Aspies and Intelligence

Post Reply New Topic

Okay, I've met a few Aspies and it seemed to me that some didn't seem very intelligent, I don't know if it was their behaviour or body language but it felt so awkward and I was wondering whether they actually had Aspergers or were slightly ret*d. Sorry, I don't mean to offend anyone but I am just trying to understand. My doctor told me that most Aspies were extremely intelligent. I for example had an IQ of a 140 when I was 8 years old or something which makes me a genius I guess (Wechsler Scale). And while I sometimes do really weird stuff and I do have OCD I don't for example rock back and forth in my chair or make a constant 'Hnnnn-Ha-Hnnnn-Ha' humming noise... Are Aspies usually very intelligent and is it just part of their disability which might make them seem less intelligent or what?


PS: Let me just add that on occasion people have thought I was pretty stupid too. When I was little a woman once asked my mother if I was ret*d... Which made me so angry that I threw my water at her...

Some people think I'm ret*d, but others think I'm a genius. It really depends on the situation. I've done some stupid things before, but I'm definitely not stupid.

I know that extremely high intelligence isn't typical of all aspies, though it is common for us to have above average intelligence. I don't know about below average intelligence though - isn't one of the defining factors between AS/HFA and Lower Functioning Autism whether there is mental retardation present or not? Of course, I could be wrong... feel free to correct me!

Besides, you have to consider the fact that the Weschler Scale doesn't cover different ways in which an individual is functioning - you've even acknowledged it yourself. A simple score says very little as to what a person is capable of. Every aspie is different, after all.

I know that extremely high intelligence isn't typical of all aspies, though it is common for us to have above average intelligence. I don't know about below average intelligence though - isn't one of the defining factors between AS/HFA and Lower Functioning Autism whether there is mental retardation present or not? Of course, I could be wrong... feel free to correct me!

Besides, you have to consider the fact that the Weschler Scale doesn't cover different ways in which an individual is functioning - you've even acknowledged it yourself. A simple score says very little as to what a person is capable of. Every aspie is different, after all.

I rock back and forth amd sometimes make humming noises to work as white noise, while I'm also rather smart.

Those autistics were probably as smart as you.

There are some aspies who are very smart, but their social difficulties are so pronounced that you simply can't tell, or their interests are so narrow that they come across as extremely ignorant of the most basic things sometimes. The ways we judge intelligence often put aspies on the low end very unfairly. "If he's so smart, why can't he _______?" At least we're not being diagnosed as ret*d like we used to be.

As I understand it, being on the spectrum says nothing of a person's intelligence.

I've heard the theory that having higher intelligence allows someone on the spectrum to learn social rules that someone with lower intelligence never picks up on. I don't know if I really buy it but it's possible. I personally feel that people with severe autism are dysfunctional enough so that it's impossible to measure their intelligence accurately.

I think when someone thinks of an 'intelligent person' they imagine someone who is intelligent in all domains of life. Individuals with AS are probably more likely to really excel (show their true intellect) in a particular domain, e.g. their 'special interest', and perhaps have more limited abilities in others (so don't fit the stereotype). Of course when you meet someone for the first time you generally don't try to test their intelligence, all you've got to go on is their social interaction and level of discourse...naturally this probably wouldn't show an AS individual in the best light.

Although this isn't to say all AS individuals have hidden genius, and perhaps it is a dangerous stereotype to entertain. Whilst as far as I know, higher than average IQ is common in Aspergers, no AS (or NT) individual should be down-valued purely because they don't meet 'expectations'.

I've asked two autism specialists whether this is possible, and they're both of the opinion that this is very unlikely (without intensive intervention to help the person learn social rules).

Some autistic behavior may appear "unintelligent" in a false sense, and the required context in which an autistic person can really show what they are capable of may be more specific. Many of us appear less mature compared to our chronological age. Our brains tend not to work on command, we can be slow, distracted, such lack of fluency might be seen as being a "ret*d".

I do this, and other embarrassing stims, and I have an above average (though rather uneven) IQ. So does Bill Gates. There are other symptoms and traits I don't have at all that you probably do have, and it suggests nothing about which of us is more intelligent. For example I can't imagine ever caring whether I sit in the same seat everyday, I can't even begin to relate to such needs actually, even less than the average NT says they can. Knowing broadly what you're going to do each day ahead of time is one thing, I understand that, but Aspie routines make no sense to me. That doesn't mean I'm more intelligent than Aspies who do have that trait.

I don't really know. I don't think that Aspies would be stupid. They are certainly not normal, but they're not stupid.

"Are you normal?!"
"No, I am not normal."

"You are soooo stupid!"
"I am not stupid."

How to answer this question? I am not the only one in my family that I suspect has AS. I know I have been accused of being really dumb, either because of the way I acted or how I did in school.

Growing up, most people thought I was stupid. I never did well in school beyond reading or spelling or art. Part of it was due to the fact that I was picked on so much I played dumb. Even people I thought were supposed to be my friends would tell me they thought I was stupid. I had been tested, & my IQ was higher than normal. I later took an IQ test that I bought at a bookstore, & scored 132. I know I am not dumb, but I guess when it comes to others, they judge me based on my actions or my performance or something. So that's my personal experience.

My dad whom I also suspect is on the spectrum doesn't seem all that bright to me. He does really dumb stuff, & has caused himself problems by not thinking things through. Even after I've warned him that his behavior would get him into trouble. He still did things anyway (very stubborn). So have I, but I've been trying to get better at not making really stupid mistakes as I get older. This is something about my dad that I have observed since I was a teen, btw. I know he never scored high marks in school (neither did I), but when it comes to his special interests, he has a wealth of knowledge beyond what the normal person might know. Like me, he's mostly self-taught. I have taken some college courses, while he refused to attend college like his parents wanted. He's like a walking talking encyclopedia on his favorite subject. So is he stupid? Well, I've seen him do some really dumb things over the years, but in some ways he's super smart too. I don't know what his actual IQ would be & it's kind of hard to test him because he most likely wouldn't understand a lot of the questions, especially regarding math skills & abilities.

My youngest daughter also appears to have AS. She hasn't had good grades for ages. Recently, she was transferred to a smaller school where she's been put into honors classes. Even her friends said they thought she wasn't very bright. She believed that to be true. I haven't had her IQ tested. But my best guess is that she's at least in the normal range. She's definitely not dumb. Although she can act like she's not very bright too.

So maybe it is possible to appear to be dumb to people who don't understand AS. Maybe it's a survival mechanism?

I am very slow in some ways as in when I was in school I used put my socks on the other way round i.e inside-out or with the heels facing towards the front of my ankles. Didn't figure out how to work them correctly until university. It also took me a lot of time to work my school shoes or belts. . I was very clumsy in the home science class. Could not stitch to save my life even the boys were better than me. I guess it has something to do with my motor skills.. This is the most embarrasing thing I could not bathe myself. My dad did it for me till 5th grade. After which my mom tried to teach me how to but it took me a long time to learn! The first few days I would walk in and not know where to start. Used to sit there till my mom came in and hurried me up by telling me how to. And even more embarrassing things I wont mention... My sister also has aspergers and her IQ is higher than mine. Growing up she learnt certain things faster than me. She however is totally incapable of understanding love and certain emotions just like my mom.

But I still scored top grades in my class in science, literature and maths (though I lost interest in math in high school). Oh and I was very good at taking care of my baby sister very patient with her when we slept in the same room. Whenever she had nightmares I would put her back to sleep rather than running to mom in my 4th grade and certain other things my parents thought were too mature for my age.. I was patient and helping when mom had her potlucks with her professor friends during my 4th grade. All of em used to say that I was very understanding for my age. Oh when my mom fell seriously ill it was my responsibility to take of a few house-hold chores... all of this in my 4th grade. My dad said I did a better job than her. Because of which one would think I would know how to put on socks but I did not!

I also paid no attention to clothing until my friend said it is a part of your personality it tells people something about you. That's when I started being a bit more particular about what I threw on.

So to answer your question I guess NTs are balanced all round while people with Asperger's are more intelligent or efficient in certain ways than others. This is the standard definition I know.

I disagree; I know that my intelligence, memory and powers of observation have helped me to learn social rules that I wouldn't otherwise have been aware of.

I think in many cases it simply comes down to inability to communicate that intelligence.

For example some of us may have learning difficulties - I didn't start to learn English until I was 7 and so I was rejected by most primary schools for being 'stupid', and this also means written and verbal communication for me can sometimes be less than spectacular. A lot of us have special interests where we can absorb information very well and express it in a way that shows our intelligence, but then many of us seem to loose all the information we learn over time or we don't have the ability to absorb information as easily in other areas, which can on occasion make us seem less than smart.

Also I can't speak for others, but I know it is normal for me to be very smart and eloquent in my head...but actually talking in front of people, getting those thoughts out...nope, I stammer, babble, speak like a 5-year old, as a child I would bark, etc.

Intelligence is also easily overlooked. We can understand new things quickly, and when we do we're often better at understanding new things fully so we can apply knowledge in other areas rather than simply copying a principle and trying to make it fit in other areas - it may not be noticed that we understood something new before NT's or that we have a better understanding.

Often in school I noticed others would be learning a new piece of information and be struggling with it, while I had already understood this and started thinking about it in another way. I'd ask the teacher about this other way of looking at the information...but because they were so used to other students struggling they assumed my expressing information in different ways meant that I had misunderstood and was struggling too...when in fact I was a few steps ahead of everyone else - but the teachers didn't see this, and so they and my classmates thought I was being stupid. I still get this happening now, and I can't seem to express this to people.

Last edited by Bloodheart on 04 Jun 2011, 6:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.