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Joe90
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03 Aug 2011, 3:00 pm

I am a very emotional person. I am always telling my family how I feel about different things. Last night I kept on bursting into tears, and when my mum came in I straight away told her that I feel very tearful tonight.

I also get tearful about one of my elderly relatives who is ill. Especially when I think of her smiling face *cries now*


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MotownDangerPants
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03 Aug 2011, 3:08 pm

Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
I've seen the same thing.

But, I tell you, sometimes it does feel that way.

Although, I know that I still have them.

I can go for a few months at a time, sometimes, not feeling anything deeply. Everything just feels mechanical. It's hard to relate to people when I go on *computer* mode, but I can still relate to the to the people I know well. I may talk less and withdraw a little more, it's just because I don't have much to say. I still enjoy their company. I'm still upbeat, and friendly enough. I forget a lot of things and ask stupid questions because I have no idea what people are talking about but, I don't get depressed or anything.

The upside is that I'm almost never sad.

It's easy to misunderstand people and get into altercations that you don't even realize you're having when your emotions disappear. I misread people, or seem oblivious, and then they get mad or just stop talking to me.

But, other time, I have *almost* as much emotion as most people do. I guess it's maybe...60% of the time I have almost none and 40% of the time I have enough to seem sociable and like I *get* what other people are saying to me.


Wow. This is how it is with me and a few people thought I was "Bipolar". For many years I never could pin down what this fluctuating phenomenon was.
ToM isn't processed on these down turns --and these vacillations hampered any dating prospects. On this side of the coin ADHD is a curse as this is a dehumanizing condition that wrests control over your control, all the while being acutely conscious of this.

When all these things cluster/ conglomerate at any given point, you're talking a major "cluster ________".


I actually was diagnosed as bipolar once, and then I guess they changed their minds.

I didn't agree with it anyway, but I wasn't going to argue.

I don't get the lows, really. I honestly think that I only feel *true* sadness, maybe, a few times each year. And it goes away quickly.

And the rest of the time, I can seem a little manic, but I never do anything outrageous. And it's not like I can't control it, I'm just spazzy because I want to be.

But yea, definitely true about the TOM when you aren't feeling anything. I never really thought about it before, but, it's just very hard to gauge what anyone else could be feeling when YOU feel nothing. I still try to be as friendly as possible but sometimes seem antagonistic or just *out there*.


I disagree because sometimes I dont feel anything, but I still know that I have to play "Im sorry" (as an example), and I play because "I know it is the right thing to do/I know how I affect the people watching if it gets obvious that I dont feel anything". So I still have ToM, but no emotion = if I dont feel anything I still have no problems knowing what other people think/feel.


Well, this is the executive dysfunction of ADHD, and it's hit or miss in this cognition. At its worst you just can't predict or "gauge" ToM well, and it might hit you later what you said was out of line, thus a "real time " processing lag.

You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.


Nobody said your TOM was impaired.

Did they?

I didn't look through all of the replies that carefully but I don't think they did lol.

We said that OURS is.

I knew mine was, even before I knew anything about TOM.

It isn't the same for everyone.


What about this phrase?:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.


Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?


He quoted me.

So he was talking...to...me.

Even if he weren't I don't get why you would take it so personally. Lots of people on the spectrum are this way, others aren't.



Maje
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03 Aug 2011, 3:16 pm

Joe90 wrote:
I am a very emotional person.


Me too, sometimes too much. For example I cry if people are evil because I wouldnt be like that to anyone and so its unfair. It is about trying not to appear as evil and then experiencing it in return. Its f*****g unfair! Its mostly based on jealousy and social hierarchy that people are evil, and I just cant take those situations. Stupid animals!



Maje
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03 Aug 2011, 3:17 pm

MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
I've seen the same thing.

But, I tell you, sometimes it does feel that way.

Although, I know that I still have them.

I can go for a few months at a time, sometimes, not feeling anything deeply. Everything just feels mechanical. It's hard to relate to people when I go on *computer* mode, but I can still relate to the to the people I know well. I may talk less and withdraw a little more, it's just because I don't have much to say. I still enjoy their company. I'm still upbeat, and friendly enough. I forget a lot of things and ask stupid questions because I have no idea what people are talking about but, I don't get depressed or anything.

The upside is that I'm almost never sad.

It's easy to misunderstand people and get into altercations that you don't even realize you're having when your emotions disappear. I misread people, or seem oblivious, and then they get mad or just stop talking to me.

But, other time, I have *almost* as much emotion as most people do. I guess it's maybe...60% of the time I have almost none and 40% of the time I have enough to seem sociable and like I *get* what other people are saying to me.


Wow. This is how it is with me and a few people thought I was "Bipolar". For many years I never could pin down what this fluctuating phenomenon was.
ToM isn't processed on these down turns --and these vacillations hampered any dating prospects. On this side of the coin ADHD is a curse as this is a dehumanizing condition that wrests control over your control, all the while being acutely conscious of this.

When all these things cluster/ conglomerate at any given point, you're talking a major "cluster ________".


I actually was diagnosed as bipolar once, and then I guess they changed their minds.

I didn't agree with it anyway, but I wasn't going to argue.

I don't get the lows, really. I honestly think that I only feel *true* sadness, maybe, a few times each year. And it goes away quickly.

And the rest of the time, I can seem a little manic, but I never do anything outrageous. And it's not like I can't control it, I'm just spazzy because I want to be.

But yea, definitely true about the TOM when you aren't feeling anything. I never really thought about it before, but, it's just very hard to gauge what anyone else could be feeling when YOU feel nothing. I still try to be as friendly as possible but sometimes seem antagonistic or just *out there*.


I disagree because sometimes I dont feel anything, but I still know that I have to play "Im sorry" (as an example), and I play because "I know it is the right thing to do/I know how I affect the people watching if it gets obvious that I dont feel anything". So I still have ToM, but no emotion = if I dont feel anything I still have no problems knowing what other people think/feel.


Well, this is the executive dysfunction of ADHD, and it's hit or miss in this cognition. At its worst you just can't predict or "gauge" ToM well, and it might hit you later what you said was out of line, thus a "real time " processing lag.

You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.


Nobody said your TOM was impaired.

Did they?

I didn't look through all of the replies that carefully but I don't think they did lol.

We said that OURS is.

I knew mine was, even before I knew anything about TOM.

It isn't the same for everyone.


What about this phrase?:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.


Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?


He quoted me.

So he was talking...to...me.

Even if he weren't I don't get why you would take it so personally. Lots of people on the spectrum are this way, others aren't.


Relax, Im not taking it personally, Im just telling my point.



MotownDangerPants
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03 Aug 2011, 4:48 pm

Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
I've seen the same thing.

But, I tell you, sometimes it does feel that way.

Although, I know that I still have them.

I can go for a few months at a time, sometimes, not feeling anything deeply. Everything just feels mechanical. It's hard to relate to people when I go on *computer* mode, but I can still relate to the to the people I know well. I may talk less and withdraw a little more, it's just because I don't have much to say. I still enjoy their company. I'm still upbeat, and friendly enough. I forget a lot of things and ask stupid questions because I have no idea what people are talking about but, I don't get depressed or anything.

The upside is that I'm almost never sad.

It's easy to misunderstand people and get into altercations that you don't even realize you're having when your emotions disappear. I misread people, or seem oblivious, and then they get mad or just stop talking to me.

But, other time, I have *almost* as much emotion as most people do. I guess it's maybe...60% of the time I have almost none and 40% of the time I have enough to seem sociable and like I *get* what other people are saying to me.


Wow. This is how it is with me and a few people thought I was "Bipolar". For many years I never could pin down what this fluctuating phenomenon was.
ToM isn't processed on these down turns --and these vacillations hampered any dating prospects. On this side of the coin ADHD is a curse as this is a dehumanizing condition that wrests control over your control, all the while being acutely conscious of this.

When all these things cluster/ conglomerate at any given point, you're talking a major "cluster ________".


I actually was diagnosed as bipolar once, and then I guess they changed their minds.

I didn't agree with it anyway, but I wasn't going to argue.

I don't get the lows, really. I honestly think that I only feel *true* sadness, maybe, a few times each year. And it goes away quickly.

And the rest of the time, I can seem a little manic, but I never do anything outrageous. And it's not like I can't control it, I'm just spazzy because I want to be.

But yea, definitely true about the TOM when you aren't feeling anything. I never really thought about it before, but, it's just very hard to gauge what anyone else could be feeling when YOU feel nothing. I still try to be as friendly as possible but sometimes seem antagonistic or just *out there*.


I disagree because sometimes I dont feel anything, but I still know that I have to play "Im sorry" (as an example), and I play because "I know it is the right thing to do/I know how I affect the people watching if it gets obvious that I dont feel anything". So I still have ToM, but no emotion = if I dont feel anything I still have no problems knowing what other people think/feel.


Well, this is the executive dysfunction of ADHD, and it's hit or miss in this cognition. At its worst you just can't predict or "gauge" ToM well, and it might hit you later what you said was out of line, thus a "real time " processing lag.

You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.


Nobody said your TOM was impaired.

Did they?

I didn't look through all of the replies that carefully but I don't think they did lol.

We said that OURS is.

I knew mine was, even before I knew anything about TOM.

It isn't the same for everyone.


What about this phrase?:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.


Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?


He quoted me.

So he was talking...to...me.

Even if he weren't I don't get why you would take it so personally. Lots of people on the spectrum are this way, others aren't.


Relax, Im not taking it personally, Im just telling my point.

Image



draelynn
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03 Aug 2011, 5:10 pm

I am overly emotional at times. I also do not feel the apropriate emotion at the appropriate time. Sometime I feel nothing when I should be feeling something strongly or a feel too much over something trivial. I've wasted too much self blame and guilt on myself trying to figure out why I was broken this way. I have no doubt now that I simply have wires crossed somewhere. I'm not frigid or dead inside nor am I a spazz and overly sensitive. The wrong responses come out when my emotional buttons are pushed.



Maje
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03 Aug 2011, 5:31 pm

MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
I've seen the same thing.

But, I tell you, sometimes it does feel that way.

Although, I know that I still have them.

I can go for a few months at a time, sometimes, not feeling anything deeply. Everything just feels mechanical. It's hard to relate to people when I go on *computer* mode, but I can still relate to the to the people I know well. I may talk less and withdraw a little more, it's just because I don't have much to say. I still enjoy their company. I'm still upbeat, and friendly enough. I forget a lot of things and ask stupid questions because I have no idea what people are talking about but, I don't get depressed or anything.

The upside is that I'm almost never sad.

It's easy to misunderstand people and get into altercations that you don't even realize you're having when your emotions disappear. I misread people, or seem oblivious, and then they get mad or just stop talking to me.

But, other time, I have *almost* as much emotion as most people do. I guess it's maybe...60% of the time I have almost none and 40% of the time I have enough to seem sociable and like I *get* what other people are saying to me.


Wow. This is how it is with me and a few people thought I was "Bipolar". For many years I never could pin down what this fluctuating phenomenon was.
ToM isn't processed on these down turns --and these vacillations hampered any dating prospects. On this side of the coin ADHD is a curse as this is a dehumanizing condition that wrests control over your control, all the while being acutely conscious of this.

When all these things cluster/ conglomerate at any given point, you're talking a major "cluster ________".


I actually was diagnosed as bipolar once, and then I guess they changed their minds.

I didn't agree with it anyway, but I wasn't going to argue.

I don't get the lows, really. I honestly think that I only feel *true* sadness, maybe, a few times each year. And it goes away quickly.

And the rest of the time, I can seem a little manic, but I never do anything outrageous. And it's not like I can't control it, I'm just spazzy because I want to be.

But yea, definitely true about the TOM when you aren't feeling anything. I never really thought about it before, but, it's just very hard to gauge what anyone else could be feeling when YOU feel nothing. I still try to be as friendly as possible but sometimes seem antagonistic or just *out there*.


I disagree because sometimes I dont feel anything, but I still know that I have to play "Im sorry" (as an example), and I play because "I know it is the right thing to do/I know how I affect the people watching if it gets obvious that I dont feel anything". So I still have ToM, but no emotion = if I dont feel anything I still have no problems knowing what other people think/feel.


Well, this is the executive dysfunction of ADHD, and it's hit or miss in this cognition. At its worst you just can't predict or "gauge" ToM well, and it might hit you later what you said was out of line, thus a "real time " processing lag.

You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.


Nobody said your TOM was impaired.

Did they?

I didn't look through all of the replies that carefully but I don't think they did lol.

We said that OURS is.

I knew mine was, even before I knew anything about TOM.

It isn't the same for everyone.


What about this phrase?:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.


Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?


He quoted me.

So he was talking...to...me.

Even if he weren't I don't get why you would take it so personally. Lots of people on the spectrum are this way, others aren't.


Relax, Im not taking it personally, Im just telling my point.

Image


"cries" ...

if you have no ToM you shouldnt play with it. Its ridiculous.



marshall
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04 Aug 2011, 12:19 am

Maje wrote:
I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.

Do you ever get the sense that you have tricked yourself into thinking you feel a certain way because you want others to percieve you as feeling that way?



swbluto
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04 Aug 2011, 12:42 am

Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
I've seen the same thing.

But, I tell you, sometimes it does feel that way.

Although, I know that I still have them.

I can go for a few months at a time, sometimes, not feeling anything deeply. Everything just feels mechanical. It's hard to relate to people when I go on *computer* mode, but I can still relate to the to the people I know well. I may talk less and withdraw a little more, it's just because I don't have much to say. I still enjoy their company. I'm still upbeat, and friendly enough. I forget a lot of things and ask stupid questions because I have no idea what people are talking about but, I don't get depressed or anything.

The upside is that I'm almost never sad.

It's easy to misunderstand people and get into altercations that you don't even realize you're having when your emotions disappear. I misread people, or seem oblivious, and then they get mad or just stop talking to me.

But, other time, I have *almost* as much emotion as most people do. I guess it's maybe...60% of the time I have almost none and 40% of the time I have enough to seem sociable and like I *get* what other people are saying to me.


Wow. This is how it is with me and a few people thought I was "Bipolar". For many years I never could pin down what this fluctuating phenomenon was.
ToM isn't processed on these down turns --and these vacillations hampered any dating prospects. On this side of the coin ADHD is a curse as this is a dehumanizing condition that wrests control over your control, all the while being acutely conscious of this.

When all these things cluster/ conglomerate at any given point, you're talking a major "cluster ________".


I actually was diagnosed as bipolar once, and then I guess they changed their minds.

I didn't agree with it anyway, but I wasn't going to argue.

I don't get the lows, really. I honestly think that I only feel *true* sadness, maybe, a few times each year. And it goes away quickly.

And the rest of the time, I can seem a little manic, but I never do anything outrageous. And it's not like I can't control it, I'm just spazzy because I want to be.

But yea, definitely true about the TOM when you aren't feeling anything. I never really thought about it before, but, it's just very hard to gauge what anyone else could be feeling when YOU feel nothing. I still try to be as friendly as possible but sometimes seem antagonistic or just *out there*.


I disagree because sometimes I dont feel anything, but I still know that I have to play "Im sorry" (as an example), and I play because "I know it is the right thing to do/I know how I affect the people watching if it gets obvious that I dont feel anything". So I still have ToM, but no emotion = if I dont feel anything I still have no problems knowing what other people think/feel.


Well, this is the executive dysfunction of ADHD, and it's hit or miss in this cognition. At its worst you just can't predict or "gauge" ToM well, and it might hit you later what you said was out of line, thus a "real time " processing lag.

You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.


Nobody said your TOM was impaired.

Did they?

I didn't look through all of the replies that carefully but I don't think they did lol.

We said that OURS is.

I knew mine was, even before I knew anything about TOM.

It isn't the same for everyone.


What about this phrase?:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.


Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?


He quoted me.

So he was talking...to...me.

Even if he weren't I don't get why you would take it so personally. Lots of people on the spectrum are this way, others aren't.


Relax, Im not taking it personally, Im just telling my point.

Image


"cries" ...

if you have no ToM you shouldnt play with it. Its ridiculous.


I'm not seeing "cries". I'm seeing "arguing", with a slight possibility of tear-filled anger.

Oh, and I just looked at the image file name: "Are you serious FEMA". Yep, I guess I'm right.



Maje
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04 Aug 2011, 3:40 am

marshall wrote:
Maje wrote:
I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.

Do you ever get the sense that you have tricked yourself into thinking you feel a certain way because you want others to percieve you as feeling that way?


Well if you use the word "ever" I have to answer yes. If I have tricked myself to feel in a certain way I probably feel in that certain way, so why should it be wrong? If I could trick myself not to be affected in situations that put me down, so that other people wouldnt perceive me crying, I would be happy about that.

Do you think I made up the above text? I dont. Im serious. For example this morning my guest talks to me while Im surfing the internet, and I know I have to answer because if I dont its "wrong". The only things I have to answer to her is "yes, you're right", "mmmm", "wonderful morning, yes" etc. Just as an easy example. The feeling I have when answering is annoyance because of the for me pointless interuptions, and the things Im thinking about when answering are the task that I want to continue and which moment is perfect for continuing my stuff without being rude to her, how I dealt with it, how I sounded "relaxed and interested" etc., which doesnt mirror my feelings.



Last edited by Maje on 04 Aug 2011, 4:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

Maje
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04 Aug 2011, 3:56 am

swbluto wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
I've seen the same thing.

But, I tell you, sometimes it does feel that way.

Although, I know that I still have them.

I can go for a few months at a time, sometimes, not feeling anything deeply. Everything just feels mechanical. It's hard to relate to people when I go on *computer* mode, but I can still relate to the to the people I know well. I may talk less and withdraw a little more, it's just because I don't have much to say. I still enjoy their company. I'm still upbeat, and friendly enough. I forget a lot of things and ask stupid questions because I have no idea what people are talking about but, I don't get depressed or anything.

The upside is that I'm almost never sad.

It's easy to misunderstand people and get into altercations that you don't even realize you're having when your emotions disappear. I misread people, or seem oblivious, and then they get mad or just stop talking to me.

But, other time, I have *almost* as much emotion as most people do. I guess it's maybe...60% of the time I have almost none and 40% of the time I have enough to seem sociable and like I *get* what other people are saying to me.


Wow. This is how it is with me and a few people thought I was "Bipolar". For many years I never could pin down what this fluctuating phenomenon was.
ToM isn't processed on these down turns --and these vacillations hampered any dating prospects. On this side of the coin ADHD is a curse as this is a dehumanizing condition that wrests control over your control, all the while being acutely conscious of this.

When all these things cluster/ conglomerate at any given point, you're talking a major "cluster ________".


I actually was diagnosed as bipolar once, and then I guess they changed their minds.

I didn't agree with it anyway, but I wasn't going to argue.

I don't get the lows, really. I honestly think that I only feel *true* sadness, maybe, a few times each year. And it goes away quickly.

And the rest of the time, I can seem a little manic, but I never do anything outrageous. And it's not like I can't control it, I'm just spazzy because I want to be.

But yea, definitely true about the TOM when you aren't feeling anything. I never really thought about it before, but, it's just very hard to gauge what anyone else could be feeling when YOU feel nothing. I still try to be as friendly as possible but sometimes seem antagonistic or just *out there*.


I disagree because sometimes I dont feel anything, but I still know that I have to play "Im sorry" (as an example), and I play because "I know it is the right thing to do/I know how I affect the people watching if it gets obvious that I dont feel anything". So I still have ToM, but no emotion = if I dont feel anything I still have no problems knowing what other people think/feel.


Well, this is the executive dysfunction of ADHD, and it's hit or miss in this cognition. At its worst you just can't predict or "gauge" ToM well, and it might hit you later what you said was out of line, thus a "real time " processing lag.

You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.


Nobody said your TOM was impaired.

Did they?

I didn't look through all of the replies that carefully but I don't think they did lol.

We said that OURS is.

I knew mine was, even before I knew anything about TOM.

It isn't the same for everyone.


What about this phrase?:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.


Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?


He quoted me.

So he was talking...to...me.

Even if he weren't I don't get why you would take it so personally. Lots of people on the spectrum are this way, others aren't.


Relax, Im not taking it personally, Im just telling my point.

Image


"cries" ...

if you have no ToM you shouldnt play with it. Its ridiculous.


I'm not seeing "cries". I'm seeing "arguing", with a slight possibility of tear-filled anger.

Oh, and I just looked at the image file name: "Are you serious FEMA". Yep, I guess I'm right.


I have never heard of fema.

The point is why a person has the urge to post it. The persons affection is too obvious by posting a directly adressed picture.

If you say Im arguing, where exactly is that clear? Do you think Im arguing by asking this? Me myself did not intend to argue for the sake of arguing, I was inspired by the posts and wanted to tell how I think about it. I happen to be different, is that too much for you guys?



marshall
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04 Aug 2011, 10:35 am

Maje wrote:
marshall wrote:
Maje wrote:
I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.

Do you ever get the sense that you have tricked yourself into thinking you feel a certain way because you want others to percieve you as feeling that way?


Well if you use the word "ever" I have to answer yes. If I have tricked myself to feel in a certain way I probably feel in that certain way, so why should it be wrong? If I could trick myself not to be affected in situations that put me down, so that other people wouldnt perceive me crying, I would be happy about that.

I'm not saying you are wrong. I was just curious because of my own experience socializing and what you previously wrote about having to "behave accordingly" in terms of molding your outward demeaner in order to be polite. My experience is that often initially when someone tries to make small talk I'm not interested at all, or I'm even irritated to have my own train of thought interrupted. Yet I have to act as though I'm interested and put on the appropriate outward emotional response based on the conversation. I note that I am acting and my responses might be dishonest, but then after a short time I can get more into the act and my mood may shift enough to the point where the act feels more genuine. Perhaps "tricked" wasn't the right word to use but I wasn't sure how else to describe it.

Quote:
Do you think I made up the above text? I dont. Im serious.

No. I didn't think that and I wasn't ever implying that I thought you weren't serious. I just wanted to know if ever had the experience I described above but I apologize for not being clear enough about what I meant by "tricked".

Quote:
For example this morning my guest talks to me while Im surfing the internet, and I know I have to answer because if I dont its "wrong". The only things I have to answer to her is "yes, you're right", "mmmm", "wonderful morning, yes" etc. Just as an easy example. The feeling I have when answering is annoyance because of the for me pointless interuptions, and the things Im thinking about when answering are the task that I want to continue and which moment is perfect for continuing my stuff without being rude to her, how I dealt with it, how I sounded "relaxed and interested" etc., which doesnt mirror my feelings.

I'm the same but I probably have more trouble hiding my annoyance as I can't shift gears on a dime when I'm deep in concentration. I think I just happen to be deep in concentration a lot more of the time than a typical person. I never cease thinking and this creates problems for me socially.

I also tend to be lazy and not even try to hide my true feelings around family members. If I spend all day out and about having to hide my mood, then when I get home I don't have the will to try anymore. Then family members will accuse me of "taking out" my bad mood on them, as if it's intentional. In truth I've just reached my limit and need to be left alone to recover and decompress.



MotownDangerPants
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04 Aug 2011, 11:01 am

Maje wrote:
swbluto wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Maje wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
Maje wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
Mdyar wrote:
MotownDangerPants wrote:
I've seen the same thing.

But, I tell you, sometimes it does feel that way.

Although, I know that I still have them.

I can go for a few months at a time, sometimes, not feeling anything deeply. Everything just feels mechanical. It's hard to relate to people when I go on *computer* mode, but I can still relate to the to the people I know well. I may talk less and withdraw a little more, it's just because I don't have much to say. I still enjoy their company. I'm still upbeat, and friendly enough. I forget a lot of things and ask stupid questions because I have no idea what people are talking about but, I don't get depressed or anything.

The upside is that I'm almost never sad.

It's easy to misunderstand people and get into altercations that you don't even realize you're having when your emotions disappear. I misread people, or seem oblivious, and then they get mad or just stop talking to me.

But, other time, I have *almost* as much emotion as most people do. I guess it's maybe...60% of the time I have almost none and 40% of the time I have enough to seem sociable and like I *get* what other people are saying to me.


Wow. This is how it is with me and a few people thought I was "Bipolar". For many years I never could pin down what this fluctuating phenomenon was.
ToM isn't processed on these down turns --and these vacillations hampered any dating prospects. On this side of the coin ADHD is a curse as this is a dehumanizing condition that wrests control over your control, all the while being acutely conscious of this.

When all these things cluster/ conglomerate at any given point, you're talking a major "cluster ________".


I actually was diagnosed as bipolar once, and then I guess they changed their minds.

I didn't agree with it anyway, but I wasn't going to argue.

I don't get the lows, really. I honestly think that I only feel *true* sadness, maybe, a few times each year. And it goes away quickly.

And the rest of the time, I can seem a little manic, but I never do anything outrageous. And it's not like I can't control it, I'm just spazzy because I want to be.

But yea, definitely true about the TOM when you aren't feeling anything. I never really thought about it before, but, it's just very hard to gauge what anyone else could be feeling when YOU feel nothing. I still try to be as friendly as possible but sometimes seem antagonistic or just *out there*.


I disagree because sometimes I dont feel anything, but I still know that I have to play "Im sorry" (as an example), and I play because "I know it is the right thing to do/I know how I affect the people watching if it gets obvious that I dont feel anything". So I still have ToM, but no emotion = if I dont feel anything I still have no problems knowing what other people think/feel.


Well, this is the executive dysfunction of ADHD, and it's hit or miss in this cognition. At its worst you just can't predict or "gauge" ToM well, and it might hit you later what you said was out of line, thus a "real time " processing lag.

You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


I disagree again because I understand very well what is the right thing to do. I have a good ToM. It can just sometimes be superfluous BS which slows us down. It can be extra problems (of other people) which become my problems because Im forced to behave accordingly not to make trouble for somebody. People can get crushed if Im myself (even if I dont do anything out of hate) and so I have to view them as very needing and therefore dependent and therefore no leaders and therefore followers. Call it what you want, even if you describe it with "lack of something" or "an impairment" I think it is the opposite. But whatever you call it, I know I have an above average ToM.


Nobody said your TOM was impaired.

Did they?

I didn't look through all of the replies that carefully but I don't think they did lol.

We said that OURS is.

I knew mine was, even before I knew anything about TOM.

It isn't the same for everyone.


What about this phrase?:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.


Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?


He quoted me.

So he was talking...to...me.

Even if he weren't I don't get why you would take it so personally. Lots of people on the spectrum are this way, others aren't.


Relax, Im not taking it personally, Im just telling my point.

Image


"cries" ...

if you have no ToM you shouldnt play with it. Its ridiculous.


I'm not seeing "cries". I'm seeing "arguing", with a slight possibility of tear-filled anger.

Oh, and I just looked at the image file name: "Are you serious FEMA". Yep, I guess I'm right.


I have never heard of fema.

The point is why a person has the urge to post it. The persons affection is too obvious by posting a directly adressed picture.

If you say Im arguing, where exactly is that clear? Do you think Im arguing by asking this? Me myself did not intend to argue for the sake of arguing, I was inspired by the posts and wanted to tell how I think about it. I happen to be different, is that too much for you guys?


LOL it's not too much for anyone but you acted like we said something about you personally and then seemed like you were offended by it, as far as I can tell.

And I could be wrong.

TBH I'm not reading all of this very well, but that's what I thought.



Mdyar
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04 Aug 2011, 4:49 pm

When M. said: " I disagree" on Mowtown D's. quote of my self , what was the disagreement about? That she or I was implying that this was a universal experience?

I see it now as a way of expressing herself on the first qoute.


Quote:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

^
Quote:
Maje wrote: Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?

^
Quote:
Mdyar wrote:
That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


^ Somewhere a wrong turn was taken.



Maje
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06 Aug 2011, 8:20 am

marshall wrote:
My experience is that often initially when someone tries to make small talk I'm not interested at all, or I'm even irritated to have my own train of thought interrupted. Yet I have to act as though I'm interested and put on the appropriate outward emotional response based on the conversation. I note that I am acting and my responses might be dishonest, but then after a short time I can get more into the act and my mood may shift enough to the point where the act feels more genuine.


I dont get really into it, but have a feeling of acting against myself all the time, giving the people what they "need" which makes me feel fake and which can make me feel stupid afterwards. Sometimes Im more relaxed with it, but I wouldnt start a small talk myself, unless I have a good reason for trying to make someone comfortable. Im comfortable until someone needs to small talk with me, and I would whish other people would be comfortable too, without having to be acknowledged all the time.

Quote:
For example this morning my guest talks to me while Im surfing the internet, and I know I have to answer because if I dont its "wrong". The only things I have to answer to her is "yes, you're right", "mmmm", "wonderful morning, yes" etc. Just as an easy example. The feeling I have when answering is annoyance because of the for me pointless interuptions, and the things Im thinking about when answering are the task that I want to continue and which moment is perfect for continuing my stuff without being rude to her, how I dealt with it, how I sounded "relaxed and interested" etc., which doesnt mirror my feelings.

marshall wrote:
I'm the same but I probably have more trouble hiding my annoyance as I can't shift gears on a dime when I'm deep in concentration. I think I just happen to be deep in concentration a lot more of the time than a typical person. I never cease thinking and this creates problems for me socially.


Yes its a difficult self control training and maybe its also about my consentration. I can get into the conversation after a while if there is a new subject to focus on, but in the beginning Im exploding inside while having a smile on my face.

marshall wrote:
I also tend to be lazy and not even try to hide my true feelings around family members. If I spend all day out and about having to hide my mood, then when I get home I don't have the will to try anymore. Then family members will accuse me of "taking out" my bad mood on them, as if it's intentional. In truth I've just reached my limit and need to be left alone to recover and decompress.


Describes me too. If I have reached my limit I dont adapt appropriately, sometimes I dont even answer, or I answer with an annoyed voice, so that the sound of the sentence "yes, the weather is perfect" can end the conversation, if you know what I mean.

I also know exactly the wrong things to do/say (according to the person Im talking to), and so I can go too far if Im really not in the mood to act, which makes me feel like a bad person being able to do this, but the feeling of unfairness is still stronger as I give people what they want 99% of the time.



Last edited by Maje on 06 Aug 2011, 8:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

Maje
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06 Aug 2011, 8:28 am

Mdyar wrote:
When M. said: " I disagree" on Mowtown D's. quote of my self , what was the disagreement about? That she or I was implying that this was a universal experience?

I see it now as a way of expressing herself on the first qoute.


I think you're right. English is not my first language.

Quote:
Mdyar wrote:
You lose the awareness of 'the other mind', of how they would feel; you "lose" their emotional model.

^
Quote:
Maje wrote: Maybe you should use "Me" instead of "You", so that you speak for yourself?

^
Quote:
Mdyar wrote:
That's the nuts and bolts of this phenomenon, as I experience this.


^ Somewhere a wrong turn was taken.[/quote]

Yes the statement doesnt fit to me, so we are just different.