My gripes at ASpartners

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Wayne
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06 Oct 2011, 10:34 am

The site has been going strong for more than ten years now and getting lots of traffic throughout that time. It can't all be trolls ragging on aspies just for the hell of it. Clearly there are people out there who are really hurting and upset and bewildered and lonely and all the rest, and they genuinely believe that their partners' Asperger Syndrome is the main source of their disconnect.

After all, this is supposed to be the one person in the world with whom you have the deepest, most connected relationship with... and if it doesn't work out, forging that relationship you crave with someone else is extremely complicated. Having someone occupy that spot who can't connect with you in the way that you crave is going to be heartbreaking.

That doesn't mean that we on the spectrum can't connect with anyone. It just means that we can't connect with people like those who end up on ASPartners, people who rely so heavily on non-verbal communication that their partners can't even see, much less generate or respond to, that they and their partners might as well be speaking completely different languages. And neither of them is capable of feeling really connected using the other's language.

DerStadtschutz
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06 Oct 2011, 10:55 am

Wayne wrote:

Yes, what you say is true, and I don't think that anyone here is suggesting that the people on ASPartners are just writing this s**t for the hell of it... But that doesn't change the fact that these women are impossible to please anyway based on what I've read. "i want you to do this." Then the aspie does it, and they still complain... WTF is the aspie supposed to do? Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. These women are friggin' ret*d, end of story.

And no offense, but women in general are crazy anyway(okay, not literally, it's more about the way their brains are wired, but they sure as hell seem crazy sometimes. And I'm incredibly lucky to have found my fiancee). Most of the time they don't seem to know what the hell they want, and what they want changes from one day to another. These women would be having some of the exact same issues with NT men. I just feel that the fact that their husbands have aspergers make the problems even worse, but it's not the root cause of their problems. The root cause is self entitlement and the apparent belief that men can read their minds.

hanyo
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06 Oct 2011, 11:00 am

Never mind.

Last edited by hanyo on 06 Oct 2011, 12:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Meow101
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06 Oct 2011, 11:14 am

DerStadtschutz wrote:

Wayne wrote:

Yes, what you say is true, and I don't think that anyone here is suggesting that the people on ASPartners are just writing this sh** for the hell of it... But that doesn't change the fact that these women are impossible to please anyway based on what I've read. "i want you to do this." Then the aspie does it, and they still complain... WTF is the aspie supposed to do? Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. These women are friggin' ret*d, end of story.

And no offense, but women in general are crazy anyway(okay, not literally, it's more about the way their brains are wired, but they sure as hell seem crazy sometimes. And I'm incredibly lucky to have found my fiancee). Most of the time they don't seem to know what the hell they want, and what they want changes from one day to another. These women would be having some of the exact same issues with NT men. I just feel that the fact that their husbands have aspergers make the problems even worse, but it's not the root cause of their problems. The root cause is self entitlement and the apparent belief that men can read their minds.

Don't blame it on WOMEN. I have just as much problem with the way these women are acting as I do with NT *MEN* who expect their aspie *WIVES* to "Be more NT" and read THEIR minds. You're failing to see that aspie WOMEN have the same unreasonable expectation put on them by their NT spouses.

~Kate

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Meow101
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06 Oct 2011, 11:16 am

hanyo wrote:

This is because nt girls apparently expect men to read their minds and do exactly what they want and exactly the right way. You'll notice if you read a lot of posts there that no matter what ASH does it's wrong, even if it is what their wife wanted them to do.

Some of these things are personal preference and how are you supposed to know? With the chair thing for example, some women don't expect that, some think it's the gentlemanly thing to do, others might think it's demeaning to them as a woman. I personally don't expect to have chairs pulled out for me. I am perfectly capable of doing that myself. I do let people open doors for me but if they don't I just do it myself. It's no big deal. Whoever is in front opens it. Actually I think my allowing people to open doors for me is less about being polite and gentlemanly than it is about my being passive and socially anxious and letting people who will tolerate that do things for me instead of doing them myself (like I won't order food to be delivered or order food at a fast food place if I have someone there that is willing to do it for me. If I'm alone I do it.)

It's not just NT girls. It's NT *people* who expect their partners to read their minds and do what they want! I'm a woman and I have some of the same problems (though my husband is less of a twit than these b*****s) with the expectations being crazy! It's not about gender, it's about certain NTs wanting their aspie partners to change.

~Kate

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hanyo
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06 Oct 2011, 11:19 am

Meow101 wrote:

That true but I think other people and I are posting about the women because it seems like the vast majority of posts there are from nt women. There are some nt men but few and far between.

Wayne
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06 Oct 2011, 11:29 am

Meow101 wrote:

That's the thing... NTs actually read each other all the time (imprecisely, for the most part, but still...), and depend on that to feel connected. And feeling connected is one big reason why we put up with this other person being in our space all the time. If you're not feeling connected.... there's a big problem.

Some of them can adjust and work with us and feel connected when we learn to speak each other's language. Apparently, some can't adjust enough to do that without driving themselves (and us!) crazy. And some feel entitled to have everything work the way they expect, of course.

Wayne
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06 Oct 2011, 11:31 am

hanyo wrote:

Meow101 wrote:

That true but I think other people and I are posting about the women because it seems like the vast majority of posts there are from nt women. There are some nt men but few and far between.

I think men in general are far less insistent that the nonverbal stuff is the One True Way to connect. For one thing, men have far less leverage... it's far easier for a man to wind up losing his entire family in a divorce than for a woman to suffer that fate, so they'll tend to be far more tolerant of situations that aren't quite what they expected or hoped for. For another, they show less tendency to rely so heavily on non-verbal stuff to begin with.

DerStadtschutz
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06 Oct 2011, 12:31 pm

I'm not saying it's entirely women's fault, or that if you're a woman you're automatically f****d in the head like that, but it seems to me(not just from my own experiences, but from many others as well) that a lot of times women insist on the non-verbal stuff and not saying what they mean MUCH more than men. I'm sure NT men do it too, but I ALWAYS hear ridiculous stories similar to(but not as bad as) the ones posted on ASPartners, and I refuse to believe that every instance is a result of aspergers in one of the two people involved. I've heard plenty of instances where guys are being stupid too, but it's generally more about being selfish or just being degrading toward women in general, not so much the expectation of mind reading. And I'm not condoning what those men do at all. It's just as wrong, but if I were to say I've never had thoughts of doing some of the degrading things out of spite, I'd be lying.

Again, I want to try and make it as clear as possible that I am in no way trying to be offensive. And I'm not a sexist either. I just happen to see many more incidents of women way too much and expecting unrealistic things from their men, saying one thing but expecting another, just generally sucking at verbal communication, than I see of men doing the same.

I don't literally think women are crazy, but they appear to be to me and most other males, just like I'm sure we appear crazy to women. It's nobody's fault, really. It's caused by the way our brains are wired. It's not compatible, and neither of us can really be held responsible for it. Sorry if I offended anybody.

1000Knives
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06 Oct 2011, 1:03 pm

Yep, not too surprising. Thus why I'm gunshy about relationships. I saw the same thing in my father and my mother, and they divorced. I really feel it's better to be alone at this point, rather than put myself through hardship and put others through hardship with a relationship. It's odd, I'm attractive enough to get pretty much any girl I choose I think, just from what you see on these forums, the aftermath isn't pretty.

Quote:

My big regret my son also has AS and I know he will only ever be making someone as miserable as his father has made me...

And that's what's been ingrained to me by my mother. I take a wild guess that my mother loves me, but she brings up everyday how I'm so much like my father. I see now why my father was so frustrated at everything, the way the rest of my family acts is completely crazy and alien to me.

Oh well. When life gives you lemons, go work on cars or something.

League_Girl
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06 Oct 2011, 1:04 pm

leviathans wrote:

I like that one

Quote:

We went to the nice bar - he pulls out a chair - for him. I had to comment to him. He jumps back with, " I can't do anything right!"
then we order a drink - I open my mouth - he jumps in front to order his. After that I commented to him. Again he says, " I can't do anything right - can I"
I calmly tell him I am just trying to help him. Then we sit out by the fire. ( cold night ) he ask me - insisted that I sit in his lap. It was a casual place. I did. then sighh whispers stupid stuff in my ear. He is trying to be like the folks in the movie.. romantic...
sigh..

Two times recently we went to the grocery store together. I don't know why he suddenly has to join me.
Upon entering... he has to say, " don't spend to much....."
grrrrrrr
I can't stand it.
When I told him later how that bothers me, he said, "I can't do anything right... "

I can't stand it. Ya - married 20 years. Dear God help me.

We cannot escape the insanity.

This is exactly the kind of girls I don't want to date! Why would he pull out your chair and let you order stuff before him? Get off your high hell, you're not a princess! Why does so many NT girls EXPECT to be treated like they are a goddess or something. I like to treat people equally. Women doesn't deserve to be treated differently than men. And btw, yes you probably spend too much money in the grocery store for useless things so he has to always remind you not to! You're completely right, that men is insane of not having dumped you much earlier. I would have dumped you after the first 1-2 dates.

Ahhhh, I feel better now

I think that lady is lucky her husband cares about her so he does his best and it's still not good enough for her. It also looks like he can't accept criticism because then he gets all black and white about it. I also tell my husband not to spend too much. But she does sound very needy. I don't expect my husband to pull out a chair for me. I get my own. I also don't order for him.

League_Girl
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06 Oct 2011, 1:11 pm

BuyerBeware wrote:

My NT husband gets very offended at a lot of the things that partners and experts say about Aspies. He doesn't let me read that stuff any more-- he says that the harm it does my self-esteem is 10 times worse than any problem Aspergers causes us.

I keep telling him I wish he would join ASPartners or something similar so he would have a chance to realize how much of his low self-esteem and such like is my fault, how I have absolutely destroyed him and how much happier he would be with an NT spouse.

He keeps telling me how good I have been for him, how I have encouaged him over the years, how I never stopped believing in him even when he was a whisker from flunking out of engineering school, how a lot of his low self-esteem is from things NT women/girls taught him as a teen and NOT because of me.

I see myself through the lens of things like ASPartners. I think I have to, or I'll become some kind of monster. He thinks that lens IS the monster, and that we were much better off when I had a more insouciant and self-defined attitude toward it all.

It's driven my to consider forcing him to accept a divorce for his own good, twice to run away from home for his own good, and several times to consider and once to attempt suicide. One way or the other, I MUST put this to rest if I am going to function. Has anyone else had a problem like this???

So are you pushing him away? Are you the one leaving him and divorcing him because you feel you are not a good wife?

I have also felt bad about myself and I go asking my husband about it and he tells me he doesn't feel that way about me and I am a good wife and he doesn't care ad it doesn't bother him. That is why I don't go to that place often because it's all scary. At least it tells us how not to act but lot of these women are so needy and no matter what the aspie does, it's never good enough. I have even felt sorry for their aspie kids too because they have a parent who is so hateful towards AS.

You sound very lucky to have someone who accepts you and thinks you are a great wife and you're pushing it all away.

League_Girl
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06 Oct 2011, 1:15 pm

To be fair, the same stuff I have seen women whining about on there about how their AS partners won't help out or won't help take care of the kids or do anything around the house, I have seen the same complaints by NT women at Babycenter whining about their NT husbands doing the same thing. So obviously this is not an AS issue women are whining about on ASPartners. It felt like I was reading ASpartner posts all over again except it was at Babycenter.

Meow101
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06 Oct 2011, 1:29 pm

Wayne wrote:

hanyo wrote:

Meow101 wrote:

That true but I think other people and I are posting about the women because it seems like the vast majority of posts there are from nt women. There are some nt men but few and far between.

Please restrict these comments to NT women. I don't connect using nonverbal stuff. I don't pick up on it more than half the time, and when I do I often misinterpret it and can't rely on it.

I see what you mean about men being a bit more tolerant of situations that aren't quite what they expected, but a man *could* use the woman's AS against her in a custody dispute. When things were worse between me and my husband I actually had to think about that unfortunate reality. Now that he's willing to work on things and educate himself about AS, fortunately things have improved.

~Kate

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Ce e amorul? E un lung
Prilej pentru durere,
Caci mii de lacrimi nu-i ajung
Si tot mai multe cere.
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Wayne
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06 Oct 2011, 2:22 pm

Meow101 wrote:

Please restrict these comments to NT women.

I meant to... just left out the qualifier. Sorry.

Quote:

I see what you mean about men being a bit more tolerant of situations that aren't quite what they expected, but a man *could* use the woman's AS against her in a custody dispute. When things were worse between me and my husband I actually had to think about that unfortunate reality. Now that he's willing to work on things and educate himself about AS, fortunately things have improved.

~Kate

He could.... but would it work?

I saw a number of women publicly wishing they could use a guy's AS to deny visitation (not just custody) and legally cut off all contact, and a few even seriously try it, but I don't recall seeing any posts from anyone who had successfully done that. I wouldn't worry that much about it.

League_Girl
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06 Oct 2011, 2:29 pm

That is just scary. In the past I have pictured myself in the future married with kids and my future husband and I go through a divorce and he decides to get full custody over the kids and cut me out of the kids lives and use my anxiety and AS against me and to exaggerate all my problems and symptoms to manipulate the judge. I know that can happen because partners will do anything to win full custody over their kids, even if it means to use their spouse's condition against them even though they were good parents themselves. They might bring up past issues or past episodes or incidents to use against their partner too to manipulate the judge and to make it all look bad. But it can happen, not to me but to anyone. This wasn't something I worried too much about.

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