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Doom1991
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11 Jun 2015, 5:25 am

Here is an interesting theory for you guys on Autism. I personally think Autism is really the evolution of humanity. If you take into consideration the whole disorder you can find many factors that would benefit us greatly. Evolution is not perfect and so it will have its flaws. When you look at the human race you have 3 general types of people which are the low functioning (mentally handicapped), the normal (people with average IQ's and communication skills), and the high functioning (the higher IQ but less communicative). Now lets take the Autism spectrum and compare. We have the low functioning autistic , the normal autistic, and the high functioning autistic. Both normal humans and autistic share those general types but have a difference between each other. Autistic humans tend to have better skills with growing and abilities such as senses. These skills would greatly benefit us in nature with survival but disable us in society with technology. We can hear and see the littlest things others cannot but in certain situations with a lot of noise or too much visual information, we can become overstimulated and have a break down. The reason why we are so behind other normal people is because we are not being taught things the correct way. With evolution, we undergo changes and those changes happened to our brains and bodies and of course with different brains we will need a different way of being taught. People today only know one way of teaching children through the ways they have known for many years and that method doesn't work well with us. So really we are not as disabled as we think we are, we are just at a lacking level compared to normal people because we are not getting the required teaching needed as children that other children are able to get. Of course as generations go on, parents are taught new ways to teach their children that are classified as better. Think back to the days when parents saw hard discipline and beating their children with a belt or stick as the proper way to raise a child. Later on the generation from that generation was taught that wasn't the proper way to raise a child and so you see less people using that method. The same thing will happen with parents and how they teach their children who have autism. With how autism is becoming a bigger thing these days they will find new ways for parents to better teach them and those with autism will start to see their real potential. Think about how great we are now after being so hindered by the ways we are taught. It will only be so long until people with autism will be seen as the children parents will want their child to be. That will be the day that our true potential is seen.



Kiriae
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11 Jun 2015, 6:17 am

Doom1991 wrote:
Autistic humans tend to have better skills with growing and abilities such as senses. These skills would greatly benefit us in nature with survival but disable us in society with technology.

Doesn't that actually mean we are evolution relics? Our abilities were the base for survival for our ancestors but it is in the past - right now human race "evolutes" technologically and will continue doing so.



Doom1991
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11 Jun 2015, 6:49 am

Kiriae wrote:
Doom1991 wrote:
Autistic humans tend to have better skills with growing and abilities such as senses. These skills would greatly benefit us in nature with survival but disable us in society with technology.

Doesn't that actually mean we are evolution relics? Our abilities were the base for survival for our ancestors but it is in the past - right now human race "evolutes" technologically and will continue doing so.

Well I dont believe in evolution for technology. Evolution comes from nature as to where technology comes from our brain. Technology harms us and so any changes to that I would see as a mutation. Mutations are changes that are more harmful than beneficial but the thought of technology causing a mutation/evolution is debatable.



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11 Jun 2015, 8:34 am

Technology could evolve, just like living beings evolve.



Kiriae
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11 Jun 2015, 8:52 am

Doom1991 wrote:
Kiriae wrote:
Doom1991 wrote:
Autistic humans tend to have better skills with growing and abilities such as senses. These skills would greatly benefit us in nature with survival but disable us in society with technology.

Doesn't that actually mean we are evolution relics? Our abilities were the base for survival for our ancestors but it is in the past - right now human race "evolutes" technologically and will continue doing so.

Well I dont believe in evolution for technology. Evolution comes from nature as to where technology comes from our brain. Technology harms us and so any changes to that I would see as a mutation. Mutations are changes that are more harmful than beneficial but the thought of technology causing a mutation/evolution is debatable.

Actually a mutation is any change in genome. It can be both positive and negative. Evolution comes in effect of "positive" mutations being strengthened by natural selection over generations(people with ASD are currently less prone to match and have offsprings than NTs therefore natural selection is killing us off).
"Positive" means positive for the environment the population lives in, even if it is actually a negative for all other environments. Evolution doesn't have to be objectively good - evolution is adaptation to the environment a population lives in.
An example may be the Domesticate syndrome in animals: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 100122.htm Our domestic animals wouldn't probably do well in wild life yet they do just fine in our houses and cities. For example flat ears make their hearing worse so they might miss danger signs in wild life but in our loud environments it's actually beneficial because it guards their naturally sensitive hearing.



Last edited by Kiriae on 11 Jun 2015, 9:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

Adamantium
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11 Jun 2015, 8:59 am

This seems like a fantasy based on a faulty model of evolution.

Evolution isn't purposeful. Every genetic variation is an example of evolution. All neurological configurations are evolution in action. Natural selection kicks in when some variation increases or decreases the probability of reproduction by the organism. That's it. Mutation is not harmful, it's just change. Evolution is the result of beneficial mutation.

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Autistic humans tend to have better skills with growing and abilities such as senses.
Sensory sensitivity is not the same thing as having better senses and certainly not better skills. Being oversensitive to lightis not a skill and does not confer reproductive advantage. Being oversensitive to sound is not a skill and does not confer reproductive advantage.

Restricted and repetitive motions or patterns of thought are not advantages for hunters, gatherers. It may be that people with autistic traits find more opportunities in technological cultures than in pre-technological cultures.

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These skills would greatly benefit us in nature with survival but disable us in society with technology.

Our environment is made by our culture. That is our natural context. Natural selection is not interested in the idea of "Nature" and does not distinguish between man-made environments, animal-made environments, plant-made environments or environments resulting from geological processes without biological interaction.



Doom1991
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11 Jun 2015, 10:16 am

Kiriae wrote:
Doom1991 wrote:
Kiriae wrote:
Doom1991 wrote:
Autistic humans tend to have better skills with growing and abilities such as senses. These skills would greatly benefit us in nature with survival but disable us in society with technology.

Doesn't that actually mean we are evolution relics? Our abilities were the base for survival for our ancestors but it is in the past - right now human race "evolutes" technologically and will continue doing so.

Well I dont believe in evolution for technology. Evolution comes from nature as to where technology comes from our brain. Technology harms us and so any changes to that I would see as a mutation. Mutations are changes that are more harmful than beneficial but the thought of technology causing a mutation/evolution is debatable.

Actually a mutation is any change in genome. It can be both positive and negative. Evolution comes in effect of "positive" mutations being strengthened by natural selection over generations(people with ASD are currently less prone to match and have offsprings than NTs therefore natural selection is killing us off).
"Positive" means positive for the environment the population lives in, even if it is actually a negative for all other environments. Evolution doesn't have to be objectively good - evolution is adaptation to the environment a population lives in.
An example may be the Domesticate syndrome in animals: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 100122.htm Our domestic animals wouldn't probably do well in wild life yet they do just fine in our houses and cities. For example flat ears make their hearing worse so they might miss danger signs in wild life but in our loud environments it's actually beneficial because it guards their naturally sensitive hearing.

Would domestic animals count for that as they are manipulated through humans by breeding? What makes someone with ASD less prone to match? Being less socialable? If so then that could count for anyone. People with ASD definitely have the ability to be just as socialable as any other person. Those with severe autism however are on the low side and falls under the same category as mentally handicapped, although they still have the ability to communicate pretty well. There is a development delay but nothing that should effect reproduction.



ASPartOfMe
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11 Jun 2015, 12:28 pm

This theory has been around awhile. I do agree a lot of our problems are a result of differences. Evolution does not necessarily mean advanced or better but it is often said or implied. Those that think in those terms are entering into dangerous supremacist territory.


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Doom1991
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11 Jun 2015, 12:39 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
This theory has been around awhile. I do agree a lot of our problems are a result of differences. Evolution does not necessarily mean advanced or better but it is often said or implied. Those that think in those terms are entering into dangerous supremacist territory.

Yes I agree that thinking this way is dangerous. Thoughts of being superior can lead to many things including mass murder just as Hitler did. Thats why I try to keep away from thinking such things.



Adamantium
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11 Jun 2015, 2:18 pm

Doom1991 wrote:
These skills would greatly benefit us in nature with survival but disable us in society with technology. We can hear and see the littlest things others cannot but in certain situations with a lot of noise or too much visual information, we can become overstimulated and have a break down. The reason why we are so behind other normal people is because we are not being taught things the correct way.


If this were true, I would expect to see many autistic people excelling in outdoor professions and activities: hunters, guides, trackers, game wardens, forest rangers, wildlife managers, mountain climbers, kayakers, etc.

I am sure that there are autistic people who do these things, but is it common?
Are they hugely successful in these pursuits?



Doom1991
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11 Jun 2015, 2:30 pm

Adamantium wrote:
Doom1991 wrote:
These skills would greatly benefit us in nature with survival but disable us in society with technology. We can hear and see the littlest things others cannot but in certain situations with a lot of noise or too much visual information, we can become overstimulated and have a break down. The reason why we are so behind other normal people is because we are not being taught things the correct way.


If this were true, I would expect to see many autistic people excelling in outdoor professions and activities: hunters, guides, trackers, game wardens, forest rangers, wildlife managers, mountain climbers, kayakers, etc.

I am sure that there are autistic people who do these things, but is it common?
Are they hugely successful in these pursuits?

Im sure there are but the media for some reason focuses on people with autism and their talents in music and art... I know many Autistic people who excel greatly in fields that have nothing to do with art and music. It all comes down to their interest. Im sure there's a lot of autistic that wouldn't like hunting at all for the obvious reason. When it comes to sports and activities yeah I excel greatly. Ive played Baseball, Soccer, Football, Tennis, Table Tennis, Volleyball, and Basketball since I was about 5 or so. I also did indoor rock climbing which I loved to death as a kid. I dont know about other Autistic people in that area really but if I could do all that for many years while having bad asthma and lung damage from RSV then Im sure any other can as well. It comes down to what interests them.



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11 Jun 2015, 2:44 pm

https://www.ted.com/talks/juan_enriquez ... nt_species


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Adamantium
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11 Jun 2015, 4:56 pm

Doom1991 wrote:
Im sure there's a lot of autistic that wouldn't like hunting at all for the obvious reason. When it comes to sports and activities yeah I excel greatly.

Sports are pretty much an activity of civilization and its technology. Hunting has a survival advantage for pre-technological people.

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Ive played Baseball, Soccer, Football, Tennis, Table Tennis, Volleyball, and Basketball since I was about 5 or so. I also did indoor rock climbing which I loved to death as a kid.
My thought was that if there were some "natural" or "pre-technological" advantage for autistic people, then autistic people would thrive in the kind of occupations that involve the least technology and happen in the most natural environments. Field and court sports and indoor rock climbing are not any of those things.



Doom1991
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11 Jun 2015, 10:06 pm

Adamantium wrote:
Doom1991 wrote:
Im sure there's a lot of autistic that wouldn't like hunting at all for the obvious reason. When it comes to sports and activities yeah I excel greatly.

Sports are pretty much an activity of civilization and its technology. Hunting has a survival advantage for pre-technological people.

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Ive played Baseball, Soccer, Football, Tennis, Table Tennis, Volleyball, and Basketball since I was about 5 or so. I also did indoor rock climbing which I loved to death as a kid.
My thought was that if there were some "natural" or "pre-technological" advantage for autistic people, then autistic people would thrive in the kind of occupations that involve the least technology and happen in the most natural environments. Field and court sports and indoor rock climbing are not any of those things.

You mean a survival situation? Being able to kill, sense things, basically putting us in a survival games situation. Yeah when someone with Autism is backed into a corner they can be really deadly. The lack of empathy shows and they can kill someone just like that. Ive seen many stories about autistic people and killing others. Many cases with Autism being trapped do result in suicide but there also has been those cases of Autistic children murdering students. I remember seeing a live court case on one too not long ago at my moms house. Not that Autistic people are bad people or anything. They are like that lion that you just dont wanna mess with and when you mess with it enough, it will bite you. Dunno if that was what you were trying to get at.