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Nonperson
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26 Aug 2012, 11:08 am

paxfilosoof wrote:
I was making the point that difference in brain anatomy doesn't tell us that something is a disorder. The intense world theory explain that the neurons of autistics are even more plastic and more connected. Which could be interpret that neurotypicals have the REAL disorder, because neurotypicals were saying that autistics brains didn't work well. It's the opposite


Oh, I agreed with your point all along. Just quibbling over details for no good reason.



davidgolfpro
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26 Aug 2012, 11:11 am

Size does matter, it's just mother nature. men have larger brains and are therefore more intelligent.



paxfilosoof
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26 Aug 2012, 11:13 am

davidgolfpro wrote:
Size does matter, it's just mother nature. men have larger brains and are therefore more intelligent.

No it doesn't. Intelligence is a human concept.
It doens't excist in reality.



XFilesGeek
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26 Aug 2012, 11:25 am

I have Aspergers Disorder.

I have a DISORDER. I do not have a "difference" or a "personality type." I have a DISORDER.

I currently take Zoloft to help alleviate symptoms of said disorder. If and when other options to alleviate my symptoms become available, I will not hesitate to utilize them. Can that be considered the same thing as a "cure" if enough of my issues can be resolved through medical intervention? Maybe. Do I care? No. The-Powers-That-Be are more than welcome to keep striving for a cure if they have the means to do so, and I may even make use of such a thing if it is ever created. And before some sanctimonious mental m***et starts screaming that society should just try harder to accommodate me, there's absolutely no reason why we can't strive for improved medical interventions AND social acceptance.

Aspergers Disorder is a disorder. It is not just "being a little different," or "feeling awkward around other people." Unfortunately, we appear to have reached a point where introverted nerds are no longer content with merely being introverted nerds, and they want to be "autistic;" therefore, we get this, "It's just a difference!" crap. As far as I'm concerned, if you are not impaired, you do not have an ASD. That is the dividing line between what is considered "normal functioning" and "abnormal functioning."

Personally, I have no idea why "autism" is considered so cool that even people with no impairments want to march around announcing that they are "autistic," but I never have understood other people. Perhaps it's the overwhelming desire to belong to some kind of "herd" that NTs are even willing to identify with a mental disorder just to "fit in" somewhere.

In any case, I'm getting tired of being told how I should feel about my disorder. I need support to function in my daily life. I am not a savant or a genius. I have a disorder and I need help; I'm not going to pretend I don't need help, or that I wouldn't welcome a "cure" because of a bunch of neurodiversity rhetoric. I want CHOICE.


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davidgolfpro
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26 Aug 2012, 11:40 am

paxfilosoof wrote:
davidgolfpro wrote:
Size does matter, it's just mother nature. men have larger brains and are therefore more intelligent.

No it doesn't. Intelligence is a human concept.
It doens't excist in reality.


Wow, what a weird statement to make, are you a David Icke believer???



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26 Aug 2012, 11:50 am

XFilesGeek wrote:
In any case, I'm getting tired of being told how I should feel about my disorder. I need support to function in my daily life. I am not a savant or a genius. I have a disorder and I need help; I'm not going to pretend I don't need help, or that I wouldn't welcome a "cure" because of a bunch of neurodiversity rhetoric. I want CHOICE.


Not wanting to be cured, doesn't mean to being disabled though, and that needs to be remembered. But yes, this thread is falling into autism supremacy and people trying to claim that autism is just being different and not being disordered. instead of the point of it which was not about whether or not we should pursue a cure, but whether the concept of a cure for autism makes sense in the first place.

I'm leaning towards agreeing with Callista and thinking that cure makes no sense for those reasons. I also would not want to be cured even if it did make sense. However, that does not mean that we shouldn't work on making lives easier as autistic people.



XFilesGeek
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26 Aug 2012, 11:55 am

Tuttle wrote:
XFilesGeek wrote:
In any case, I'm getting tired of being told how I should feel about my disorder. I need support to function in my daily life. I am not a savant or a genius. I have a disorder and I need help; I'm not going to pretend I don't need help, or that I wouldn't welcome a "cure" because of a bunch of neurodiversity rhetoric. I want CHOICE.


Not wanting to be cured, doesn't mean to being disabled though, and that needs to be remembered. But yes, this thread is falling into autism supremacy and people trying to claim that autism is just being different and not being disordered. instead of the point of it which was not about whether or not we should pursue a cure, but whether the concept of a cure for autism makes sense in the first place.

I'm leaning towards agreeing with Callista and thinking that cure makes no sense for those reasons. I also would not want to be cured even if it did make sense. However, that does not mean that we shouldn't work on making lives easier as autistic people.


I think "cure" needs to be defined.

I tend to doubt that a person's brain can be re-wired, especially not when they reach adulthood, but, as I've already stated, alleviating symptoms via medical means might be within reach. Could that be considered a "cure" or a sort? Perhaps.

And I agree we should always try to make things easier for people with impairments and/or disabilities, but finding medical treatments and improving socio-economic opportunities are not mutually exclusive.


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26 Aug 2012, 12:07 pm

davidgolfpro wrote:
Size does matter, it's just mother nature. men have larger brains and are therefore more intelligent.


Ah, if only mother nature had a larger brain...



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26 Aug 2012, 12:13 pm

Making people not be autistic is required for me to consider something a cure rather than management.

I'm not saying only socioeconomic opportunities either - not just education of other people or such. Helping people learn how to identify when a meltdown is likely to occur, and how to properly leave a situation is helping them. Working on regulating someone's sensory system is helping them (and in the medical system). One of my medications actually has drastic affects on my meltdowns, and drastically reduces them, that's helping manage a part I can't stand via medical means (that's actually a side effect, but its one I knew was likely to occur and I wanted to try this medication next after the first didn't work specifically because of it - I'm actually taking it for a migraine preventative because of my sensory issues causing migraines).

Looking into other options is something that is possibly within reach. But I'd not consider it a cure. It's a way to make life easier for people who have those traits making their life particularly difficult.



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26 Aug 2012, 1:50 pm

davidgolfpro wrote:
Size does matter, it's just mother nature. men have larger brains and are therefore more intelligent.


Troll harder...



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26 Aug 2012, 1:55 pm

XFilesGeek wrote:
I have Aspergers Disorder.

I have a DISORDER. I do not have a "difference" or a "personality type." I have a DISORDER.

I currently take Zoloft to help alleviate symptoms of said disorder. If and when other options to alleviate my symptoms become available, I will not hesitate to utilize them. Can that be considered the same thing as a "cure" if enough of my issues can be resolved through medical intervention? Maybe. Do I care? No. The-Powers-That-Be are more than welcome to keep striving for a cure if they have the means to do so, and I may even make use of such a thing if it is ever created. And before some sanctimonious mental m***et starts screaming that society should just try harder to accommodate me, there's absolutely no reason why we can't strive for improved medical interventions AND social acceptance.

Aspergers Disorder is a disorder. It is not just "being a little different," or "feeling awkward around other people." Unfortunately, we appear to have reached a point where introverted nerds are no longer content with merely being introverted nerds, and they want to be "autistic;" therefore, we get this, "It's just a difference!" crap. As far as I'm concerned, if you are not impaired, you do not have an ASD. That is the dividing line between what is considered "normal functioning" and "abnormal functioning."

Personally, I have no idea why "autism" is considered so cool that even people with no impairments want to march around announcing that they are "autistic," but I never have understood other people. Perhaps it's the overwhelming desire to belong to some kind of "herd" that NTs are even willing to identify with a mental disorder just to "fit in" somewhere.

In any case, I'm getting tired of being told how I should feel about my disorder. I need support to function in my daily life. I am not a savant or a genius. I have a disorder and I need help; I'm not going to pretend I don't need help, or that I wouldn't welcome a "cure" because of a bunch of neurodiversity rhetoric. I want CHOICE.


Agreed a hundred percent. I was going to post something similar, from my own perspective and experience with my autism in my childhood. But couldn't figure out how to properly put it down in words.


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26 Aug 2012, 1:59 pm

XFilesGeek wrote:
I have Aspergers Disorder.

I have a DISORDER. I do not have a "difference" or a "personality type." I have a DISORDER.


What makes you call it a disorder? Is it something that would be a problem if you were completely alone? Even if so, why do you think those whose problems are interpersonal do not have AS? The criteria say nothing about requiring impairment that would still apply if you lived as a hermit in a cave, just impairment. I'd appreciate an answer without the name calling, if possible.

XFilesGeek wrote:
I currently take Zoloft to help alleviate symptoms of said disorder.


Careful, that stuff may actually increase the risk of suicide.



Last edited by Nonperson on 26 Aug 2012, 4:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

thomas81
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26 Aug 2012, 2:58 pm

XFilesGeek wrote:
In any case, I'm getting tired of being told how I should feel about my disorder. I need support to function in my daily life. I am not a savant or a genius. I have a disorder and I need help; I'm not going to pretend I don't need help, or that I wouldn't welcome a "cure" because of a bunch of neurodiversity rhetoric. I want CHOICE.

I take it from your tone you are one of these autistics whom if there was a cure you would book yourself a slot a week Tuesday.

Here is the thing; if the pro cure lobby ever make inroads to their goal and actually find one, the genie will be out of the bottle. There will be an onus placed on ASD people to accept a cure; whether they want one or not because otherwise they will be regarded as stubborn or self harming.

Your idea of choice is mutually exclusive to the choice of autistics who want to keep their own personality.



CyclopsSummers
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26 Aug 2012, 3:07 pm

thomas81 wrote:
I take it from your tone you are one of these autistics whom if there was a cure you would book yourself a slot a week Tuesday.

Here is the thing; if the pro cure lobby ever make inroads to their goal and actually find one, the genie will be out of the bottle. There will be an onus placed on ASD people to accept a cure; whether they want one or not because otherwise they will be regarded as stubborn or self harming.

Your idea of choice is mutually exclusive to the choice of autistics who want to keep their own personality.


The thing is, medication does in fact exist to combat certain symptoms of several disorders. No catch-all cure to wipe out one's autism entirely, sure, but the medication is optional. I've always chosen not to use medication like antidepressants, even though some people have advised me to take medication. Even if there were a pill or a potion that could wipe autism clean out of your brain, I doubt that any government could legally obligate people to take the cure against their choice.

Except maybe France.


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davidgolfpro
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26 Aug 2012, 3:07 pm

Nonperson wrote:
davidgolfpro wrote:
Size does matter, it's just mother nature. men have larger brains and are therefore more intelligent.


Troll harder...


Be careful about calling people a troll..explain why i am trolling then.



davidgolfpro
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26 Aug 2012, 3:11 pm

AS is a disability, and condition,syndrome..but not a disorder.

We are disabled and it's because we are not able to function like NT's can without it being amajoy struggle on our parts. It weakens us through high stress levels, and normal chitchat is not possible, so we are then socially disabled.

It is a hidden disability.....what does everyone here say to that?