Bad teacher!

Post Reply New Topic

At a recent Board meeting, we made a decision to fire a teacher. I’m trying to figure out how to explain why this decision was bad. If you guys can throw in some ideas on how to explain, I would appreciate it.

The situation:

Fred is the music teacher. He also wears a number of other hats, such as in-class support teacher, and has finished the year in middle school science and math when new teachers didn’t work out.

As a music teacher, he is considered mediocre. His product is not as polished and pretty as you might see in some schools. He lets the kids try things that are somewhat out-of-the-box and, if it misses the mark or if it’s a little off-key, he doesn’t get too fussed.

He is quirky and has a few learning disabilities of his own, and certain kids claim that math only makes sense after a tutoring session with Fred.

All the kids like him (K thru eighth) especially the middle school kids, and particularly the quirky ones. They are not very articulate as to why they like him so much.

The problem is that we have reason to fear a budget cut next year, and the first thing to go will be Fred’s position. If we don’t fire him, he will be tenured as of September 1st. If we need to eliminate his position, as a tenured teacher he will have the right to bump a teacher with less seniority.

The only person he could bump is the kindergarten teacher, who we (Principal and Board) all agree is ideal for the job, and we all agree that Fred would make a very incompetent kindergarten teacher. He works best with the middle school crowd.

If we fire him after he earns tenure, theoretically, he could sue the school. As a tiny charter school, we are already on shaky financial ground. A big law suit could close the school completely.

--------------------

My argument:

Part One, The degradation of US culture in general:

We imagine that a person might do something terrible, so we eliminate the potential by eliminating the person. That’s the mentality that got us into Iraq. The official government lies would not have carried so much weight without a culture so degraded and corrupt that this kind of thinking made sense.

The recent decision by our Board follows the same logic and makes no more sense. That's just giving into the fear and paranoia that has permeated all levels of our culture, especially in the past decade. When things get desperate and crazy, those who are able to stop and think should do so, and not join the panic.

Not everyone is out to get you. A situation MIGHT arise in a few years (budget cut) that MIGHT inspire this person to become a jerk and make trouble for the school, therefore we need to be jerks now? I refuse to live in that world.

--------------------

Part Two, Diversity of personality:

The teacher in question is not on the same wave-length as the principal. His best assets are in areas that she cannot see and does not value. All she sees is a moderately competent, quirky guy that everyone likes.

Some people can connect or relate to each other and some can’t. Not everyone can be on the same wave-length. If you have a kid with a problem and a teacher who can’t connect with him, the best you can hope for is professional behavior. In some cases, that’s not enough.

As adults, if we can’t connect emotionally, communication can be strained. Still, we can be civil and hope for the best.

The connections between coworkers matters more in some industries than in others. It doesn’t have to be about someone being good or bad. Artists collaborate better and are more productive when they’re on the same wave-length. If I were a cop, I wouldn’t want to rush into a dangerous situation with a partner who doesn’t make sense to me. (Then again, I’d make a lousy cop and wouldn’t be there anyway.)

On the other hand, I don’t think this applies to a school staff. (The factory model is degrading to everyone involved and just plain wrong.) Children are not cattle, to be moved along by workers who are interchangeable, standardized parts of an assembly line. I don’t think I would want a staff that can work together like a well-oiled machine.

If the teachers all have the same mindset and agree on everything, they’ll stop looking for flaws in the system and assume that the problem is only in the child. There’s strength in numbers, but in this case that strength can make the child an adversary in his own educational decisions and treatment.

Personally, I never met an adult that I could respect until I was old enough to go to places I wasn’t supposed to go and hang out with people I wasn’t supposed to know. All the adults in my life had an attitude of keeping up a united front. Adults were always right and kids were always wrong, and they believed that admitting to a mistake would somehow undermine their credibility.

No comments?
My explanation is too lame.
I need a way to say it better.

Is this teacher being fired or more just laid off? You're saying the school is eliminating his position, so they're getting rid of the music program? I think that stinks. At the same time, though, you can't really keep an employee after eliminating their job. I'm confused as to what exactly the situation was. I think it's a bad decision to eliminate a music program. But after deciding to eliminate the music program, there isn't much of a decision to make about the music teacher, is there? I'm sorry, maybe I'm missing something..

Just tell the man what is going on, maybe offer Fred some training so that you can keep him as a teacher of maths or science or tell him that if he does become a teacher of either then he has a place at the school whenever he wants to come back. On the other hand can he not become a more senior support staff or a proper teacher in order to keep him, can you not justify keeping him as a support staff

We don't know for a fact that the budget will be cut.
By the time we know, Fred will have tenure.
The stated fear is that, IF he has to be laid off, he'll make trouble.

Tenure law assumes that all competent teachers are interchangeable.
Either you're in or you're out.

If Fred tried to teach kindergarten, he would eventually be fired anyway, but
only after much harm to the kiddies and anguish for the adults. And legal fees
that would break the school. We have no reason to think that he would do that.

Underneath it all is that fact that the Principal doesn't value him anyway.
Left to her own, she would turn a little hippie charter school into a carbon
copy of all the other schools, defeating the purpose of its existence.
I don't want a bunch of teachers who all march to the same drummer.

If we could find a way to explain why he is valuable, the budget excuse for
not giving him tenure would not be as strong.

At his salary, we can't justify keeping him around as support staff.

Another angle that she will never see is that she thinks the school should be run like a business. I see it as a family business, with Fred as an important part of the family. He was there for us in a thousand ways that a regular employee would not have been. You don't get that kind of dedication from a hireling.

There is no way you can employ him as a sort of maths tutor on a lower wage. How long does his contract go on for and can you explain the potential dilemma then if you offered him a lower paid potential job, if there is a budget cut. If he rejects it then you have a problem but if he knows what the situation is he may be more likely to say yes, it is the difference between a high paid job now and potentially no job tomorrow and a high paid job now and if the worst happens then still a job tomorrow.

Fred's contract has to end with June. If he returns in September, tenure is automatic.

We're not even allowed to tell him the real reason he's being laid off, although he might have guessed. The only negotiating we can do is within the Board, the accountant and the Principal.

How can I explain why he is valuable to people who don't understand, at a gut level, the social problems of kids with special needs; and

How can I explain that the pre-emptive strike mentality is crazy, without screaming or foaming at the mouth or strangling someone.

Tahitii,

I know you probably don't care WHAT I think, but it sounds like he is NOT a good teacher. It sounds like he MIGHT be OK as a tutor(the student can push for expanations, etc...) and MAYBE support. Add the idea of tenure, and I would say drop him.

Why?

Because if you keep him one more term then you can't drop him, so he should be reaally good.

You describe him as a rather mediocre teacher when teaching to a group. Apparently he has TWO things goinbg for him:

1. He can at least HELP one on one.
2. You believe he is good with support needs.
3. You YOURSELF indicated that that didn't justify his pay.

(2ukenkerl -- I do care what you think. You sound like certain Board members who won't explain why the pre-emptive strike makes sense.)

My problem is that we don't yet know about the budget cut.
We need to hire misc part-timers -- people we know will not do as well --
to fill in for a position that does not need to be eliminated.
We might never need to eliminate it. The point is that we don't know.

I hope you aren't saying I am as evasive as those board members.

Budget cuts WILL happen sooner or later, even if there are merely increases in the available funds, but greater needs to increase services. It is all but a GIVEN. Since he will soon be tenured, you are obligating yourself far into the future.

Yeah, it is HARD to hire good people, and a lot of "teachers" are IDIOTS! A good teacher SHOULD know, and even LOVE, the subject, but it would be great if they merely knew where to get the info, and how to teach it. I have known FEW that had all of the above. MOST probably don't have ANY. So I certainly DO know your job is HARD!

I interview people for my company. They basically use me to make the final decision as to whether the person should be accepted! I had to GREATLY increase my tolerance! Basically, if they get a C on my simple test, they get in! FEW get a C(On the american scale, that means AVERAGE, and it is considered a POOR score)! Fewer get a B(Above average, and what most want to get). Almost nobody gets an A(excellent). There are a LOT of Fs(F for FAIL or FLUNK) though! And my test is SIMPLE! It is like I am testing a persons driving and merely asking what tires are! I even accept stupid answers like "the big round things that touch the ground and spin". I can't lower my tolerance any more than I have though. They respect that, as almost all end up working out. Earlier, they had more problems.

Oh well, I have to go by my understanding of what you said, and the fact that you will be obligated far into the future. Maybe you know better than I do. I am merely stating my opinion based on the facts as I understand them. One thing though. If you DO know better, state the facts better. A lot of boards are filled with idiots ALSO, but THEY might, as I have, base a PROPER opinion on their understanding of what you said. So maybe they AREN'T idiots, but making a decision like I did for the same reason.

I didn't follow that.

EASY:

OLD budget: 1 Million!
NEW Budget: 1.5 Million!

SOUNDS like an increase!

Inflation: 60,000
Buiding for new 100 Students: 400,000
New teachers 1 year: 120,000
INCREASED COSTS: 580000

Effective Budget change: -80,000(EVEn AFTER a 50% increase in the money you get.)

A school's mission is not just to produce a good average, but also not to drop people who can achieve something. If Fred is the only one who knows how to teach some of the kids, that is a valuable skill. The principal and board probably think only about the average and see it as inevitable that school will fail to make a difference for some pupils. Perhaps that is inevitable. But if Fred can make it inevitable for a few less, that is worth something. Remind the board that the jobs for undereducated people are mostly going to India and China. Education is becoming more important.


Is it possible to talk to the kids and ask them?



So the real problem is that if you have to fire someone, then Fred having seniority over the kindergarten teacher would force you to fire the wrong person. Can you change seniority? Is tenure awarded only on the basis of length of service, or also on the basis of achievement? Can the kindergarten teacher be tenured before Fred? Is there any other way of giving her seniority? An achievement award? Some honorary position? What happens if all teachers have tenure, and there is a budget cut? Can the most junior still be fired? Or do they just all have to take a pay cut?

Does seniority depend only on total service, or does it start from zero if there is an interruption in employment? If it starts again from zero, there would be the possibility to fire and immediately re-hire Fred. That would only work if you tell him and he agrees.


That may give you a legal counterargument. Point out to the board that if Fred is not satisfied with the reasons they give, he might sue for unfair dismissal, and all the minutes of board meetings could be subpoenaed, and board members would have to testify under oath. If they then say they are firing him now just in case they have to fire someone later, he would probably win. The threat of an expensive law suit cuts both ways.

There is staff morale. Do the principal and board think they will be able to keep the reason for Fred's firing secret from the other teachers? I wouldn't trust a principal and board who fire a colleague for this reason even if I were the beneficiary.

You put in one word that made that a LIE!! !! !!

The TRUTH is:

the jobs for Americans are mostly going to NON Americans!

If Engineers, doctors, teachers, etc... that even have DOCTORATES are considered to be "undereducated", then what would you expect Americans to be?

EVERYONE can "acheive something". WHO CARES!?!?!? The school shouldn't pay people to "acheive something". It is to pay for something of VALUE!



Obviously, tahitii spoke to them and didn't find their words to be very worthwhile.




Tenure is based SOLELY on seniority. At least that is my understanding from MANY sources! It is one of the REALLY moronic things about the US school system! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenure

The wikipedia one claims you need a certain title and level of competence, but that has certainly NOT been my experience. In fact, MOST people I have heardd of having tenure didn't even have the title!



Given the exchange, it seems that question has been answered. Generally, NOPE!





Frankly, even if you COULD do that, it opens you up to a lawsuit.



It sounds to me like the reason would be that they couldn't afford to keep him on, have a better teacher, and want to prevent a situation that can only HURT the school. How would ANY of that work in fred's favor, hurt morale, etc.... A lawsuit would only hurt fred.