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How do you interact with people with Down's Syndrome?

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Zoonic
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13 May 2009, 8:21 pm

BelindatheNobody wrote:
Zoonic wrote:
BelindatheNobody wrote:
Zoonic wrote:
Down's people will inevitably cease to exist in all places except for trashy third world ghettoes.

And we would soon follow. But maybe you're too.... blind to see that.
But off topic, and my anger is starting to make me prone to things that aren't allowed on wrongplanet, so.


Just the low functioning autists would follow and I have no objections to that what so ever. The future won't require social skills the same way, it's already happening now in the computer age. More and more people will be like really high functioning aspies.

When you cook or craft something there's always some spoils in the process, in order to achieve the refined product. The autists and low functioning aspies are the spoils while the high functioning aspies are prototypes for feature NT's.

Oh, and what on earth makes you think that they would be able to tell apart how we function while we're floating around in the womb? Futhermore! Functioning levels are not constant; in most, they change throughout ones life! And who is to say they would want even us "high functioning" people around, for pete's sake.


Eventually NT's will become more socially reclusive anyway. They won't need the pack to survive. So even if they kill of all aspies, which they will, they will evolve and become more like high functioning aspies in time anyway. Higher intelligence, more socially reclusive etc.

I'm an aspie and if I could push a magic button that would remove all regular autists from the earth, I wouldn't hesitate for a second.



Danielismyname
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13 May 2009, 8:26 pm

Funny thing, run-of-the-mill Asperger's tends to be more severe than Down's syndrome in symptom severity and handicap. The only plus is that those with AS have a normal life expectancy (O, and superficial things like normal looks, and a greater chance of having a normal IQ).



Zoonic
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13 May 2009, 8:29 pm

Danielismyname wrote:
Funny thing, run-of-the-mill Asperger's tends to be more severe than Down's syndrome in symptom severity and handicap. The only plus is that those with AS have a normal life expectancy (O, and superficial things like normal looks, and a greater chance of having a normal IQ).


An asperger handicap is relative while a Down's handicap is a static handicap the same way being born without legs and teeth is a handicap to a predator and being born without gills would be a handicap to a fish.

Many asperger diagnosed people display signs of retardation. I'm angered by this because I think they should be high functioning autist instead of AS.



Danielismyname
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13 May 2009, 8:36 pm

Zoonic wrote:
An asperger handicap is relative while a Down's handicap is a static handicap the same way being born without legs and teeth is a handicap to a predator and being born without gills would be a handicap to a fish.


That doesn't make sense, as Asperger's is a lifelong neurological disorder which affects several key areas of human development; for example, the delay in social development is just as much a handicap as being born without claws and teeth if you were a lion.

The only reason people with run-of-the-mill AS survive so well is because of allowances made by parents/society, kinda like those with Down's syndrome. In other words, most with AS are a burden on the "healthy" and "normal" population just as much as someone with Autism or Down's.



Zoonic
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13 May 2009, 8:39 pm

Danielismyname wrote:
Zoonic wrote:
An asperger handicap is relative while a Down's handicap is a static handicap the same way being born without legs and teeth is a handicap to a predator and being born without gills would be a handicap to a fish.


That doesn't make sense, as Asperger's is a lifelong neurological disorder which affects several key areas of human development; for example, the delay in social development is just as much a handicap as being born without claws and teeth if you were a lion.

The only reason people with run-of-the-mill AS survive so well is because of allowances made by parents/society, kinda like those with Down's syndrome. In other words, most with AS are a burden on the "healthy" and "normal" population just as much as someone with Autism or Down's.


Asperger's is a neurological variation, not a disorder. Asperger people can survive on their own in the right environment while a Down's person can never survive in any society on his own. This makes the handicap aspect of Asperger's highly relative while Down's is a static handicap.



Brittany2907
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13 May 2009, 9:10 pm

I have a cousin with DS & don't really understand the question, "How do you interact with people with DS". I just talk to him.


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Zoonic
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13 May 2009, 9:14 pm

Brittany2907 wrote:
I have a cousin with DS & don't really understand the question, "How do you interact with people with DS". I just talk to him.


What do you do if he starts masturbating in public, which some down's people are infamous for doing? Do you just talk to him then as well?



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13 May 2009, 9:22 pm

Zoonic wrote:
Brittany2907 wrote:
I have a cousin with DS & don't really understand the question, "How do you interact with people with DS". I just talk to him.


What do you do if he starts masturbating in public, which some down's people are infamous for doing? Do you just talk to him then as well?


Well I've never had him do that. Of course if he did do that I would tell him to stop, but I don't know what I'd say to the other people who saw.


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Danielismyname
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13 May 2009, 9:31 pm

Zoonic wrote:
Asperger's is a neurological variation, not a disorder. Asperger people can survive on their own in the right environment while a Down's person can never survive in any society on his own. This makes the handicap aspect of Asperger's highly relative while Down's is a static handicap.


First part, incorrect. It's classified as a disorder in all official sources. Second part, incorrect, as I know of a young female with Down's who lives by herself, who drives and also works, all without allowances, which is far better than most with AS I've seen.

I have a lovely report here that measures adaptive functioning of individuals with Autism and Asperger's compared to Down's, and the latter have a far better outcome (even compared to AS).



TheDoctor82
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13 May 2009, 9:42 pm

I treat them a lot better than NTs usually do...that includes the people who have to care for them.



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13 May 2009, 10:06 pm

Danielismyname wrote:
Zoonic wrote:
Asperger's is a neurological variation, not a disorder. Asperger people can survive on their own in the right environment while a Down's person can never survive in any society on his own. This makes the handicap aspect of Asperger's highly relative while Down's is a static handicap.


First part, incorrect. It's classified as a disorder in all official sources. Second part, incorrect, as I know of a young female with Down's who lives by herself, who drives and also works, all without allowances, which is far better than most with AS I've seen.

I have a lovely report here that measures adaptive functioning of individuals with Autism and Asperger's compared to Down's, and the latter have a far better outcome (even compared to AS).

Can a person with Down's Syndrome become a physician? I don't think so. I plan to matriculate to medical school in a few years after spending a couple years as a workaholic living much below my means in order to save myself from half the debt that is typically involved. In 2 years, I will have 3 degrees in which one bridges on to another.



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13 May 2009, 10:06 pm

Danielismyname wrote:
Zoonic wrote:
Asperger's is a neurological variation, not a disorder. Asperger people can survive on their own in the right environment while a Down's person can never survive in any society on his own. This makes the handicap aspect of Asperger's highly relative while Down's is a static handicap.


First part, incorrect. It's classified as a disorder in all official sources. Second part, incorrect, as I know of a young female with Down's who lives by herself, who drives and also works, all without allowances, which is far better than most with AS I've seen.

I have a lovely report here that measures adaptive functioning of individuals with Autism and Asperger's compared to Down's, and the latter have a far better outcome (even compared to AS).


Adaptive functioning is totally irrelevant because it only proves what we already know, Down's people are like ret*d but happy little pig NT's. They are severely malformed NT's suffering from retardation. This only enhances some of their NT traits, making them cuddly and socializing and thus sympathetic in the eyes of many.

Asperger is classified as a disorder because of the handicap aspect but it is in reality just a variation. As I said, the handicap aspect is highly relative and in many cultures, the real AS people are overlooked in favor of high functioning autists because of incompetent psychiatrists. Southern Europe and USA are examples of this, people who are in fact high functioning autists are being diagnosed with AS and people who are undiagnosed AS just get a "kick in the butt".



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13 May 2009, 10:20 pm

I do disagree with the government enforcing eugenics upon the populace. Left Wing societies tend to disregard the needs of the individual in favor of faceless utilitarianism.



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13 May 2009, 10:21 pm

timeisdead wrote:
I do disagree with the government enforcing eugenics upon the populace. Left Wing societies tend to disregard the needs of the individual in favor of faceless utilitarianism.


Aren't most of them left wing societies? Right Wing usually do the same thing, but for "religion".

That's why I'm no longer political...and what does this have anything to do with DS?



Danielismyname
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13 May 2009, 10:22 pm

timeisdead wrote:
Can a person with Down's Syndrome become a physician?


Does it matter? Can a person with Autism be one (no)? Can someone with AS be one, yes, but it's very rare.

Zoonic,

Adaptive functioning is how you adapt to society in vocational pursuits, academia and social functioning, which is the baseline for how well someone can adapt to society. And you're incorrect again, as it's Europe and Australia that lumps people with HFA into AS (both have the same level of intelligence, which is why they do it), whereas the US uses the standardized DSM-IV-TR (which uses language development, among other things).

So again, if people with AS can't adapt as well as someone with DS in today's society, how does that make AS any better than DS? Not to mention that it's morally unsound to base someone's right to life on a disorder they do or don't have.

I can easily say that said person with DS that's independent is far more deserving of life than a leech such as yourself, but that's incorrect, as it's your disorder that makes you how you are.



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13 May 2009, 10:29 pm

TheDoctor82 wrote:
timeisdead wrote:
I do disagree with the government enforcing eugenics upon the populace. Left Wing societies tend to disregard the needs of the individual in favor of faceless utilitarianism.


Aren't most of them left wing societies? Right Wing usually do the same thing, but for "religion".

That's why I'm no longer political...and what does this have anything to do with DS?

What does this have to do with DS? Forced eugenics has been advocated in the thread. I was simply pointing out that most left wing societies have no regard for the individual and only care for the perceived good of the collective.