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Philologos
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10 Feb 2011, 12:25 am

Do you operate better / more often with reason and going through the steps of a problem, or with intuition taking you to the solution via the shortcut?

Years of learning / teaching doing, in many areas but especially in my major focus of Linguistics, has shown:

I can and often do go the step by step snail mail route, especially with hew hard unfamiliar things. But more often I will take in the data and jump straight to the answer. It is not always that fast - I vcan collect data for years before the leap. And I will often check it by doing the step through, and teaching beginniers in Linguistics I will give them the step by step method., telling them it will work for them but that in time they may find intuition taking over.



anbuend
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10 Feb 2011, 1:26 am

I'm way more about sort of... a sensory-based "intuition" than an idea-based "logic". I tried really hard for a good half my life or so to do the idea-based stuff because it seemed like the only way to be "real" and "smart", but that just isn't me. It's not how I operate best. And I've learned I do better working the way I operate best.

I'm trying an experiment that way in trying to learn the cello. (I was very good at violin as a kid so I am thinking I have a fair chance at this.) But I'm doing it different than I've ever done an instrument before. No classes. No reading music. No daily practicing unless it just happens that way. What I've done is in the beginning a lot of working at it until I have the basics of the basics. Then put it away for weeks, months until something tells me to play it. Then I go and play it. Each time I do this I get better. It's like rather than plodding along at practice, my brain skips over that part by filtering the skill down into my sensory/motor memory intuitively, resulting in improvement each time I leave it for awhile. So far it's working far better than constant practice ever has.

I got that idea through repeated experience with things working that way. Skills popping up seemingly out of nowhere after a wait rather than after plodding, grueling practice. Especially skills that rely (at least in this context) more on sensory stuff than idea stuff. And I am so relieved by this after all this time trying to fit in when I couldn't, by using idea-logic-stuff that just didn't work for me.


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aghogday
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10 Feb 2011, 1:38 am

Most of my life I had to take the step by step, reasoned approach but found a more intuitive approach after the age of 40, in many avenues in life. I played piano only by sheet music and could not create any music beyond slight variation of music I read, although I greatly desired the ability to create.

At about age 46 the ability to create music suddenly flowed through my hands, without awareness of reasoned intent; one of the most satisfying experiences I have had in life. It was like I suddenly developed the ability to speak a language I never knew.

I developed issues with vision and baby steps describe where I stand now.



Philologos
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10 Feb 2011, 9:13 am

anbuend wrote:
I'm way more about sort of... a sensory-based "intuition" than an idea-based "logic". I tried really hard for a good half my life or so to do the idea-based stuff because it seemed like the only way to be "real" and "smart", but that just isn't me. It's not how I operate best. And I've learned I do better working the way I operate best.

I'm trying an experiment that way in trying to learn the cello. (I was very good at violin as a kid so I am thinking I have a fair chance at this.) But I'm doing it different than I've ever done an instrument before. No classes. No reading music. No daily practicing unless it just happens that way. What I've done is in the beginning a lot of working at it until I have the basics of the basics. Then put it away for weeks, months until something tells me to play it. Then I go and play it. Each time I do this I get better. It's like rather than plodding along at practice, my brain skips over that part by filtering the skill down into my sensory/motor memory intuitively, resulting in improvement each time I leave it for awhile. So far it's working far better than constant practice ever has.

I got that idea through repeated experience with things working that way. Skills popping up seemingly out of nowhere after a wait rather than after plodding, grueling practice. Especially skills that rely (at least in this context) more on sensory stuff than idea stuff. And I am so relieved by this after all this time trying to fit in when I couldn't, by using idea-logic-stuff that just didn't work for me.


Hey ho, how well I know [I did violin as young, quit because they were not letting me get to the pojnt I could DO anything but finger exercises].

Brought up in mainline academia, TRIED to be a good read the literature plod - till I found the other got better results faster.



Philologos
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10 Feb 2011, 9:17 am

aghogday wrote:
Most of my life I had to take the step by step, reasoned approach but found a more intuitive approach after the age of 40, in many avenues in life. I played piano only by sheet music and could not create any music beyond slight variation of music I read, although I greatly desired the ability to create.

At about age 46 the ability to create music suddenly flowed through my hands, without awareness of reasoned intent; one of the most satisfying experiences I have had in life. It was like I suddenly developed the ability to speak a language I never knew.

I developed issues with vision and baby steps describe where I stand now.


The delayed onset is interesting - pretty sure for me it ewas always thee but I suppressed it to conform.

Sorry to hear about the vision. I really rely on that, can barely imagine. A few years back, out of the blue one night a blood vessel popped in one eye - I thought I was losing it, very scared. I saw pink and floating blood cells in my left eye [my less useful one, fortunately] for months.



syrella
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10 Feb 2011, 9:33 am

I think intuition is often overlooked as a method of problem solving. Many of the greatest minds in history had an "ah-ha" moment when they came up with their ground-breaking theory or explanation. But, of course, their knowledge didn't just come out of nowhere. Most worked long hours practicing and fine-tuning and really "knowing" their subject. So I'd say both intuition and straight up logic have their place.

I think the best time is when the logic becomes internalized and you now understand a subject through intuition. That's when you really start making progress.


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Philologos
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10 Feb 2011, 12:57 pm

Think riding a bicycle - playing an instrument.

It is very unclear to me how much intuition so called is learning internalized and how much it is its own thing.

A lot of people seem to do very little - so far as one can tell.