27 May 2018, 7:27 pm
cubedemon6073 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
cubedemon6073 wrote:
I never said what you said I said. What I said is that positivism, optimism, hard work, discipline, focus, etc are not panaceas.
Then why do they work so well for everyone who employs their use?
They don't always. Its just that successes are reported more then failures and besides I can apply my discipline, hard work, focus to digging a hole and refilling it all day. But if I'm gaining no return on my investment then what good was hard work, discipline, focus, etc? One can work hard and focused yet unproductive.
Another thing.
Let's say one has a maze and 50 rats to run the maze to get to the cheese and there are 20 paths to get to the cheese. After one rat discovers one path the path closes up so no other rat can choose the same path. 30 rats won't get to the cheese and 20 will. In time, the rats come up with engineering techniques to get the 30 across.
BUT, None of the rats ever question the maze itself or question that there could be something better then the maze that lays outside. In fact, none of them can conceive there is an outside of the maze. So, as more time passes cheese supplies diminish until the rats come up with more and more ingenuitive ways to kill each other. And, as the last rat dies he realizes there was an outside and they should have went there. And, then he dies.
No matter who wins and loses we're still rats in a maze.
What is beyond the walls we live and can we go beyond?
Consider perhaps:
The Allegory of the Cave, or Plato's Cave, was presented by the Greek philosopher Plato in his work Republic (514a–520a) to compare "the effect of education (παιδεία) and the lack of it on our nature". It is written as a dialogue between Plato's brother Glaucon and his mentor Socrates, narrated by the latter. The allegory is presented after the analogy of the sun (508b–509c) and the analogy of the divided line (509d–511e). All three are characterized in relation to dialectic at the end of Books VII and VIII (531d–534e).
Imprisonment in the cave
Plato begins by having Socrates ask Glaucon to imagine a cave where people have been imprisoned from birth. These prisoners are chained so that their legs and necks are fixed, forcing them to gaze at the wall in front of them and not look around at the cave, each other, or themselves (514a–b).[3] Behind the prisoners is a fire, and between the fire and the prisoners is a raised walkway with a low wall, behind which people walk carrying objects or puppets "of men and other living things" (514b).[3] The people walk behind the wall so their bodies do not cast shadows for the prisoners to see, but the objects they carry do ("just as puppet showmen have screens in front of them at which they work their puppets" (514a)[3]). The prisoners cannot see any of what is happening behind them, they are only able to see the shadows cast upon the cave wall in front of them. The sounds of the people talking echo off the walls, and the prisoners believe these sounds come from the shadows (514c).[3]
Socrates suggests that the shadows are reality for the prisoners because they have never seen anything else; they do not realize that what they see are shadows of objects in front of a fire, much less that these objects are inspired by real things outside the cave which they do not see (514b-515a).[3]
Copied and pasted from:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegory_of_the_Cave
Or read the allegory itself via the following link:
https://web.stanford.edu/class/ihum40/cave.pdf
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27 May 2018, 10:33 pm
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28 May 2018, 1:30 am
goldfish21
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Age: 42
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28 May 2018, 6:04 am
EzraS wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Humans are not infallible, but it's improbable that very intelligent and well educated people would make such a massive mistake as matching their entire experience of life from their earliest childhood memories to present day decades later to the textbook diagnostic criteria of ASD.
They are told to seek a diagnosis because:
1.) They are asking because they are not sure themselves. (I have not asked here because I am certain.)
2.) People here, no matter how educated - even doctors - cannot officially diagnose them solely based on the behaviour presented in their forum posts, so it would be irresponsible for even an MD to provide an official diagnosis (if that is what they seek) to someone on this forum based on their first post of "Do you think I'm Autistic?" Although, anyone here, layperson or not, could respond and say what they think and give a "Yeah, sounds like you're probably on the spectrum." - that's not hard to figure out in many cases.
Doctors don't diagnose and treat themselves... good one! Right, just like mechanics don't work on their own cars. 
Doctors seek other doctors opinions when they aren't certain of the answer themselves, or if they require a second opinion when it's something serious, or when they're legally obligated to have someone else fill out their medical records etc. Like any other human with specialized knowledge of anything they utilize in their profession, they use their knowledge for their own personal benefit, too, not just for diagnosing others. It's absurd to think that doctors' knowledge stops the moment they have an ailment and their brains just shut off and they MUST seek the professional opinion of a different MD in order to know that they have abc or xyz going on with their body.
5 years on and you the way you speak to me is as if you think I am stupid and can't possibly know myself. I didn't pick Autism out of a hat. I certainly researched many other possibilities - like many people here - and over a period of time longer than you've even been alive. I'm not the smartest guy in the world, but I'm certainly not an imbecile. I know I haven't even begun my next University education, but when I tell you that making it through University sciences with grades high enough to make it into, and then succeed at completing, Medical School, is a realistically achievable goal for me, I am also being truthful whether you believe me or not. It'd save us both a whole lot of typing/reading the same debate if you'd simply stop responding to me as if I am stupid and don't know what I'm talking about.
They are told to seek a diagnosis because:
1.) They are asking because they are not sure themselves. (I have not asked here because I am certain.)
2.) People here, no matter how educated - even doctors - cannot officially diagnose them solely based on the behaviour presented in their forum posts, so it would be irresponsible for even an MD to provide an official diagnosis (if that is what they seek) to someone on this forum based on their first post of "Do you think I'm Autistic?" Although, anyone here, layperson or not, could respond and say what they think and give a "Yeah, sounds like you're probably on the spectrum." - that's not hard to figure out in many cases.
Doctors don't diagnose and treat themselves... good one! Right, just like mechanics don't work on their own cars. Doctors seek other doctors opinions when they aren't certain of the answer themselves, or if they require a second opinion when it's something serious, or when they're legally obligated to have someone else fill out their medical records etc. Like any other human with specialized knowledge of anything they utilize in their profession, they use their knowledge for their own personal benefit, too, not just for diagnosing others. It's absurd to think that doctors' knowledge stops the moment they have an ailment and their brains just shut off and they MUST seek the professional opinion of a different MD in order to know that they have abc or xyz going on with their body.5 years on and you the way you speak to me is as if you think I am stupid and can't possibly know myself. I didn't pick Autism out of a hat. I certainly researched many other possibilities - like many people here - and over a period of time longer than you've even been alive. I'm not the smartest guy in the world, but I'm certainly not an imbecile. I know I haven't even begun my next University education, but when I tell you that making it through University sciences with grades high enough to make it into, and then succeed at completing, Medical School, is a realistically achievable goal for me, I am also being truthful whether you believe me or not. It'd save us both a whole lot of typing/reading the same debate if you'd simply stop responding to me as if I am stupid and don't know what I'm talking about.
Nevertheless you're unqualified.
Unqualified for what? Knowing my own diagnosis?
Here’s a question for you, EzraS:
Did you know you were nonverbal before you were diagnosed as nonverbal? Or when a doctor spoke those words, or wrote them down on a piece of paper, was it some sort of magical revelation to you?
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for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.goldfish21
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Age: 42
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28 May 2018, 6:13 am
cubedemon6073 wrote:
EzraS wrote:
cubedemon6073 wrote:
EzraS wrote:
cubedemon6073 wrote:
If you really, truthfully believe this then you're only seeing a fraction of reality you choose to see.
Yep. steadfastly adhered to. don't break the spell.
I don't follow.
I believe someone who only sees a fraction of reality they choose to see, will likely cling to it and be extremely resistant to reasoning put forth by others.
oh I agree. I resist the urge to cling as well.
I will add to what I said. If GF really, truthfully believe this then I have some land in Dumpwater FL to sell.
Who else but himself stands between a man and doing whatever he wants to to provide for himself? It’s peoples self limiting beliefs that prevent them from pursuing the jobs/businesses they want. And their own capabilities etc - which again, is themselves, no one else. People are free to pursue whatever work makes them happy or fulfilled or whatever. Even if they have to do a lot of other hard work along the way to getting to the role they want, people who are determined to do what they want with their time will find a way to do it - and they don’t let anyone stop them, not even themselves.
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No
for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.28 May 2018, 7:04 am
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