there who feel they have little to lose. They bravely decided to risk their lives, to not to accept the insulting lies and phoniness coming from the regime in power. Riots are what happens when people stop caring about appearing polite and civilized and let their true feelings sound loud and clear.

I think it's beautiful to see people rioting in the streets, shouting violent slogans. I believe that anger is the most honest emotion. It's the only valid response to the ripe stench of BS. If only it could happen all over the world. Make all people in power shake with fear and think twice before insulting people with their lies and games.

Greentea
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29 Jun 2009, 2:51 am

marshall,

Today's rioters' leaders, if successful enough at manipulation, are always tomorrow's powers that be. See Animal Farm by George Orwell. What you're seeing is not honesty. It's the hungry masses led by the counter-powers. Often a foreign empire at work behind the scene, I won't say who. :wink:

And of course, the phoniness is first and foremost promoted and enforced by the powers that be, to have an orderly herd. This is what I explained in my first post to Hartz when I talked about the counselor's need to hide reality (work overload) from her bosses.

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cubedemon6073
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29 Jun 2009, 9:46 am

Greentea wrote:

And of course, the phoniness is first and foremost promoted and enforced by the powers that be, to have an orderly herd. This is what I explained in my first post to Hartz when I talked about the counselor's need to hide reality (work overload) from her bosses.

Greentea, George Orwell was right. Adolus Huxley was correct as well. When I am on my deathbed I want to die the same way that Huxley did. This is what Huxley's last words he said to his wife before dying. "LSD, 100 micrograms I.M." His last words before dying, to his wife. She complied and he was injected twice before his death.

Plenty of doublethink and newspeak is going on. We have achieved a hybrid of Orwell's dystopian and Huxley's dystopian future.

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