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could this rule out a possible autism/asperger diagnosis?

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momentsforeverfaded
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17 Jul 2013, 2:28 pm

Hi.
I relate to a lot of autisc characteristics, except that I can read facial expressions/body language and I do not have meltdowns/tantruns. I am also sensitive to rejection/people's critics.
Does it mean I am for sure not an asperger/autist?

thanks.



Thelibrarian
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17 Jul 2013, 2:38 pm

momentsforeverfaded wrote:
Hi.
I relate to a lot of autisc characteristics, except that I can read facial expressions/body language and I do not have meltdowns/tantruns. I am also sensitive to rejection/people's critics.
Does it mean I am for sure not an asperger/autist?

thanks.


I will leave the specifics of what constitutes a diagnosis to others. Rather, I will ask whether you have these things, and have simply learned to control them. The reason I'm asking is that when I first learned of AS, I didn't think I had the "stimming" characteristic. But after reading other aspie's stories, and thinking back to my childhood, I think stimming is something I simply learned to repress successfully, primarily due to getting the daylights beaten out of me by my father for doing such things. Could your situation be similar?



momentsforeverfaded
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17 Jul 2013, 2:54 pm

Thelibrarian wrote:

I will leave the specifics of what constitutes a diagnosis to others. Rather, I will ask whether you have these things, and have simply learned to control them. The reason I'm asking is that when I first learned of AS, I didn't think I had the "stimming" characteristic. But after reading other aspie's stories, and thinking back to my childhood, I think stimming is something I simply learned to repress successfully, primarily due to getting the daylights beaten out of me by my father for doing such things. Could your situation be similar?


HOW did you learned to control your stimming? I need to know this.
well, I can sense what a person is feeling by looking at their faces, but I am slower than most people to get what are their intentions, I need to discreetly ask someone to reassure myself that I am right about what someone wants.
But I could have learned to interprete facial expressions/intentions?
I remember being a much more naive child than most. They would make jokes and be ironic/sarcastic and I would believe everything they said. But this can't apply to me anymore, because I know (most of the times) when someone is just joking.

Maybe I have meltdowns and I don't know. What would be considered a meltdown/tantrun?



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17 Jul 2013, 2:55 pm

How well do you read nonverbal cues? About as well as most people? Or significantly poorer but still able to do it somewhat?

You pretty much have to have at least some impairment in that area to have AS, but it doesn't need to be severe. For example, I find I can spot many nonverbal cues, but I miss others (my parents have pointed this out). In particular, I tend not to notice nonverbal cues directed at other people as well as those directed at me, so I don't realize how other people relate to each other. (Except in TV shows, where they won't direct any cues directly at me.)

The Mind in the Eyes test that many people here have linked to as a screening test is not very sensitive, because about 50% of AS people score in the normal range on that one. (As opposed to 100% of NTs, so it's still a significant difference.) In my experience the best way to tell if you have subtle difficulty reading nonverbal cues is to look at your everyday performance. Talk to someone who knows you well, and ask them if they think you miss nonverbal cues. Ask them for specific examples - not only can you figure out if you really missed the cues or if they misperceived you, but it can be educational if you did miss cues.



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17 Jul 2013, 2:58 pm

Quote:
Maybe I have meltdowns and I don't know. What would be considered a meltdown/tantrun?


Depends who you ask.

Generally, it involves yelling and/or crying, often combined with aggression, self-injury or throwing/breaking objects.

However, meltdowns are not required for AS. They're common, but there are AS people who don't have them, and there are many other conditions that cause meltdowns too. (Seriously, they're like the psychiatric equivalent of coughing. Practically everything can cause meltdowns.)



Thelibrarian
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17 Jul 2013, 3:03 pm

momentsforeverfaded wrote:
Thelibrarian wrote:

I will leave the specifics of what constitutes a diagnosis to others. Rather, I will ask whether you have these things, and have simply learned to control them. The reason I'm asking is that when I first learned of AS, I didn't think I had the "stimming" characteristic. But after reading other aspie's stories, and thinking back to my childhood, I think stimming is something I simply learned to repress successfully, primarily due to getting the daylights beaten out of me by my father for doing such things. Could your situation be similar?


HOW did you learned to control your stimming? I need to know this.
well, I can sense what a person is feeling by looking at their faces, but I am slower than most people to get what are their intentions, I need to discreetly ask someone to reassure myself that I am right about what someone wants.
But I could have learned to interprete facial expressions/intentions?
I remember being a much more naive child than most. They would make jokes and be ironic/sarcastic and I would believe everything they said. But this can't apply to me anymore, because I know (most of the times) when someone is just joking.

Maybe I have meltdowns and I don't know. What would be considered a meltdown/tantrun?


I learned to control my stimming as a young child to avoid beatings and, in the absence of those, embarrassment. I still have tics, such as blinking too much. But generally, my tics are minimal unless I'm stressed.

I too have learned some about reading faces, ridicule, sarcasm, etc., simply because that's how the world is; I have yet to meet another aspie face-to-face. But, like you, in situations with too much stimuli, or where I'm starting to shut down, I begin to lose these abilities. It's one reason I much prefer dealing with others via phone, or better yet, on the computer. Here I can take a minute and examine things in a relatively calm environment. It is much harder to do this in person.

I've learned to control my meltdowns, at least to some degree, largely by avoiding situations where I'm liable to have one. Beyond that, in the NT world, too much display of emotion is socially unacceptable, and I have enough problems with being ostracized already.



momentsforeverfaded
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17 Jul 2013, 3:05 pm

Ettina wrote:
How well do you read nonverbal cues? About as well as most people? Or significantly poorer but still able to do it somewhat?

You pretty much have to have at least some impairment in that area to have AS, but it doesn't need to be severe. For example, I find I can spot many nonverbal cues, but I miss others (my parents have pointed this out). In particular, I tend not to notice nonverbal cues directed at other people as well as those directed at me, so I don't realize how other people relate to each other. (Except in TV shows, where they won't direct any cues directly at me.)

The Mind in the Eyes test that many people here have linked to as a screening test is not very sensitive, because about 50% of AS people score in the normal range on that one. (As opposed to 100% of NTs, so it's still a significant difference.) In my experience the best way to tell if you have subtle difficulty reading nonverbal cues is to look at your everyday performance. Talk to someone who knows you well, and ask them if they think you miss nonverbal cues. Ask them for specific examples - not only can you figure out if you really missed the cues or if they misperceived you, but it can be educational if you did miss cues.


I think i miss some nonverbal cues.
could you give me a further explanation/some exemples?

for exemple, it is not that easy for me to see when a guy is interested in me. I've had my mother and friends tell me many times: ''hey have you noticed that person X was interested in you?''- does it count?



momentsforeverfaded
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17 Jul 2013, 3:06 pm

Ettina wrote:
Quote:
Maybe I have meltdowns and I don't know. What would be considered a meltdown/tantrun?


Depends who you ask.

Generally, it involves yelling and/or crying, often combined with aggression, self-injury or throwing/breaking objects.

However, meltdowns are not required for AS. They're common, but there are AS people who don't have them, and there are many other conditions that cause meltdowns too. (Seriously, they're like the psychiatric equivalent of coughing. Practically everything can cause meltdowns.)


oh then I've had this.



momentsforeverfaded
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17 Jul 2013, 3:13 pm

Ettina wrote:
How well do you read nonverbal cues? About as well as most people? Or significantly poorer but still able to do it somewhat?

You pretty much have to have at least some impairment in that area to have AS, but it doesn't need to be severe. For example, I find I can spot many nonverbal cues, but I miss others (my parents have pointed this out). In particular, I tend not to notice nonverbal cues directed at other people as well as those directed at me, so I don't realize how other people relate to each other. (Except in TV shows, where they won't direct any cues directly at me.)

The Mind in the Eyes test that many people here have linked to as a screening test is not very sensitive, because about 50% of AS people score in the normal range on that one. (As opposed to 100% of NTs, so it's still a significant difference.) In my experience the best way to tell if you have subtle difficulty reading nonverbal cues is to look at your everyday performance. Talk to someone who knows you well, and ask them if they think you miss nonverbal cues. Ask them for specific examples - not only can you figure out if you really missed the cues or if they misperceived you, but it can be educational if you did miss cues.


but then, I don't know, maybe I've learned to read nonverbal cues trough my life?



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17 Jul 2013, 3:22 pm

Quote:
for exemple, it is not that easy for me to see when a guy is interested in me. I've had my mother and friends tell me many times: ''hey have you noticed that person X was interested in you?''- does it count?


Yes, that certainly counts.

From what you've described here, you sound like you might be at a pretty similar level of ability as I am in terms of reading nonverbal cues.

Some things I've noticed about myself:

* I find it very difficult to tell if someone's flirting with me
* I tend to mistake people concentrating, tired, frustrated or in pain for them being angry
* I need to pay attention to notice nonverbal cues - for example if I start talking about an interest of mine, I'll stop noticing other people's nonverbal cues

However, at the same time, I have a specific strength in comforting distressed people. When I notice someone in distress, I focus in on them and I often know exactly what to say to help them feel better. Although I am often slow to notice their distress in the first place, once I notice it I'm good at helping (as long as I'm reasonably calm, of course).



momentsforeverfaded
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17 Jul 2013, 3:31 pm

Ettina wrote:
Quote:
for exemple, it is not that easy for me to see when a guy is interested in me. I've had my mother and friends tell me many times: ''hey have you noticed that person X was interested in you?''- does it count?


Yes, that certainly counts.

From what you've described here, you sound like you might be at a pretty similar level of ability as I am in terms of reading nonverbal cues.

Some things I've noticed about myself:

* I find it very difficult to tell if someone's flirting with me
* I tend to mistake people concentrating, tired, frustrated or in pain for them being angry
* I need to pay attention to notice nonverbal cues - for example if I start talking about an interest of mine, I'll stop noticing other people's nonverbal cues

However, at the same time, I have a specific strength in comforting distressed people. When I notice someone in distress, I focus in on them and I often know exactly what to say to help them feel better. Although I am often slow to notice their distress in the first place, once I notice it I'm good at helping (as long as I'm reasonably calm, of course).


I am not sure if I can read nonverbal cues or if I can't. I've never thought of this. Then I can have just learned it through the years and now I can't tell...



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17 Jul 2013, 3:42 pm

It's obvious I wasn't much help to you. My apologies for wasting your time.



momentsforeverfaded
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17 Jul 2013, 3:46 pm

Thelibrarian wrote:
momentsforeverfaded wrote:
Thelibrarian wrote:

I will leave the specifics of what constitutes a diagnosis to others. Rather, I will ask whether you have these things, and have simply learned to control them. The reason I'm asking is that when I first learned of AS, I didn't think I had the "stimming" characteristic. But after reading other aspie's stories, and thinking back to my childhood, I think stimming is something I simply learned to repress successfully, primarily due to getting the daylights beaten out of me by my father for doing such things. Could your situation be similar?


HOW did you learned to control your stimming? I need to know this.
well, I can sense what a person is feeling by looking at their faces, but I am slower than most people to get what are their intentions, I need to discreetly ask someone to reassure myself that I am right about what someone wants.
But I could have learned to interprete facial expressions/intentions?
I remember being a much more naive child than most. They would make jokes and be ironic/sarcastic and I would believe everything they said. But this can't apply to me anymore, because I know (most of the times) when someone is just joking.

Maybe I have meltdowns and I don't know. What would be considered a meltdown/tantrun?


I learned to control my stimming as a young child to avoid beatings and, in the absence of those, embarrassment. I still have tics, such as blinking too much. But generally, my tics are minimal unless I'm stressed.

I too have learned some about reading faces, ridicule, sarcasm, etc., simply because that's how the world is; I have yet to meet another aspie face-to-face. But, like you, in situations with too much stimuli, or where I'm starting to shut down, I begin to lose these abilities. It's one reason I much prefer dealing with others via phone, or better yet, on the computer. Here I can take a minute and examine things in a relatively calm environment. It is much harder to do this in person.

I've learned to control my meltdowns, at least to some degree, largely by avoiding situations where I'm liable to have one. Beyond that, in the NT world, too much display of emotion is socially unacceptable, and I have enough problems with being ostracized already.


I don't know if I know nonverbal cues because I have learned it or if this is just something natural to me. How could someone distinguish one from the other?



momentsforeverfaded
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17 Jul 2013, 3:47 pm

Thelibrarian wrote:
It's obvious I wasn't much help to you. My apologies for wasting your time.


what?



CelesteFeline
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17 Jul 2013, 4:56 pm

back on topic, No.
I have aspergers and I do sometimes have empathy for others.



Scia
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17 Jul 2013, 11:58 pm

In line with what CelesteFeline said, no. Aspergers (and the Autism Spectrum) is one of those things where who has which symptoms will vary greatly. I don't know specifics, but I do understand that a common thing in diagnostic criteria is for a certain number of traits out of a list to be present, but not necessarily all of them.

I would also like to note that pretty much anything that can be diagnosed will have varying degrees. I wouldn't worry about it overall.