Discussion about high IQ vs communication on Little Golem

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isometry
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08 Apr 2013, 6:56 am

In the forum on Little Golem, a turn based board game server, someone started a discussion on whether high IQ could be a social handicap. While that may or may not be true in itself, I thought a board game server might attract aspies (diagnozed and undiagnozed), and posted the following, partly in order to raise awareness of AS. Comments/questions/protests/etc.?

"Hi [...], I find this topic very interesting. There seems to be an increasing awareness these days that many people who have been considered normal but nerdy actually have Asperger’s Syndrome (AS), or at least a mild form of it. I myself was diagnozed with it less than a year ago. I have a history of studying an encyclopedia on wildlife rather than playing outside as a child, memorizing pi to 131 decimal places at the age of 14 and getting medals in the International Mathematical Olympiad (IMO), while being poor at gymnastics, a picky eater/dresser, lacking enthusiasm for subjects outside of my special interests, and having some communication problems. I am not completely unsociable, but rather selectively sociable (as an old class mate accurately pointed out at a high school reunion last summer).

Things like IMO and LittleGolem would attract aspies. I saw a documentary on British teenagers who tried to qualify for the IMO, and up to several of them had AS. I am certainly not suggesting that the lot of you have it – I have met many quite outgoing persons in the world of mathematics and board games – but I would expect that there are some.

If one looks up AS (e.g., on wikipedia), one will find “typical traits” that will make many people (including me in the past) think they cannot possibly have it, such as being unable to read facial expressions, unable to understand jokes and sarcasm, unable to take others' point of view, panicking if their routines are broken, having an unusual walk and so on. I don’t mean to step on anyone’s toes if they do have these traits but I want to say that they don’t apply to me (or only to a small extent), and I believe many “nerds” are coming forward as aspies (or borderline aspies) without having these traits."



CyclopsSummers
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08 Apr 2013, 7:13 am

There was a short item on TV about a class of gifted children here in the Netherlands a while ago. The girl that was followed in the item (I think she was 8 or 9 years old) didn't appear to be autistic (i.e. she was comfortable in speaking to the presenter, there were no apparent social impairments or any mention of other impairments). What she DID express, however, was that she had found it difficult to get along in regular education, because on one hand the lessons were at a pace that was too slow for her, and on the other hand she couldn't always relate to her classmates. So she ended up being demotivated and frustrated, at that early age.

So that's why I could see how kids of exceptionally high intelligence may end up at odds with their surroundings, even if they don't necessarily have a social disorder like autism. I'd add that some of it also depends on how their parents handle this; how they balance education with socialisation; in my opinion additional courses for the gifted can be very beneficial, but the desire to learn could also be satiated in one's spare time.


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Tsunami
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08 Apr 2013, 8:11 am

High IQ is definitely a social handicap. It is hard to relate to people who are so different from yourself.



Highlander852456
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09 Apr 2013, 5:50 am

Majority of A studens are not happy about schools if they have IQ above average or not makes little difference. One of many reasons that so many good students start hating school is that they think they could do better and get pulled down by students that do not work as hard. I have to admit though I was more on the lesser side. I hardly ever payed attention or did well in my studies.



Highlander852456
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09 Apr 2013, 5:51 am

Majority of A studens are not happy about schools if they have IQ above average or not makes little difference. One of many reasons that so many good students start hating school is that they think they could do better and get pulled down by students that do not work as hard. I have to admit though I was more on the lesser side. I hardly ever payed attention or did well in my studies.



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09 Apr 2013, 6:06 am

I don't think you even need a particularly high IQ, you just need to think about things deeply and analytically to not be on the same wavelength as most people in my opinion.

The idea that only people with high IQ's are deep thinkers is erroneous.



Tsunami
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09 Apr 2013, 8:39 am

nessa238 wrote:
I don't think you even need a particularly high IQ, you just need to think about things deeply and analytically to not be on the same wavelength as most people in my opinion.

The idea that only people with high IQ's are deep thinkers is erroneous.


It's not just about deep thinking, but methods of thinking. In some ways, being a genius is like being autistic -- your thinking pattern differs from average people. Their thought process is faster, so their reactions will be different. A joke that is funny to an average person might not amuse someone who instantly predicts the punch line or knows the premise to be false. Games that are enjoyed by the masses might not be any more interesting to a genius than a kids game like tic-tac-toe would be to an adult who instantly grasps the strategy required. Television is boring when you can pick out the killer in the first ten minutes of the show. Things like this are minor differences, but they can add up over time into a feeling of alienation that I'm sure many here can understand.



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09 Apr 2013, 3:28 pm

Tsunami wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
I don't think you even need a particularly high IQ, you just need to think about things deeply and analytically to not be on the same wavelength as most people in my opinion.

The idea that only people with high IQ's are deep thinkers is erroneous.


It's not just about deep thinking, but methods of thinking. In some ways, being a genius is like being autistic -- your thinking pattern differs from average people. Their thought process is faster, so their reactions will be different. A joke that is funny to an average person might not amuse someone who instantly predicts the punch line or knows the premise to be false. Games that are enjoyed by the masses might not be any more interesting to a genius than a kids game like tic-tac-toe would be to an adult who instantly grasps the strategy required. Television is boring when you can pick out the killer in the first ten minutes of the show. Things like this are minor differences, but they can add up over time into a feeling of alienation that I'm sure many here can understand.



Smartness is not the same as intelligence. A so-called genius may be smart but not necessarily intelligent, though there could be some correlation there, as his thinking is probably more integrated in some areas, especially the areas of his expertise. However an intelligent mind is integrative from every angle in a way which is creative and alive. It is connected to the tree of life...

Re active thinking, that,plus also the practice of loving actions is the way for a mind to become completely comprehensive, completely integrative, so intelligent. An intelligent person who is able to love, not just pretend love or attachment love, but aware love, sensitive love, is probably what people mean by "wise." I am striving to live that way, but far from it.



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09 Apr 2013, 6:30 pm

Quote:
Smartness is not the same as intelligence. A so-called genius may be smart but not necessarily intelligent, though there could be some correlation there, as his thinking is probably more integrated in some areas, especially the areas of his expertise. However an intelligent mind is integrative from every angle in a way which is creative and alive. It is connected to the tree of life...


You have a very atypical definition of the word 'intelligent'.



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11 Apr 2013, 10:41 am

Ettina wrote:
Quote:
Smartness is not the same as intelligence. A so-called genius may be smart but not necessarily intelligent, though there could be some correlation there, as his thinking is probably more integrated in some areas, especially the areas of his expertise. However an intelligent mind is integrative from every angle in a way which is creative and alive. It is connected to the tree of life...


You have a very atypical definition of the word 'intelligent'.


Hello. To understand new things and/or understand in a new way it is sometimes necessary to make new definitions as one goes along.