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Misery
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28 Nov 2015, 5:23 am

Kiprobalhato wrote:
Rockymtchris wrote:
I do not mind if someone "misteakingly" calls me something like "miss" or "mam".


when it happens, i get joy from being mistaken for a female.


Same here.

I really dont get tired of it.

Of course, liking it at all just pushes me further into the abnormal zone, doesnt it, feh.



DevilKisses
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28 Nov 2015, 1:06 pm

NerdyAnimeGirl wrote:
I originally thought that gender didn't matter -- as is the general notion in our society today.
I have since changed my perspective on it. While each individual is unique, there are definitely
traits/behaviors that are gender specific.

While there are outliers (like myself) who are female, but enjoy more male hobbies and can talk
far more easily to males than other females we are extremely rare (less than 1% of females I'd say).

I guess that kind of applies to very gendered face to face interactions. I still don't think I have actual female traits. Just traits stereotyped as female.


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NerdyAnimeGirl
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28 Nov 2015, 1:36 pm

DevilKisses wrote:
NerdyAnimeGirl wrote:
I originally thought that gender didn't matter -- as is the general notion in our society today.
I have since changed my perspective on it. While each individual is unique, there are definitely
traits/behaviors that are gender specific.

While there are outliers (like myself) who are female, but enjoy more male hobbies and can talk
far more easily to males than other females we are extremely rare (less than 1% of females I'd say).

I guess that kind of applies to very gendered face to face interactions. I still don't think I have actual female traits. Just traits stereotyped as female.

For me, it took dating other females to understand the difference between myself and them. XD
Honestly, NT men and women are extremely dissimilar... yin and yang.. practically opposites.
Asperger's has been called 'exaggerated version of a typically "male" brain,' and I agree with that sentiment.
I used to think 'smart' women thought similarly to me, but they don't. I think in a more male way most of the time.

Stereotypical Male traits - logically rather than emotionally driven, internal moral code, chivalrous, dominant, manly, not vain, liking manly things (video games, e-sports, sports, math, philosophy, science)
Stereotypical Female traits - emotionally rather than logically driven, internal social code, self or child-serving, submissive, feminine, vain, liking girly things (fashion, shopping, makeup)
Stereotypes = the Norm (i.e. the vast majority of people).
Stereotypes are not to be discredited by outliers (most people on this forum are outliers).
Outliers by definition don't fit the Norm.

If you look at the STEM fields (Science, Technology, Engineering and Math) they are mostly male.*
If you look at hospitality fields (Nursing, Waitressing, Maid) they are mostly female.
*despite more than equal opportunity for women to enter STEM fields
(STEM companies are given incentives to hire women, so if anything,
the # of women in STEM fields could be artificially inflated by this)


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Edenthiel
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28 Nov 2015, 4:01 pm

NerdyAnimeGirl wrote:
I originally thought that gender didn't matter -- as is the general notion in our society today.
I have since changed my perspective on it. While each individual is unique, there are definitely
traits/behaviors that are gender specific.

While there are outliers (like myself) who are female, but enjoy more male hobbies and can talk
far more easily to males than other females we are extremely rare (less than 1% of females I'd say).

But how much of it is because only 1% is truly interested in such things and how much is because our culture(s) not only teach us we can't be interested in those things but actually do their best to shame us into believing it?


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emterhud
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28 Nov 2015, 8:29 pm

Well, I'm non binary, so gender doesn't really care much for me. I think the idea of different gender roles is outdated, as is the idea that there are only two genders.



CockneyRebel
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28 Nov 2015, 10:39 pm

emterhud wrote:
Well, I'm non binary, so gender doesn't really care much for me. I think the idea of different gender roles is outdated, as is the idea that there are only two genders.


I'm also on the same wavelength.


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Kiprobalhato
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29 Nov 2015, 2:12 am

Misery wrote:
Same here.

I really dont get tired of it.

Of course, liking it at all just pushes me further into the abnormal zone, doesnt it, feh.


doesn't happen anymore IRL now that i grow out my facial hair, but before that it happened. first time i can remember was with an older man.

(here too, i rarely feel like correcting people when i'm referred to as she")


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Edenthiel
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29 Nov 2015, 12:26 pm

Um, "thank you", to everyone here who has said that they don't really care about gender & being "misgendered". This thread has taught me that apparently I care far more about gender than I wish I did. Partly from a conservative christian, gender-binary upbringing and partly because I'm biologically trans (with all sorts of mixed traits and attributes). I've heard that will simmer down once I've lived as myself for five years or so and forgotten who I had to be; I sure hope so. I'd much rather live in a world where gender didn't have to matter so much. My apologies if I've been too focused on it lately. Though I'm still going to be actively pro- trans equality, in hopes of changing the world by the time my daughter is an adult.


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NerdyAnimeGirl
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29 Nov 2015, 12:38 pm

Edenthiel wrote:
NerdyAnimeGirl wrote:
I originally thought that gender didn't matter -- as is the general notion in our society today.
I have since changed my perspective on it. While each individual is unique, there are definitely
traits/behaviors that are gender specific.

While there are outliers (like myself) who are female, but enjoy more male hobbies and can talk
far more easily to males than other females we are extremely rare (less than 1% of females I'd say).

But how much of it is because only 1% is truly interested in such things and how much is because our culture(s) not only teach us we can't be interested in those things but actually do their best to shame us into believing it?

I don't see society shaming women out of STEM fields, actually it's encouraged. The government even gives monetary incentives for companies that hire women in such fields. So it's the opposite, really.

Even with these incentives women still don't want to be in STEM fields, lol.


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Edenthiel
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29 Nov 2015, 1:16 pm

NerdyAnimeGirl wrote:
Edenthiel wrote:
NerdyAnimeGirl wrote:
I originally thought that gender didn't matter -- as is the general notion in our society today.
I have since changed my perspective on it. While each individual is unique, there are definitely
traits/behaviors that are gender specific.

While there are outliers (like myself) who are female, but enjoy more male hobbies and can talk
far more easily to males than other females we are extremely rare (less than 1% of females I'd say).

But how much of it is because only 1% is truly interested in such things and how much is because our culture(s) not only teach us we can't be interested in those things but actually do their best to shame us into believing it?

I don't see society shaming women out of STEM fields, actually it's encouraged. The government even gives monetary incentives for companies that hire women in such fields. So it's the opposite, really.

Even with these incentives women still don't want to be in STEM fields, lol.


It's not so much that they don't want to, it's why the don't want to. Even with those incentives our culture very much still tells girls they need to look pretty, not be smart (and therefore independent). :-|


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Raleigh
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29 Nov 2015, 1:58 pm

Kiprobalhato wrote:
i rarely feel like correcting people when i'm referred to as she

If I corrected people who called me he I would still be misrepresentating myself.


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nerdygirl
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29 Nov 2015, 5:07 pm

Edenthiel wrote:
NerdyAnimeGirl wrote:
Edenthiel wrote:
NerdyAnimeGirl wrote:
I originally thought that gender didn't matter -- as is the general notion in our society today.
I have since changed my perspective on it. While each individual is unique, there are definitely
traits/behaviors that are gender specific.

While there are outliers (like myself) who are female, but enjoy more male hobbies and can talk
far more easily to males than other females we are extremely rare (less than 1% of females I'd say).

But how much of it is because only 1% is truly interested in such things and how much is because our culture(s) not only teach us we can't be interested in those things but actually do their best to shame us into believing it?

I don't see society shaming women out of STEM fields, actually it's encouraged. The government even gives monetary incentives for companies that hire women in such fields. So it's the opposite, really.

Even with these incentives women still don't want to be in STEM fields, lol.


It's not so much that they don't want to, it's why the don't want to. Even with those incentives our culture very much still tells girls they need to look pretty, not be smart (and therefore independent). :-|


*Most* of the women I know have no desire for anything STEM-related.
And the ones that do...are/were working in the field.
I grew up before there was a huge push for girls to go into STEM fields, so the girls had to be very self-motivated to go against the tide and get into the fields they really wanted to get into.
So, now that STEM is pushed for girls, making it easier for them, you'd *think* you'd see more interest.
I think it is really not inherently there for *most* women, even though it sure is easier now for those who do have the interest.

I think the biggest change might be for women who might have chosen nursing instead of another science-related field because it was considered to be more of suitable career for women.

My AP-calculus class in high school was about half boys, half girls. All the girls went into something math-or-science related OR music. Go figure. This was 1993.
You have to start with girls that can actually do the work... Most of the women I know are not geared that way.

The stereotypes are there for a reason. Women talk more than men, in general, partly because they are just generally *better* at language. Men tend to do better in math because they *tend* to be more logical.
Of course, there are exceptions.

I am part of a homeschool group. Most of the moms can't even handle teaching their own kids Algebra I (they farm it out and get tutors.) I exceed all of them at math skills EXCEPT for my friend (a woman) who is an astrophysicist.

Should girls be encouraged to enter STEM fields? Sure.
But I don't think the encouragement is going to necessarily make more girls enter those fields.



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29 Nov 2015, 6:06 pm

nerdygirl wrote:
*Most* of the women I know have no desire for anything STEM-related.
And the ones that do...are/were working in the field.
I grew up before there was a huge push for girls to go into STEM fields, so the girls had to be very self-motivated to go against the tide and get into the fields they really wanted to get into.
So, now that STEM is pushed for girls, making it easier for them, you'd *think* you'd see more interest.
I think it is really not inherently there for *most* women, even though it sure is easier now for those who do have the interest.

I think the biggest change might be for women who might have chosen nursing instead of another science-related field because it was considered to be more of suitable career for women.

My AP-calculus class in high school was about half boys, half girls. All the girls went into something math-or-science related OR music. Go figure. This was 1993.
You have to start with girls that can actually do the work... Most of the women I know are not geared that way.

The stereotypes are there for a reason. Women talk more than men, in general, partly because they are just generally *better* at language. Men tend to do better in math because they *tend* to be more logical.
Of course, there are exceptions.

I am part of a homeschool group. Most of the moms can't even handle teaching their own kids Algebra I (they farm it out and get tutors.) I exceed all of them at math skills EXCEPT for my friend (a woman) who is an astrophysicist.

Should girls be encouraged to enter STEM fields? Sure.
But I don't think the encouragement is going to necessarily make more girls enter those fields.


Respectfully, I disagree - to a degree. I think for many the social pressure to not appear capable (in areas where men are expected to do so) is fairly strong & this directly influences their choices. In an ideal world, there would be no need to "encourage" girls to go into STEM or while in school stay on a STEM track because socially there would be no pressure to do otherwise. Sadly we don't live in that world and the encouragement is needed because there are so few to start with.


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andrethemoogle
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29 Nov 2015, 6:30 pm

If we're talking about talking to someone, I don't care what gender a person is. I judge them based on their personality and how they act, that's it.

On the subject of attraction, I am attracted to women and not men.



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29 Nov 2015, 6:57 pm

DevilKisses wrote:
I'm just wondering how much you guys care about people's gender. I don't usually care unless it's a gender specific conversation. I like how easy it is to hide gender on the internet. Unfortunately some people have no clue how to interact with people without knowing their gender.


I'd like to recommend Cordelia Fine's book, "Delusions of Gender: The Real Science Behind Sex Differences", if you're interested in an alternate view from the standard "biology is destiny" trope that is generally up for offer on the internets. Not strictly on topic, but it is one reason I care even less about gender now than I previously did (which wasn't much).



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29 Nov 2015, 7:08 pm

It's all about context. Sometimes in a conversation gender matters, sometimes it doesn't.


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