I told my psychologist I wanted to kill myself...

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That doesn't quite make sense in my head. Explain?

hey, why would you do this to her? She obviously can't read your mind, can't be exactly sure of who you are..she can only base her opinions on how you behave and what you tell her (so what you CHOOSE to disclose to the outside world). In her field of work, she is required to be extra-careful! Think about her well-being a bit too! If someone tried this with you, would you think it was funny?

I think there are a few things that are commonly understood by society as being NOT a laughing matter...we should respect that, because we can hurt people..one of them being this type of joke (which hurts and confuses people, especially when they care about you).

Last edited by northern_light_girl on 30 May 2008, 9:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

The way of the shrink is to enforce conformity.
And the way of the animal subconscious is personal advantage... i.e. selfishness.


As such... even conversing with a shrink, any normal shrink, is a competition to see who can "fix" who.
The shrink wants to make the client "more normal", which equates to being a mere tool of society like themselves. They want you to be docile and compliant... not for your own sake but for the sake of society itself. They care NOTHING for individual wants or needs but that the beast called Society can be served.
If you value your individuality, you will fight back. For every move they make to normalise you, it is vital to resist... and where strength allows, to try and denormalise them in return. If at all possible, try to turn them from an enemy to an ally.... by changing THEIR way of thinking instead. By manipulating them to your own agenda rather than being manipulated by theirs. As long as they are NOT on your side, they are still a potential threat and a liability to your individuality.


Shaking up the "status quo" is a vital part of change. Enforcing normality suppresses change and brings about stagnancy and decay.

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never seen a doctor...but your description is extreme:( What's so bad about trying to give one some tools to be able to better INTERRACT (not conform) with people? If someone comes in and doesn't understand why he/she can't make friends and feels isolated..is it bad to explain to this person what he/she could do? I don't think the goal is to gratify Society...it's also to offer relief and some tools (guidelines) to the individual, with the proper explanation of each tool's purpose...

But again, don't know...if many doctors resemble doctor Phil..ewwwwww, bleah!

The way of a psychotherapist is to act as a consultant, to help you solve problems where the mind interacts with biology, or the mind interacts with society. Whether this goal is actually reflected in the way therapists do their job is certainly a matter of discussion. But there is no secret conspiracy to enforce conformity. "Alright, fellas, get out there and pound those round pegs into their square holes!"

My experiences and schooling in this area have indicated QUITE the opposite. If anything, the therapists I've visited have been astoundingly respectful, and SUPPORTIVE of my differences. I'm sorry if your personal experiences have jaded you on this, but your very language - "shrink" reminiscent of "head shrinker" - betrays the fact that this is more a matter of personal piss and vinegar than anything else.

If you go into a therapist's office with a chip on your shoulder, and a conviction that he/she is just a head shrinker there to turn you into a drone... then GEE GOLLY SURPRISE - you aren't gonna get much out of the session. Don't poison the well for someone who might actually get some good out of the experience.

I don't think that's completely accurate, however you look at it people with Aspergers are disadvantaged (not necessarily in a bad way I don't mean) simply because there are more 'NTs' or whatever you want to call them in the world, and things work there way not the AS way. So some psychs and psychologists simply help their clients by helping them to understand how 'NTs' work, not so that they can be more like them because you don't have to change who you are, im not saying that in any way, but so you can find a way of working with them in your own way.

Not all psychiatrists and psychologists are these horrible people you make out, some are sure, I've met a couple, but I've met some lovely ones to, and that's in the mental health system.
I haven't met a single one who has tried to change me though, the worst I've had is 'get over it' and 'maybe if you ate some more vegetables' and things along those lines although I don't remember a lot. I don't think anyone as challenge my individuality or maybe I am just to stubborn to have noticed it.

This isn't about good or bad. This is about the way each of us is programmed... both at a genetic level and on a mental level.

You might claim that offering relief to a person is the real goal... but I say it is just a means to an end. Whatever is necessary to achieve its imperitive is what the beast will do.... cruelty and kindness all the same.




It isn't a secret conspiracy; It is the nature of the beast... so to speak.
It is hardwired into all humans to varying extents on a genetic level.... more into neurotypicals and less into Auts. Genes have been favoured which promote cooperation, and conformity (and anything which enforces conformity) is promoted toward that same end.... as conformity makes for easier cooperation.

Whether their conscious mind justifies it as "being helpful" or not, they are still doing no more than they are programmed to do, and "helpful" is entirely subjective.



Crocodile tears.... all the more convincing because the therapists believe it too. Ironic, in context, but I suspect they don't have a mental grasp on the higher purposes that they are serving.... what really drives them to be the way they are and do as they do.
The fact that they're being puppetted is no reason not to consider them the enemy though... especially if their ideas of "help" become seriously dissonant to one's own, personal requirements. At the end of it all, they're just tools... drilling into your head to fiddle with your brain, even via niceties...



Good?
Like becoming another shotoclone?
Like succumbing to the plague that is normality?


Look at your arm for a moment. Look REALLY closely. Chances are you can't see closely enough, but your entire body is made of cells. There are different types, but comparitively few compared to the sheer number of purposely identical cells.... whose only worth is as part of a mass mob construct. They have no individual value.
Now see... give humanity time, and society will have become as you are, and people will become as those cells.
That is where it is headed.



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You've GOT to find a different way to do whatever your joking was meant to do... y'know, one that won't land you in the mental ward...

Mw99 you have mentioned suicide quite a bit recently in you posts. You might not consciously want to kill yourself I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt on that, but it is clearly something that is on your mind. Not that that there is anything wrong with that. It can be frustration in my experience.

I think the shrink is on the money, she is doing what she is trained to do. If you don't want to go, don't go.

I think about suicide from time to time. It has been fairly regularly recently. I actually had a candid discussion with my ex-shrink about it. I've never had clinical depression, and I don't believe I suffer from suicidal episodes, which is where the concept of suicidal ideation comes from. I'm not drawn to the morbid side of it (I rather not think about it), and it is worth pointing out that those that are depressed can equally have morbid thought about other people and things not just themselves, that is why these thought are part of the illness. From my understanding these kinds of episode are short-term, microcosmic, and far from rational, however I have always thought about my death in quite a rational and long term way. With all the connotations of suicide the term ‘self euthanasia' is probably a better.

Having said that, I live with a great deal of uncertainty, and I have a high degree of perfectionism inbuilt. The uncertainty is many-fold for reasons that are too complex to go into here. However my dilemma is this: I desperately want the chance to be myself, however this is inhibited by one of my co-morbids, which there is little available incite on because it is on the fringes of what we know, therefore I have I have no certainly an no-one can offer me any. Also the nature of the problem is it creates general uncertainty on a day to day basis. I have made many concerted efforts to try and figure things out. I have made progress on things I can do myself, and am constantly trying to get people to help me on things that I clearly can't. I am pretty relentless and dedicated. Possibly because of ego, self-respect, or whatever you want to call it. My frustration is directed those that could help are set in there comfy roles are textbook diagnosticians, and about as far away from the hands on science as you can get. I need somebody to work with me and really be able to think about and explore all avenues (that ironically I would be able to do myself if I didn't have this problem). I'm holding out for a very slim possibility, you see. Even my GP has been frank with me is saying there probably not going to be a solution anytime soon. The frustration is pretty immense. There is a point where you could say: ‘even if there is a chance is it really wroth hanging on when you can just as well be faced with yet more disappointment?’ I think if I had clinical depression I would have given in years ago. I wouldn’t even need to rationalise it. It is weird, but I have some emotional blunting that makes it very difficult to hold any emotion in my head for more than an instant. Of course there are fluctuations on the urgency of this decision because the considerations are highly complex (especially if you going to be rational about it). At the moment my ego believes that it is worth sticking around for a while longer because the unknown still offers some opportunities. It could be that there could be a simple environmental contributor to my problem that could be removed, or some other discovery that could lead to a treatment.

Personally I would ask yourself what it is you want out of diagnosis m99. For me diagnosis was something I acquired along the way, by chance. It may prove useful in getting further treatment but the labels I have still haven't help me solve this problem. I really don't want more labels if that is all they are offering.

if you have issue to do with emotions, anxiety, etc give shrinks a try. Some of them can be good. Or try learning CBT techniques out of books. I learned a long time ago that many of those thing are in the feasible and possible scope, even if it doesn't seem like it at the time. It is when you get into the nuero-functional side of things that is is a complete black hole.

Besides... there is no inherant wrongness with thoughts of suicide.

Everyone is their own keeper.... and their life is theirs to do with as they please.

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<insert argument about the value of human life, your responsibility to others, and the probability that you are not thinking straight if you are suicidal>

While I agree, there is a distinction between a an episodic microcosm. Some people who have these episodes genuinely would not have a reason to kill themselves otherwise, they have told me themselves. It is a very confusing state to be in, I gather. I'm not making a moral case against it however. It is impossible to tell what is going through another person's head.

That is exactly it, not everyone that want to kill themselves or though about it is suicidal, even if the majority are.

<Insert smug dismissal of the misguided delusions of value and responsibility, and warning regarding the anti-suicide propaganda of a society built on genetic programming that doesn't care how much you're suffering as long as you stay alive>

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I think I am quite different enough, thanks. *grins* I don't think I've ever been accused of being just another boring drone before. I have to admit it's quite a refreshing change. LOL

In any case, I can't imagine how I could become more insistant on my own individuality without becoming a sociopath, a hermit, or bombing federal buildings - none of which I am inclined to do. The problem with being so fiercely opposed to being a part of society, is that you very quickly find yourself alone or at least surrounded by people you consider fools. Now if that sounds like heaven to you, that's your call. I'd rather not go that route, personally.