Is this Introversion?

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Well, now I am curious. How does a lay person (like myself) observe "social intuition" in another? Likewise, how does a lay person determine if someone lacks "social intuition"? I ask, because I am now interested in observing other people to see if I can distinguish between an NT super introvert and an autistic introvert.

Thanks Kraftie. This post reminded me of a party my parents dragged me to when I was a teenager. There were both adults and kids there. I remember wandering from room to room to room, simply trying to make time pass more quickly. I endured. Afterwards, I remember telling my parents that I disliked these events, because I wasn’t good at being social with others.

It is most easily observed when there are a group of people.
If a person converses in a group without standing out, then they probably have social intuition.
It is generally hard for autistic person not to stand out in group conversation.
They will either not be able to say anything, not be able to sync with others' speech pauses to say something, say weird stuff, not get points that others are making, not get much response from others when they talk, look like they are not paying attention, stim weirdly, etc.
An NT introvert doesn't stand out in any of these ways during conversation.
Someone who is really introverted might not say much in a particular conversation, but they will have other conversations in which they act completely normal and don't stand out in any way.

This is quite fascinating. I am curious what you mean by conversing in a group?

Are you referring to a party or gathering where there are many people congregated in one area (say a big room or hall or even a courtyard) and the people are clustered in groups of 2 or 3, having conversations?

Or are you referring to when people are participating together in a single group conversation? Sort of like at a dinner party where lots of people are sitting together and lots of conversations are going on in parallel, but in fact it is one big discussion? Where sometimes, one person is talking and everyone is listening to that one person talk. Or perhaps, multiple side conversations are going on and it’s confusing who to speak to (and who to listen to). And, just when you are ready to say something relevant in the conversation, it has switched to a different topic.

By the way, I have noticed that I really dislike being in an unstructured social conversation and speaking when multiple people are listening to what I am saying. I am not certain why, but it (for me) I have a hard time “piecing together” what to say.

What’s interesting (at least for me) is that at work, I can easily lead a conversation (about a work-related topic I am familiar with) with multiple people listening at the same time with absolutely no problems. I am not certain why this is the case. Perhaps, because at work, people have to listen to what I say (because it’s relevant to their livelihood). But, outside of work, it’s something different. I just don’t know.

The group conversation I am thinking of is probably like the ones at the party, maybe 3 or more people chatting, a lot of small talk and changing topics quickly. When you think of something to say in response to someone else's comment, the conversation has probably moved on. People talk one after another in quick succession. Apparently the measured pause is almost zero. That requires a lot of synchronizing with each other spontaneously to make it happen. Autistic people usually have problems participating in such conversations. They will either not be able to join in or appear weird like saying something after topic has moved on, interjecting something offtopic, looking around because they can't join in, etc. Not all NTs are equally good at these, but most NT introverts would be able to participate if they wanted to. Most autistic people would have problems.

You probably feel more comfortable talking in front of people about work topics, because you know your work well, and it is clear in your mind. Perhaps you built up many of your projects in concrete ways, so you know all the steps and results and how things are connected, and you don't have to piece things together in real-time, it is already there and organized. Other topics, you may have to organize in real-time, and that is much harder.

Thanks for the explanation. When I am in this situation (of 3 or more people with the topic changing quickly), I usually am an observer, rather than an active participant. Occasionally, if the conversation changes to something I have knowledge of or an opinion about, I can utter one or two short sentences. But, my main participation in those situations is as an observer/listener. Occasionally, a topic will switch to something I have knowledge about (unfortunately, this is not often as there are very few topics I have knowledge of that I can speak confidently about). And, in those situations, I can start talking. Eventually (and more often than not, very quickly), someone will change the subject to something else. I will then be disappointed (as I have more to say on the topic). But, then, I simply go back into listen mode.

I don’t find this interaction style enjoyable at all. When I am in this situation, to be polite, I will try to just pretend/feign interest and hope to escape as quickly as possible.

As a note, I am not altogether good at 1:1 social conversation either. Unless we can find a topic to discuss and stick to it. And, usually, I prefer to let the other person “drive” the conversation (that is, the other person does most of the talking). There are occasions when I am able to free-associate (say we are discussing some topic and someone says a word that reminds me of something else I was thinking about, I am able to discuss that next topic). But that happens infrequently.

My biggest challenge is figuring out what to say to another human being, when in these social situations. Sometimes, a thought comes to me. More often than not, it does not. I work better when there are three people, so I can just follow the conversation (and am not required to contribute to it, leaving the others to navigate through).


This is correct. It’s the “real-time” organization that I find hard. I always thought that this (doing it in real-time) was an issue with Executive Functioning. But, some of your other posts suggest otherwise. Then again, I perhaps may be misinterpreting your other posts.

I think the problem organizing the thoughts in real-time could be ef problems.
I have the same problem myself.
Basically, my mind is blank, and I don't know what to say, unless it is already organized.
Or it could be language.
Possibly your and my brains are not that good at organizing words in particularly into coherent idea or narrative.
Or maybe still ef problems, it is unclear to me what the problem is.
I don't have general ef problems in the area of not organizing words though.
I can handle many ef demands well and even at high level.
I do suck at planning though.
How is your planning?

After reading more detailed descriptions from you, I revise my earlier statement that most of your issue in this situation could be accounted for by introversion. I think it is autism accounting for most instead. Introversion may still play a role, but the descriptions of internal processes match better with autism.

What I find fascinating, is that at work, I don’t have this problem. But, perhaps this is because I obsessively think about work all the time. I immerse myself in all the details. So, when it is my time to speak, I have everything organized in my mind. And this allows me to speak quite coherently.

I have a theory (well, not really a theory, more just a thought) about how my mind works. I have this need to do distinct categorization of information. And, unless the information is categorized in a particular way (according to a particular taxonomy), I am unable to fully process the information and essentially “freeze up”. But once it is categorized, I can pretty much process the information like a computer. Probably, if I prepared/practiced more for these “social encounters”, I would do a better job.


The psychologist who diagnosed me indicated that I had EF issues in unstructured settings. She mentioned this could be social situations or a new project, job, or responsibility. Which makes sense. As I don’t function well in novel satiations, where I don’t have a “pattern” to follow.


I can be a really good planner. But only if I am planning something that is similar to something I have done before. As in those situations, I have a pattern that I can follow. As an example, at work, I help plan out software releases. For me, it’s really easy to do, because I have done it so many times before.

I also like planning out trips. Like, when I took my daughter on a college trip several years back, I really enjoyed mapping out the sequence in which we would visit the colleges. My goal was to see as many in the fewest number of days. I guess, in some ways, I treat planning as solving a puzzle. And, I love solving puzzles.


This is helpful. As I was not altogether certain. Which is why I asked.

Can you describe this categorization process some more?
I am curious about how it works.
I might want to use something like it to be better at organizing my thoughts and discussing things with people.

As I think about it, this need to categorize information is probably in response to my obsession (and love) of details. I become very agitated when I start to collect a bunch of information, but am unable to find it. So, I guess this desire to categorize things is a coping mechanism.

I would say most of my categorization happens at work. As this is where I spend most of my time collecting new data. Most definitely my work (software systems analysis) is a good fit, because it involves dealing with tons of details. Each of those details needs to be organized and managed.

I have various ways to categorize things. Some, I do visually (by creating diagrams). Some, I do in writing (I tend to write very detailed and quite lengthy numbered specifications). I particularly like organizing information in tabular form (either tables in word documents or excel spreadsheets).

So, what is this categorization process? I am not entirely certain. I suppose I scan all the details and begin grouping things together in “buckets” that make sense to me. It’s more of a bottoms-up process. Once I collect all the details, I begin to recognize patterns. Then, I can organize it. It works for me, because it allows me to track a lot of information. It makes me happy, when I have everything organized.

I used to assume I was an introvert. But I'm now a lot less sure.
Since I can find myself sometimes feeling drained and sometimes energised by social interaction.

Do you enjoy small talk with your wife OP? I find small talk hard with people i don't actually properly like.

I don't really enjoy small talk with anyone (including my wife, kids). When I talk with them, it's mainly to exchange information. When I am with others, I prefer to be in "listen mode". This way, I simply follow the conversation and can add content, if I feel I have something interesting to say.

At work, it's a different thing altogether. I can talk for hours about the projects I work on. There are always problems to solve.

I am kind of the same, but i have a crap part time job. I do study though, and conversation about that interests me. I like to be silly and talk about nonsense, that's not so much small talk as humour or exploring alternate/silly ways of looking at stuff. Do you feel you got answers from this thread to your question?