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Sweetleaf
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06 Mar 2012, 8:30 pm

anarkhos wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
anarkhos wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Well then I guess I just agree to disagree with the public.


Agree with whom?

To agree to disagree both parties have to agree.


Well they think eye contact is for everyone correct? I disagree because it doesn't work for me...unless my goal is to feel anxious.


What I'm getting at is you can't agree to disagree with the NT world on this issue. You can certainly disagree, but that doesn't make it any less important to others.

The point (as the articles makes fairly clear) is to be perceived well by others. If you avoid eye contact you give them a signal which may be unintended.


I can certainly disagree with the general public on that....and if its so important to others than its their problem.


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Matt62
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06 Mar 2012, 8:36 pm

I've learned to approximate it, by looking at the speaker's face, or some part of it. They tend to believe your looking in their eyes. But some people sure have a lot of freckles/moles/birthmarks! ROFLOL

Sincerely,
Matthew



anarkhos
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06 Mar 2012, 8:37 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
I can certainly disagree with the general public on that....and if its so important to others than its their problem.


That's a very self-absorbed view, and as no man's an island I'd quibble over who's problem it is.

If you can't make or fake eye contact you're less likely to:

• Be liked

• Get a job, get promoted, or not get loaded with BS chores at work

• Sell or buy something; make any deal

• Get invited to do cool stuff

• Be trusted. That means everything from handling money to personal info

• Get directions or other help from strangers (or even people you know)



anarkhos
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06 Mar 2012, 8:40 pm

Matt62 wrote:
I've learned to approximate it, by looking at the speaker's face, or some part of it. They tend to believe your looking in their eyes. But some people sure have a lot of freckles/moles/birthmarks! ROFLOL

Sincerely,
Matthew


Yea, the article mentions where to look (one eye then the other?) but I can't for the life of me recall what I look at specifically.

One thing I try to be more cognizant of is if I'm wearing shades. I often forget, and the response I get from people if I lift them when talking to them is huge.



MrXxx
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06 Mar 2012, 8:44 pm

anarkhos wrote:
MrXxx wrote:
Did you happen to check the other article I linked to? The reason I posted it, more so than credibility, is that it adresses the value of learning it for Autistics.


Yea, but where is the solution


Often right in front of you.

Image


It takes practice.


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06 Mar 2012, 8:46 pm

Yikes



Sweetleaf
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06 Mar 2012, 8:48 pm

anarkhos wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
I can certainly disagree with the general public on that....and if its so important to others than its their problem.


That's a very self-absorbed view, and as no man's an island I'd quibble over who's problem it is.

If you can't make or fake eye contact you're less likely to:

• Be liked

What's the point in being liked by people who would dislike me over something as minor as eye contact making me uncomfortable and distracting me?

• Get a job, get promoted, or not get loaded with BS chores at work

Got a job offer, there's no room to be promoted in this job anyways so I am not too worried about that. And I don't think the person wanting to hire me gives a damn how much eye contact I make.


• Sell or buy something; make any deal

I seem to be able to buy things just fine, and could sell things such as merchandise at a headshop for instance

• Get invited to do cool stuff

I've already been invited to do cool stuff more than once.

• Be trusted. That means everything from handling money to personal info

People worthy of my trust, trust me.

• Get directions or other help from strangers (or even people you know)


Like I am going to go up and talk to someone I've never even seen before to ask for directions.

Besides all that though...I simply cannot make normal eye contact, especially when it comes to people I don't trust or who make me anxious.


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MrXxx
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06 Mar 2012, 8:48 pm

anarkhos wrote:
Matt62 wrote:
I've learned to approximate it, by looking at the speaker's face, or some part of it. They tend to believe your looking in their eyes. But some people sure have a lot of freckles/moles/birthmarks! ROFLOL

Sincerely,
Matthew


Yea, the article mentions where to look (one eye then the other?) but I can't for the life of me recall what I look at specifically.

One thing I try to be more cognizant of is if I'm wearing shades. I often forget, and the response I get from people if I lift them when talking to them is huge.


Momentary direct eye contact is really all that's necessary. Any more than three seconds at a time makes a lot of people, even non-autistics uncomfortable. A glance now and then straight into the eyes seems to work just fine. Try looking directly into anyone's eyes while you're talking to them, and see how long it takes for them to break away. It's hardly ever for more than a few seconds.


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Sweetleaf
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06 Mar 2012, 8:49 pm

anyways I cannot fathom how anyone can seriously pay attention to what is being said while also trying to fake eye contact.


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MrXxx
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06 Mar 2012, 8:50 pm

anarkhos wrote:
Yikes


:lol: You should have seen the one I almost posted, if you think that's scary.


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MrXxx
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06 Mar 2012, 8:51 pm

Nightmares anyone?

[img][779:517]http://baconlettucetnt.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/eyes__nose_5783.jpg[/img]
[Mod. edit: resizing hand-tweaked. Please ensure images are 800x600 or less (this one is 4288x2848!)]


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bruinsy33
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06 Mar 2012, 8:53 pm

anarkhos wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
I can certainly disagree with the general public on that....and if its so important to others than its their problem.


That's a very self-absorbed view, and as no man's an island I'd quibble over who's problem it is.

If you can't make or fake eye contact you're less likely to:

• Be liked

• Get a job, get promoted, or not get loaded with BS chores at work

• Sell or buy something; make any deal

• Get invited to do cool stuff

• Be trusted. That means everything from handling money to personal info

• Get directions or other help from strangers (or even people you know)
I am not sure it is that black and white .I find eye contact difficult but I do make some ,certainly not as much as an NT but I don't really know of any human being who doesn't make any eye contact at all.



MrXxx
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06 Mar 2012, 8:55 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
anyways I cannot fathom how anyone can seriously pay attention to what is being said while also trying to fake eye contact.


Actually, I have that problem too, and I don't make much, if any contact at all when the other person is speaking, otherwise I don't hear enough of what they're saying. Quick glances, somewhat frequently is all I do. Apparently is must be enough since my DX'ing psychologist said I'm average with eye contact. I wasn't always though.

One thing I am almost certain of, and that's that I think Autistics in general (those that don't make enough eye contact) over estimate just how much eye contact NT's actually use as a rule.

I eventually found that it isn't anywhere near as much as I used to think.


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I'm not likely to be around much longer. As before when I first signed up here years ago, I'm finding that after a long hiatus, and after only a few days back on here, I'm spending way too much time here again already. So I'm requesting my account be locked, banned or whatever. It's just time. Until then, well, I dunno...


Last edited by MrXxx on 06 Mar 2012, 9:18 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Sweetleaf
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06 Mar 2012, 8:57 pm

MrXxx wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
anyways I cannot fathom how anyone can seriously pay attention to what is being said while also trying to fake eye contact.


Actually, I have that problem too, and I don't make much, if any contact at all when the other person is speaking, otherwise I don't hear enough of what they're saying. Quick glances, somewhat frequently is all I do. Apparently is must be enough since my DX'ing psychologist said I'm average with eye contact. I wasn't always though.


People notice my lack of it, but there is not a whole lot I can do about it other then try and explain it makes me uncomfortable and hard for me to focus.


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BlueBean
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06 Mar 2012, 9:12 pm

If I force myself to make eye contact when someone is speaking, I end up spacing out and just staring blankly. I also have a hard time actually paying attention to what they're saying. If it's someone I don't know well, it's even more difficult. To me, understanding the substance of what someone is saying is more important than their facial expression.

Maybe some people can handle the multitasking aspect of eye contact+interaction better than others, but not me. The best I could probably do would be quick glances at someone all the time, but doesn't that give the impression of being shifty or something? :?