How do you interact with people with Down's Syndrome?

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So, where are your sources that state these people have AS?

Why would someone with AS be more predisposed to being a religious figure of the past anymore than a witch [who was burnt at the stake], for example? People with AS follow their own interests, rather than any social pressure placed on them; a person with AS who was forced into doing something he or she didn't want to do in the past would have had a harder time as understanding of mental disorders wasn't the same as it is today. You do know that people with AS were put in institutions 50 to 100 hundred years ago, with other less-than-normal people? I could say that parents in the past locked their children with AS up in the basement to hide them from others several hundred years ago to escape persecution, and it'd be just as accurate as what you've said.

I see no facts, other than speculation on your part.

O, and if you base worth on superficial means, that's an opinion. Someone with DS who doesn't harm anyone is far more worthy of life than the individual with AS who murders people (there's plenty of these latter people. Martin Bryant being the perfect example).

You have been talking to several people with classical autism on WP already. You might also have read responses from people with various levels of classical autism from high-functioning to low-functioning already.

Your response now based on a lack of knowledge especially about classical autism is saddening, seeing how WP and many members here stand to for spreading awareness about the autistic spectrum in all directions.

It's of no use talking to you again if you do not want to learn about AS and the autistic spectrum, so I will refrain until you have started to learn. I don't think any attempt to talk about PDDs will get us everywhere if you use such language about people with classical autism.

In the large picture, a mass murderer isn't more evil than anyone else. Entire solar systems and even galaxies are destroyed all the time without us even knowing about it. The universe doesn't evolve around neurotypical people on earth. In my oppinion an aspie mass murderer might well be more worthy of life than a law abiding neurotypical.

Yes, they do, but entire solar systems aren't killed with intent and bias; the death of a star is something that's without thought and with no morality involved, it's purely unbiased (which makes it beautiful to me).

That's an interesting philosophy you have there; one that I don't understand, as someone who takes life with a conscious decision and without a justified reason is something that's evil, no matter what disorder the person has or doesn't. And those who do such, to me anyway, aren't worthy of life compared to those who don't, no matter what disorder they do or don't have. But, to each their own.

It appears you're identifying with and "defending" a group which is seemingly persecuted and held back in society, which are "aspies" in this case; that's also something that I don't understand, as a group is but a social construct. Perhaps you're indentifying with yourself and your experiences in not being able to reach your full potential; this can make someone angry with the world and the society they live in, as people like blaming others for how they are, rather than looking at themselves and seeing what they can do, and moving past the negatives.

I scored 160 on an IQ test in grade 5, and I'm a simple farmhand as an adult; one can say that my potential is wasted..., but for me, I like doing what I do, as I have time to think about things without external distraction; which really, isn't that what makes us, and that's those with AS, reach our full potential (sitting in the basement tinkering away away from the distractions of society)?

The human mind is also a result of something bigger going on, just like when two galaxies collide and countless solar systems are destroyed. I don't make a distinction between things that happen since it's all part of the overall picture. To me, humans are so truly insignificant that I couldn't care less if some averagely dressed, ugly middle class people were massmurdered. By giving up the will to be human, I accept fate.

You can't argue a moral position based on the nature of the universe. That's the same trite justification employed by practically all psychopaths. I'm a bit of a nihilist myself but I still maintain that mass murder is wrong. You're entitled to your opinion but you can't pretend that it's any more logically correct than mine.

I envy people with Down Syndrome. They may have shorter lifespans, limited mental capabilities, and other a slight facial disfigurements...yet people in this society seem to repect them more than they do Autistic or AS people.

I guess it has to do with the fact that they still have NT-like social skills. Ugh

Humans don't have more value than insects in the overall picture. Maybe all psychopaths reason like that but it's still true. Humans are not the center of the universe and certainly not created in God's image. There's nothing special with the human species. Spiritually I have renounced my humanity and instead accepted total destruction in the face of the universe. To me, anyone who is so arrogant that they think their life is worth more than the life of an insect is truly unclean and filthy.

wut? You're incorrect there



IIRC he didn't have AS...

I'm not religious at all but I value human life because it gives my life more value to care about people. I don't really place humanity as a whole above anything else in the universe but I still choose to care about people on an individual level. I don't see how this makes me arrogant. It's just preserving my own sanity.

I'm not trying to objectify anything. The value of life is subjective. You're the one objectively stating that human life has no value. That's not logical. It just looks like emotionally driven bitterness to me, sour grapes. I'm only saying this because I get the same way whenever I'm depressed and spend too much time thinking about the world. Believe me, there are times where I sit and think that if there were a red button in front of me I would press it and blow all humanity to hell. But then the mood passes and I feel differently.

It's entirely the other way around. People who are happy start to fool themselves that human life is important and valuable, even though they know logically they are wrong they still think "what the hell, I'm happy, life has no meaning? so what". I don't want to be like that because it would make me lose touch with what is truly beautiful in existence and my spiritual life would grow weaker.
I don't want to be just another happy, filthy human who rolls around in his own s**t together with other s**t lovers.

That still looks like a sour grapes argument to me. It looks like you're saying "I don't have any meaning to my life, therefore anyone else who claims to have meaning must be lying / delusional / full of sh*t, etc".

Warsie,

Martin was diagnosed by a psychiatrist. Another psychiatrist questioned it, but he used the incorrect definition of AS (he used the social behaviour of someone with Autism rather than AS as a basis of his argument). Anyway, the diagnosis still stands, and he is in a prison designed for people with mental health problems now.

In Sweden you can't diagnose anyone with below average IQ as AS, only autist. I guess Australia is different since Bryant is claimed to suffer from slight retardation in terms of intelligence and has a very low IQ.

You don't get it, even if life is fun and you feel like you're "living in the moment", it's still worthless being human. I've tried to erase my humanity all my life by keeping a perfect hygiene and having plastic surgery etc, I don't want to be a normal human, I never wanted to. Humans are filthy, farting, burping, stickyfinger f**ktards. Life can be really enjoyable but it's still meaningless, knowing this prevents me from truly enjoying life. I just want a new revelation or just die. I'm dreaming of being brutally murdered.

If Sweden uses the ICD-10 or DSM-IV-TR, or even Gillberg's, mild mental retardation is possible, as long as there was no delay in cognitive development that was evident as a child, and that the IQ of 60 to 75 or so was picked up in the school years. (I can provide the quotes.)

But anyway, there's other murderers who have AS and also a normal IQ (a former member of this very site was one).

Have there been any people with DS who murdered others? I'm assuming that there is/was, but you don't hear of it.