Things YOU Understand (but Don't Understand) About NTs

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To get back to the original question of this post, what I kind of get but am still not really on the same page regarding ... KISSING. Sometimes I feel it, other times not. However, I do see and sometimes feel why kissing is so important. I just haven't really nailed how to do it down yet.

"B" has little concept of "self." I firmly believe the selves A's have are gauged against a difference, such as being around divergent people -by different experiences. B's empathy is a general projection of "group think," a " conditioned program." B's sense of empathy( sympathy) is confined to B's culture. B fails to grasp the concept similar and like, and conflates these with "same." Ultimately, B has a shortcoming with ToM, hence a shortcoming in communication.

I believe you are thinking that A might fail in some regard because he cant fully and accurately communicate in the conversation: If I spoke to a deaf man, and I was unaware of that; I would lack ToM.

"Verdandi" is the name of one of the three Norse Norns, similar to the three Greek Fates. The three are Urd, Skuld, and Verdandi.

Wikipedia also says





I have improved over the years. I got my most intense lessons in this sort of thing because of playing role-playing games as a teenager and having trouble with the idea that characters I played might not know things that I knew. At that time I was aware that other people knew things I didn't and vice versa, but I think there were gaps because of the trouble I had playing, of all things, Dungeons & Dragons.

My hubby and I went round and round about that. When he wanted to talk about his problems, I kept trying to find a solution for him, but that wasn't what he wanted. He wanted someone to listen to him, just to discuss it. I've come to regard this as his "stim" since talking about it does the same for him as spinning or rocking does for me.

Just like they are social to recharge, contrasted with our need for solitude, they need to socially discuss problems to make them feel better

In regards to A "failing" with ToM, I was trying to play devil's advocate. A seems very much like someone with Asperger's (direct, blunt, no hidden context). And perhaps one could fault A for not taking into account that the people he speaks with might engage in this group think, as B is doing. Personally, I wouldn't hold it against him and applaud his directness.

B seems very NT to me. And as you yourself say, B engages in a group think. And B very much has a shortcoming with theory of mind.

Yet it seems the A-types are the ones accused of not having theory of mind. You're sort of agreeing with my premise at some point back wherein I say that the theory of mind autistics are allegedly lacking should be called "Theory of Neurotypical Mind," ie, "lacking ToM" as it's described in psychological literature really means inability or unwillingness to use group think as the standard for communication.

B does not strike me as autistic, or at least not Asperger's. B seems very much like an NT.

What is your theory as to how A and B would be classified regarding the spectrum and having/lacking ToM. I'm not asking how you would diagnose them, but how they'd most likely be diagnosed (AS or NT) based on the current climate of practicing psychologists?

Statistically, those on the spectrum are less likely to have as many romantic relationships as those who are NT.

I wonder if lack of experience might cause this confusion, or it really does just feel strange.

Sort of tying in with being kissed: I think I understand PDA (Public Displays of Affection) in theory. Part of it may be that people are just that in love, another part of it may be they want to display non-verbally that they're a couple. Yet, in practice, it feels really strange to me.

Right to the heart:
You are trying to diagnose yourself with this link- don't.

No, not diagnose myself with the link. I'm asking about your perception on how A and B would most likely be diagnosed. I may identify with A, but I may very well be a B. And how A or how B I am may vary in any given situation. So I'm not asking which one I'm more like. I'm asking, based on the link, how you think A and B would be diagnosed.

Last edited by again_with_this on 03 Jul 2012, 4:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

My AS is pretty mild.....social relationships and "chit-chat" are confusing and difficult for me, yes, but they aren't all-out impossible. I think over time I've become better at following NT conversations and acting like I give a damn about them (which I do not) just to fit in. I think a lot of the reason I don't understand/participate in these conversations is that I simply can't relate to what is being discussed. I've never had a boyfriend - don't know the first thing about being in an intimate relationship - so cannot talk about these things with friends. Even when I've had crushes (I'm in high school, mind you), I never wanted to go on about them in conversation. It's just boring to me.

If I were a Psychologist I would diagnose B with Green Acres syndrome. You've seen the 60's show?

As applying this to novel communication: Group think isn't in the AS Modus, so my conjecture is that you would not find someone on the spectrum guessing and implying motives - or projecting this at all. Something would have have to be asked of him/her. I'd doubt by this behavior (in the link) one could come to any conclusion of 'spectrum'. If someone did positively engage this, it would arise out of defensive anxiety - built from rehearsed scripts.

That is as far you can take this.

Being an autistic is a romantic disaster. This is because I am honest enough to tell a girl that her astrology is BS.

I was in Manhattan the other day, and when on 35th street crossing Park, I couldn't help but think, "darling I love you, but give me Park Avenue."



I'm NOT trying to draw this out, just trying to pick your brain. I guess what I'm asking based on this statement here, is that while group think is not in the AS nature, what about "preemptive group think" or being aware that group think exists, and trying one's best to anticipate it's possibilities, despite it not being natural. Would the autistic mind not even stop to question it? Or can an autistic minded-person actually spend a great deal of time trying to infer though not being able to fully participate (and probably not wanting to participate) in group think? In other words, not engaging in group think, but not oblivious to its existence (especially if the autistic is an adult). Just asking for clarification.



Positively engage what exactly? A behavior? B behavior? What?



Are you trying to tell me that's as far as your willing to go with this?

NTs seem to be obsessed with happiness. Not happiness itself, but the outward demonstration of happiness.

If someone isn't smiling and happy, then there has to be an urgent intervention to make them happy again. It doesn't matter how they actually feel - they MUST be smiling and happy no matter what, or else something is wrong with them and they must see a doctor and take pills.

You know, I've actually had people telling me that I should look happier because otherwise I'm "spoiling other people's good mood." Well, I'm sorry but I can't be smiling all the time... I can't.

Excellent observation. I've had NTs ask me if I was feeling down, when really I felt fine. I've also had surrounding NTs agree with the first one and chime in with things like, "smile more," or "yeah, I agree, you don't look too happy."

I've come to realize NTs like the display of happiness, and anything short of that may be seen as bothersome. I've also seen many putting on a happy face. Not necessarily phony, but a need to show their happiness moreso than would feel natural. But I don't know why they just can't accept that sometimes I'm happy, but don't feel the need to "show it" like they do.

It's human nature to survive. If you did not preemptively strike, you'd be smitten.




Initiating a communication to Interface this with anyone. As in the example, one doing this ( to "engage") out of pressure from culture; an anxiety to make it work because you don't know what shoe to wear-- a confusion that arises out of over thinking-- been there a million times. You stand there at a precipice -- you can feel like you're on that edge of a nervous breakdown






No, and Oh c'mon now. How "NT" of you to lead me.

I get confused with sarcasm half the time. I dont understand why sarcasm is used is it used for a hidden attempt at humor or what?