Aspergers Bringing Out The Worst In People

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I was really excited about these communication classes at first (they were actually mandatory for everyone, Key Employment skills) because I thought that they'd teach me how to discuss things in a group to people and get into a group.

They didn't.
I was disappointed.

What actually happened was quite funny in a disturbing sort of way, almost an analogue of my own life in fact.

I was put into a huge group of about 10 people because I couldn't find anyone to work with. Then the other group members began gossiping about things unrelated to the topic, such as what they were doing at the weekend etc, especially the girls. Then one lad decided to talk very vaguely about the topic at hand getting a lot of basic facts and details wrong. He basically was saying that the topic was interesting in a roundabout way and waved his arms for a bit. Credit to him for trying though in the midst of all that rabble. Everyone listened to him because he was popular and chatty. I tried to get a word in edgeways but kept failing miserably. I couldn't follow what everyone was doing at once or fathom when it was meant to be my turn to speak.

In the end another popular lad asked me if I'd like to contribute. Then he told everyone to "Shut up!" so I could finally talk. That was my way in. I proceeded to politely correct the other lad's facts and told everyone that I'd recently done some of my own research on the topic (coincidentally in another class project). So eventually it was me basically running the entire discussion (well it was just me telling everyone else all the answers basically). Once everyone could see that I knew what I was talking about and could back up my opinions with evidence, they all kept respectfully quiet.

I attained full marks for the group project.

I see the irony of all of this and laugh to myself.

I realised that this wasn't really a collaboration at all, but everyone listening to me.
Without me, they'd have just kept on about the weekend or the vague topic.

I think that these communication classes mean well, but I can't help but think that the "road to hell is paved with good intentions".

Everyone is expected to have good people and collaboration skills these days, so they do classes and assume that everyone can learn how to work in a group this way.

Those were the most nerve wracking and socially confusing minutes of my life.

I know that I would struggle if confronted with a similar situation again, in spite of my high mark and knowledge. It was the social side that was difficult.

As for whether that's the worst or the best I have absolutely no idea.

I just know that I couldn't have reported back all those facts on the topic without my own intense lone study. Ironically it was probably these solo focus skills that made it so hard for me to contribute to the group (without assistance).

Actually, if the renter is in violation of the terms of their agreement, the landlord does possess the right to terminate the agreement immediately - depending on the state and municipal laws on the matter. While the entire situation reeks, the fact that documentation is not present puts the renter at the disadvantage. I still think it would behoove the OP to pursue legal recourse, though - the verbal contract may be binding in the relevant state.


M.

Yeah, I've thought about it. I'm going to wait and see how hard it is to get my security deposit back. The problem is this is small town. Not a really small town, but people know people here. I have my first problem, who is my landlord that I sue? I think the girlfriend owns the house, her boyfriend is the one I write the checks to in his name... Also the boyfriend is part of a huge family out here. They are not mafia or anything crazy like that, but they own this little town. Their business is one of the bigger ones of the state, and they are very well known. I just know there would be a lot of local politics in court. Some might benefit me more as I don't know what bridges that family has burned, and I do know some of the local politicians type thing (magistrate judges, etc.). I was also thinking if I had to take it to court, I might be better off on one of those national tv court shows only to even out the playing field. But, I don't feel like listening to Judge Judy calling me stupid on tv for not having a lease. Also, I don't know how that works and if both parties have to agree or what not.

The important thing is that I'm moving out...today. If I'm not back on here in a couple days to a week, that's why. I forgot to schedule the cable transfer (my internet), and I don't know how long they will make me wait on that.

nara44 wrote:

I am curious, how have you achieved this, if i may ask?

I believe this may be what I have to do too.

first u have to really want it and really understand how crucial it is for your survival
once u get that u can become quite creative because without the NT f*****g your life and soul u can breath and think and feel again and when u do the world is open for you
so i managed it step by step
after my army service i became homeless,intentionally,spent many years living alone in the nature,food is no problem ,there is no shortage of free fruits and vegetables in the Israeli cultivated areas,also stole some food from families picnics(like the grizzlies ),sold my pictures and sculptures when i felt i need a more cozy home,was picked up many times by nice ladies(if u live outdoors and u look autistic u r bound to get picked up by beautiful and interesting ladies)
spent many years like that in almost total silence and very little human touch
at around 35 i was given a pc as a farewell present from my grandma and it turned out that programming is very natural and easy for me
much easier than talking or any thing else that is so natural for NT(this may be also true to many other aspies)
so i programmed my way into quite a lot of money as this was the time when Israeli start-ups were just everywhere and the more weird u were the better
no one cared where i am or who i am as long as i can come up with the solutions
from this era i got enough skills,recognition and connections(mostly virtual) to get me into a position where i can work at my home and everything is done through the net
bills,shopping,work,managing my account,learning,girlfriends (only aspies are welcomed),everything is done by the net
the infrastructure is quite developed here and it is still developing pretty fast
i leave my house only for an occasional cycling to the beach or to the mountains and i like sitting in the cafe watching people
sometimes months can pass without me having to talk to anyone
it's great
even my contracts got used to me being crazy and they are doing their best not to bother me
i get some requirement by mail,punch the code and the money land at my account
no human touch or contact(except that of my gf)
it's magic
i believe that this style of living is going to catch on in the near future and humanity will be much better for it because it is unrealistic to expect from a sensitive,creative,attentive individuals(as most AS are) to integrate with the selfish and shallow life conducted by the NT

BTW
Australia is very AS friendly
Spent few months at some small island off the Queensland coast and hiked the Nullarbor which is great place for AS craving silent,weird space
every thing was great but the flies
they were driving me crazy

As I always say on here, gotta love it taking advice on how to survive totally alone from people with top marketable skills and steady loving relationships...

Here we tell a joke about how Rockefeller became a millionaire: he started as a child, picking up used train tickets that people threw on the sidewalk, and selling them as paper for recycling. With the little money he got, he bought a cart and started doing errands for people. With that money, he bought some combs and started selling them in the market square. Then his uncle, the multi-millionaire died, left him a few millions and that's how he became a millionaire.

did u missed the part of me being homeless for more than 15 years ?
the second part was an attempt to draw some broader picture of society trends that might lead to people like us having a greater chance of living outside what is destructive and poisonous NT environment
and no buddy ever lent me anything
my family watched me suffer for years with out lifting a finger because i was the bad boy
the black sheep,the rotten one,an AS who is disgrace to his egotistical self centered family
i really don't and never cared for money or success
all my life i've done the minimum in order to get me the most basic needs
live in a one room apartment
have no car
no luxuries
gave up on many opportunities so i can be left alone and your comment is insulting and enirly misses the point i tried to make

No, it doesn't miss it, it just shows its fallacy.

sorry
don't understand
do u accuse me of not telling the truth ?

Please don't argue G and N.

Thank u nara44, for a detailed answer to my question.

Thank u Greentea for doing the 'is it trustworthy' thing that all of us do just for plain commonsense.

I'm not thinking anyone can come up with specific solutions to anyones's particular circumstance. But I am needing a bit of light on the topic right now.

Men's ways are always going to be different because women don't get the same treatment no matter how egalitarian your context is.

I am not sure how to be creative at the moment, that's why i asked for concrete response. Nara44 you have been helpful in your detail and in sharing your travail, and your success.

I have been going through the management strategy of 'discredit-exhaust-inherit'. I believe it's actually a military tactic!
As u can imagine i am tired.
I don't give up on myself.
I have to accept that i am 'the landscaped field with no other people' - a vision i had over twenty years ago. Now it is time for me to understand and develop how i can sustain myself from this platform.
No firecracker , magic, type stuff. Just living solutions to change and reconstitution.

I think I've figgured out this whole AS/NT thing. As aspies, we lack theory of mind, which means we have no idea what other people are thinking. NT's on the other hand, have no idea what they are thinking themselves.

It's a joke folks. Settle down, or I'm going for the fire hose.

NOBS, Thanks for the kindness of giving out a joke/laugh

It seems that way for me quite often. People are always walking over me... I think my problem in doing anything about it, is first, I don't understand why they do it. I like to understand things before making a major change.

My boyfriend says "it's because they are a**holes!" Well, to me that doesn't seem to be a good enough reason, lol, as everyone can be at times here and there.

He said my problem seems to be being able to say "no" and not expecting favors in return. Says that is how the world works, it's a give/take situation. I have a hard time with the "take" part, so I "give" a lot of things without realizing I'm being stepped all over. I often think I am simply doing something nice for someone who seems nice enough to me.

...and basically, since I do that, he says I'm screwed, because I've gotten the ball rolling in allowing it to happen, unknowingly.

I don't know how to remedy it, but I do have a start.

I've now got rules posted on my outside door, to children who want to come play with my kids:

--------------

"you start a fight, hit anyone, kick anyone, or make up stories trying to get others into trouble: you go home for 2 days."

"if you disrespect me by backtalking or flat out ignoring, you are not welcome back for a week."

etc.

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Granted these things don't help me a ton (except helping my stress level), they keep my kids from being bullied by their friends when they are over-especially my son.

As far as myself... it's a BIG change. I know I need to do it. I need to set my own boundaries and stick to them. No exceptions. Things like "I'm no longer the babysitter for the neighborhood" (since no one else is willing to babysit my kids due to them being "special needs" kids).

There was a lady who used to come over here a lot... knowing I don't work, and am being allowed to stay home with Miss Libby (my 5 year old) until she can start school (and so I can get my social therapy for them to talk me through interviews so I don't look like a freak when they are asking me questions, or sound like one). So I have had a lot of state assistance. Knowing this, she would come over and ask when I got my food stamps if she could have them, if I could take her to the store. She'd constantly ask if I had $5 for things.... she would use her husband needing medication to get it (as she knew I would not refuse helping with medication if I had it to spare). One day, I finally had enough (after she flat out lied to me and stole money from me) and told her I was no longer helping her.

At the time, I didn't realize she was just using me, as we would talk and hang out for a bit after going to the store and things like that. I really thought she was a friend (keep in mind I haven't had a friend in.... sheesh, 8-9 years, aside from my boyfriend), and that stung a lot. But I realized when I told her I could not help her anymore because it was taking away from our family, she stopped coming around altogether.

There are quite a few other situations ongoing that I'm trying to resolve, trying to figure out what I need to do and all.... but every situation calls for a different approach, and it's very very hard to do. I put up with that lady for 3 years before finally figuring out she was just using me.

Without knowing the motivations, or how they will react, I have severe difficulty in changing how I do things or setting limitations.

I'm quite often in your situation, but there was one in very particular that jumped out at me, that I just thought of:

Many of my co-workers are single moms in their late teens/early '20s...one of whom always would ask me if I could cover her shift this or that day, or switch with her. Most times I said I could not, and one time I was happy to oblige.

Then, she asked me if I'd switch with her on my weekly requested day off. I said no sorry, I can't. She kept badgering me, and I still said no. One more time: "please?"

I just said "I told ya can't, a'right?"

She goes "you don't have to snap at me" Well geez, keep pestering me and I'll be wasting even more energy trying to be nice...like I do with our customers.

As even my gal's mother said "they schedule you, you work the days they schedule you; you want a day off, you request it before the next schedule"; here here.

nothing funnier than the truth

It's hard to understand, but for a lot of people, it is enough-- Not everybody has a conscience. It's really hard to tell at first. Some people just don't feel good for doing something good or bad for doing something bad. What would kill you from guilt, they don't even think about. There comes a point, once you recognize that in somebody, where you have to kinda think of them more like a machine. Everything they do is simply for their own gain. When they look at a situation, it's all about what they can get out of it, and nothing else, at all, matters to them. If they seem to be keeping a promise, it's a means to an end. They're gaining trust so that they can get something. It's not an NT thing, it's a sociopath thing. Sociopaths aren't always serial killers.. they're just people without a conscience. If they seem to have remorse for doing something bad, it's not that they're sorry about what they did, it's that they're sorry they got caught. They only ever do anything because they think that it will benefit them.
There are different levels, of course. Some also have people they "care" about.. I'm not really sure to what extent.
But there are just people for whom the only thing in their mind is how to benefit themselves.
That may be true of everybody, except that when you have a conscience, doing that hurts somebody else doesn't actually benefit you because you feel too guilty about it.
People without consciences just think of decent people as suckers, though. I don't think it's really possible to understand that. I can't imagine what it would be like to never feel guilt for anything. I feel guilt for things that aren't even bad! But in some people, feeling guilt for doing something bad or getting a nice feeling for helping somebody just isn't a factor, because they don't have those feelings at all.
It's really, really hard to deal with, because they'll try to use your conscience against you. Once you've figured it out about somebody, though, you have to just kinda think of it like the parable of the snake. If it's their nature to do harm, they will. And you may feel horribly guilty for saying no to them, but helping them to hurt you wouldn't really do any good, and if you let people without consciences drain you, you won't be able to help good people.
It's easier said than done.. a lot of times you want to be the one who can be so kind that even a horrible person wouldn't hurt you. But if they don't have a conscience, it doesn't matter. I've fallen for it a lot of times.

Edit: also, people like that tend to look out for themselves. They don't have nothing because they actually have nothing. They beg those five dollars off of you because yesterday they spent it on beer, on the assumption that when they don't have money later, you'll give it to them.
No, it's not true of everybody. But when somebody is consistently badgering your for stuff, they're going to figure that they get more if they waste whatever they have so that later they can "legitimately" beg from you. If she doesn't have a conscience, and doesn't care about your family, why should she save those five dollars that she's going to need to by her husband's medication, when she can spend them and then get the money from the medication from you?

Second Edit: Remember though, that cheating isn't an NT thing.. it's a sociopath thing. People without consciences just feel that they have the right to cheat people who do. Having a conscience to them just means being a sucker.