What has been your biggest revelation about NTs?
Plausible deniability is basically a contingency plan. The person has an intent of (A) and hopes to achieve a certain result (X). But the person knows ahead of time that Y or Z might happen instead of X. Just in case things go wrong, they want to be able to deny their intent.
The person does not openly reveal their intent or their desired outcome. That would be too risky. Instead they use hints or suggestion, or reveal very gradually, and test the other person's reactions.
If the other person's interpretation and/or responses seem unfavorable, at some point they may abandon plan A and move on to B or C, and they will deny ever having any intentions of plan A.
All allistic communication is essentially based on plausible deniability to some extent. It's a way of being vague or indirect so that things are left open to multiple interpretations.
There's a thing called "plausible deniability" which is similar. For example, if one NT is hitting on another, they'll often both say things in such a way that theycould be having a normal conversation in order to spare any potential embarrassment.
Would be great to see an example of such a conversation coz I'm absolutely clueless about these things.
It's pretty hard for me to even come up with an example of this in flirting, because I'm fairly oblivious to it if or when it is happening. I only realize it later on if the guy says or does something really obnoxious.
In retrospect it has been things like men asking me a lot of questions about myself, seemingly just out of normal curiosity or to make conversation...like asking if I'm married or if I have a boyfriend.
I had not really realized how differently NTs process things until I suspected I was ASD. For instance, I realized the reason I kept having so many misunderstandings about people's moods was that I was not reading their expressions or body language, or missing it altogether. I'd be baffled when someone seemed to expect me to read their mind somehow. Apparently something was going on that I was missing. At the time, I just thought they were being unreasonable. I realized at some point that most people don't need to puzzle out other people's moods by consciously analyzing the movements of their facial muscles or positions of their bodies, and that they do it with a much higher level of success than I do. NTs didn't frantically run through a list of memorized scripts in order to have a conversation that wasn't work-related. NTs didn't have pauses lasting several seconds. I just thought I was a dullard at conversations. I've now found that while conversation is a convoluted, complicated set of procedures for me, it is automatic for NTs.
A typical encounter for me might start with me examining a person's face for clues: Hmmm. Eyebrows scrunched together, eyelids narrowed. Category: negative emotion. Anger? Sadness? Tired? Upset stomach? Lips compressed, neck bent, eyes gazing intensely, shoulders hunched. Anger! At me? Himself? Someone else? Am I in danger? Muscles not tensed to leap on me... violence improbable. Can we talk about this? Better ask ...
And so on... hopefully our hypothetical person hasn't gotten angrier at me because I've been standing there silently for several seconds trying to work out what's wrong with him... Of course, starting with a generic "Hey, what's up?" is always more efficient, but picking out the right conversation starter can be pretty daunting too (in which I get stuck wondering if "Hey, what's up" is better than "Are you mad?" or "What's wrong with you??")
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Diagnosed Bipolar II in 2012, Autism spectrum disorder (moderate) & ADHD in 2015.
Me too. I'm still really in disbelief about all of this. I still think other people are just being unreasonable.
Me too. I'm still really in disbelief about all of this. I still think other people are just being unreasonable.
And even NTs don't judge nonverbal communication correctly, so it seems to me a terribly inefficient method of communication... thus you have spouses complaining about their partners not knowing what they want without saying it, and drunks in bars yelling, "Are you looking at ME??"
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Diagnosed Bipolar II in 2012, Autism spectrum disorder (moderate) & ADHD in 2015.
And even NTs don't judge nonverbal communication correctly, so it seems to me a terribly inefficient method of communication... thus you have spouses complaining about their partners not knowing what they want without saying it, and drunks in bars yelling, "Are you looking at ME??"
OMG Yes! I sometimes think that what NT's really have is the delusion that they can read others, and they just make stuff up as they go along without knowing that's what they're doing. There have been several times when I've watched two NT's get into a ever-increasing heated argument over something which, if they'd just stop and parse each other's words, they find they were just phrasing the same statement differently.
I think part of the issue for Aspies is that not only to we have trouble reading NT's, but the NT's also have trouble reading us. You could blame it on our "flat aspect."
Which is funny. We can't read them, which is our fault. They can't read us, which is OUR fault too!
If the rates in society were reversed, we'd have this world of Aspies. There would be a few, pathetic, dysfunctional people who are always reading into everything, and emotionally escalating every conversation.
And even NTs don't judge nonverbal communication correctly, so it seems to me a terribly inefficient method of communication... thus you have spouses complaining about their partners not knowing what they want without saying it, and drunks in bars yelling, "Are you looking at ME??"
OMG Yes! I sometimes think that what NT's really have is the delusion that they can read others, and they just make stuff up as they go along without knowing that's what they're doing.
I think so too.
Sweetleaf
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I don't think its particularly an NT thing....I notice a general lack of empathy in society, and since neurotypicals are the majority since there's more of them it would appear they more often lack empathy. But hell even on this site I have seen some things that are quite the opposite of empathy so I don't think empathy depends on being autistic or not.
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Tis the time to melt the Ice.
And even NTs don't judge nonverbal communication correctly, so it seems to me a terribly inefficient method of communication... thus you have spouses complaining about their partners not knowing what they want without saying it, and drunks in bars yelling, "Are you looking at ME??"
OMG Yes! I sometimes think that what NT's really have is the delusion that they can read others, and they just make stuff up as they go along without knowing that's what they're doing.
I think so too.
+1
I don't understand how NT people can feel better or be entertained from bullying others, but I've learned that they do. I also don't understand how NT people could act like they don't like something that you have because they are jealous of it; wouldn't it make more sense to try to steal it if they want it?
I've also been shocked about the extent to which emotion affects NT people's political views and beliefs. So many people get upset when you try to be logical! I get that everyone has emotions, but put them in your pocket when you participate in democracy and think things through!
Ever since at least Ancient Greek days, it was pretty much ascertained that the world is a spheroid--not a perfect sphere, of course.
If there's a God/gods/etc, I believe this Creator would have created a complex, rounded planet rather than a flat one. It just makes more sense.
Really? If I was a god and I had a basketball or a plate and a hand full of ants to colonize one or the other, I would think it'd make more sense to go with a never-ending plane (plate reference) over some ball floating, spinning, and moving though the universe at violent speeds.
Fundamentally it would take a deity's strength to keep a flat planetoid from imploding into a spheroid; though that would require a being possessing the ability to create an object too heavy for them to lift under any gravity (i.e. being 'spaghettified' through an event horizon and/or violating the omnipotence paradox). I think most gods would get bored, neatly fold in the corners and get started on another biosphere or universe.
Monotheism really is absolutist... if the laws of physics in this universe rub you the wrong way I'm pretty sure a neighboring universe should be accessible somewhere to better suit your needs.
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"Standing on a well-chilled cinder, we see the fading of the suns, and try to recall the vanished brilliance of the origin of the worlds."
-Georges Lemaitre
"I fly through hyperspace, in my green computer interface"
-Gem Tos


