Why is it easier for NTs to feign?

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What I said was correct (on the subject of psychopathy, not "why NTs are better at faking"... but you're right that I shifted gears in the topic and I'm at fault for that. And I was not aiming at NTs by the way, it should be quite clear if you read my post, by I'll bow out due to you being right that I shifted the gears.

Suggesting medication also uncool. I must need a break...

They start practicing earlier and they have an easier time weighing both the good and bad of a behaviour and therefor are able to figure out that often that all of the trouble and hard feelings they are going to create are just not worth being brutally honest.

They figure out that in the over all scheme of things sometimes a small fib ("That dress looks nice on you!") or omission (better to not say anything if you can't say anything nice) is much more condusive to living a healthy, productive lifestyle than being blunt.

Thanks for making your input clearer to me, granatelli.

Demon, off-topic doesn't bother me, as long as people continue coming into the thread and answering my original question

This is an excellent explanation. But OTOH, all of an autie's problems don't come from being blunt. To be 100% honest here, a non-NT can just stand there and be glaringly "out of place" (depending)...I never found I had to say a single thing, blunt or otherwise, to be a target. So not getting along in the world, for me, has NEVER been about being blunt. In fact, I've typically been too quiet in order to not say the wrong thing, and painfully overaware of when I might be saying something that could be blunt...and I stop myself before I even say it.

So though I can see that you're trying to understand, autism isn't all about being blunt and it isn't even a majority about being blunt. This doesn't describe every autie. I know you don't mean "every" autie but I do see the subject coming back again and again to how social graces mean not being blunt...but finding a way to compliment someone on something you don't actually like isn't being blunt.

Hope that made sense. There is just SO much more to autism and AS than the way one speaks and the things one says.

I agree with the second part of your statement, as not understanding the nuances of social interaction make these things more difficult to to weigh. However, please explain how they start practicing earlier. I found some of Demon_Chorus' points to be relevant to the topic when considering how psychopathic society can be in general and how these people function.

Well I came into your topic and instead of answering your question I started screaming about extremely deceitful behaviour and people, so I'm still at fault. If Michjo and NoWhereWoman ask nicely, I'll edit my posts in this topic to oblivion since this topic isn't about extremely deceitful behaviour, I can make a topic about that subject myself some other time.



I don't think they're relavant to this topic but they are relevant in the overall scope of things, it's more my emotions and morality got the best of me. I can make another topic about "Psychopaths/Sociopaths/Narcissists" and excessively deceitful behaviour some other time.

Why on earth would I do that? I have no need for you to edit your posts. (???) That was kind of an odd thing to say. Anyway, no, rest assured, I won't ask you to edit your posts. Best people see what you originally said. Isn't it? How would the chain of responses make sense otherwise?

They just interact with people and can read a persons face or body language when something they've said or done is hurtful or uncomfortable to them. They (NT's) pick up on little things that AS often do not. It comes naturally. It is not considered practice. It is just life experience.

The best way I can relate is if I were to go to a strange foreign country with unusual (to me) customs and ways of interacting. I would have to observe and ask questions. "Why did that make him upset? What should I have asked? What is the usual way of responding when faced with a similar situation". It wouldn't really always be fair but if want to get along with the locals, live a positive, productive life then I'd better observe and be a quick study. Complaining about how unfair the rest of the world is and how they didn't understand me would only alienate myself more.

IMO anyway. : )

^ Now THAT totally makes sense. Thank you for the explanation, granatelli.

Ok then, I was just saying I did shift gears in this topic so I'm at fault. The topic was supposed to be about "Why NTs feign easier" and I started wailing on about extremely deceitful behaviour and people which is another topic all in itself.

But since I'm posting I think I should answer GreenTea's original question about "Why NTs feign easier".

Hmmm, I can't really pinpoint why, but it might have to do with the path alot of NTs took in school, they might've chose to feign to fit in grade school (K-12) so it comes alot more naturally to them.

There's one little itty bitty problem with that. NT's generally do not accept our boundaries. If we let our boundaries be known the NT coworkers will raise their eyebrows to each other and snicker behind our backs about our "issues". Those of us who are aware refuse to put up with this kind of disrespect. Even if they try to hide their prejudices I will still notice the subtle condescension in the way they talk to me. It's too much for me to bear. Sharing my boundaries is a bad idea if I want to keep my respect. I prefer to follow your own advice and "suck it up", i.e. fake it until I can fake no more.

This works for a while, maybe a few weeks, or even months, until at some point a time comes where I can't handle it any more. I'll get so depressed that it's impossible to keep up the facade and there will be some proverbial straw that brakes the camels back, something that causes me to snap and just give up on the spot.


It's a major symptom according to experts only because its more obvious and in theory easier to correct. The experts aren't even aware of all the subtler internal differences in thinking style that make fitting in so difficult. Differences that go completely under the conscious radar of NTs.

Last edited by marshall on 04 Jul 2009, 4:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Or, quite horrifyingly, decide when we're younger and helpless that they will "desensitize" us by really laying it on, even physically. That'll teach us.

I'm buying this explanation, I think. It's easier to feign, I guess, when you're getting feedback all the time (feedback that Aspies are blind to) and when you have ToM (you know what most people will want from you and how much you can or can't get away with, with the average human). All this, plus on-the-mark experience that's gathered since age 3-4 when ToM starts developing, makes for a huge advantage over Aspies in the feigning game.

Ultimately, I guess phoniness is not nearly as offensive to NTs as it is for Aspies, because NTs can often see through it at least some so they're not as victimized by it as we are. It's like I can be afraid of kryptonite, but not as much as Superman is, because it affects him more than it affects me.

Regarding setting boundaries, I've had the same kind of experience as marshall. As a result, I NEVER try to establish my boundaries with people. It's dangerous for me, as marshall describes. It can make me a victim/scapegoat in no time. So for a few years now, I've trained myself to swallow it and give back behind their backs (backstab), as a way to show them that, afterall, I may not be able to establish boundaries in än NT-acceptable way, but I'M NO SILLY. This has been the only thing that has worked for me as far as not becoming a doormat and not alienating everyone by my different way of establishing boundaries.

Marshall, I don't understand this and read your post a couple times.

Establishing boundaries is generally about concealing one's issues from public scrutiny and NTs do it all the time. With the exception of a sociopath or two, the only time I've had trouble with people respecting my boundaries was when I was unable to clearly project them. And that was due to them being unclear in my own mind. As most NTs have boundaries, they are adept at recognizing them in others. Proper boundary setting should help prevent the condescension you described, as opposed to encouraging it.

Regarding concealing one's issues from discussion, it is necessary to incorporate an auxiliary skill, the art of evasion. To survive, I've had to learn how to glibly, clearly and diplomatically dismiss invasive inquiries and do so without being peeved. I don't do humor well, but if you can do it with humor it helps immensely. I'm not the most tactful person [my natural style is to blurt things out and think later], and still, I can do this when I have to. It bothers me when people talk behind my back with their negative speculation, so the less they know the better for me. The fact is, I like to reveal just about everything to everyone. And have only learned to do the exact opposite for my own protection and survival. With the exception of WP, where the price I pay for such openness is minimal [there's still a price to pay even at WP], I'm pretty secretive.

I don't do banter. But I'm pretty good at faking pleasantry. I just think about something that makes me happy. Also, it's an uphill battle, but I'm getting accustomed to thinking about the NTs feelings and trying to cause them as little friction as possible. Doing that involves being sensitive to their boundaries and a question or two to clarify what I don't get, is usually appreciated and not held against me.

Boundaries enable the person setting them, to relax behind them. Or that is the theory.

Good post alba. You said it much better than I. Cheers!