Too therapeutic to have Asperger's?

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I was recently diagnosed with Asperger's by a clinical social worker. I then saw a psychologist who specializes in AS, and she said that she couldn't really confirm or deny the diagnosis. She acknowledged a variety of AS traits, which included rigidity, OCD behaviors, sensory issues, special interests and a history of social disconnection and isolation. However, two things kept her from confirming the diagnosis. One was a lack of data regarding my childhood development - I'm 55, with no older surviving relatives.

The other had to do with my capacity for emotional connection, and my current skill as a therapist. Now, I do want to make it clear that I respect and appreciate her opinion and the care she gave to her time with me. That said, I noticed several specific things that seemed to raise her doubts about the diagnosis. The first made reference to my experience at age 13, when a doctor told me that what seemed like stomach-aches were actually a symptom of my being unhappy. It was a complete surprise, but I knew immediately that it was true. I resolved to learn all I could about how to be happy. I knew I was terribly isolated, but instead of trying to reach out to people (which sounded exhausting and confusing), I spent the next 10 yrs trying to understand psychology intellectually, to figure it all out on my own. And I did learn a lot, but ouch! Nonetheless, something about this discovery and my resolve at such a young age seemed to raise some doubt for my psychologist.

At age 22, I stumbled across a group that taught average people techniques for accessing and identifying emotion, sharing with others, and focusing on achieving goals. Their work was highly structured and rational and practical, and I worked with them for 15 years. Toward the end, I became extremely proficient in their approach, and had several people tell me that I was 'naturally therapeutic'. This point also seemed to stir my practitioner's doubts. (The work ultimately led to me getting a master's in social work and becoming a counselor.)

Today, I can enter a room with an upset couple, and be present with them, reflect their feelings, and say gentle, relevant things that help them relax and decide to move forward. I can also speak on such things to a group. At those moments, I am clearly 'highly functional'. Of course, sometimes my actions don't help, and I can grow anxious, or overwhelmed and confused, and start to desperately wish I could never see them again. (Part of the reason I'm going to stop seeing couples!) I always hope that my clients either clearly just need to talk, or want some feedback, or have a direction... That it's fairly straightforward. I can be very subtle, but I need to clear path to follow. I can be very good - but at times I just wish I could share what I know without having to manage the emotional weather of others.

Similarly, at times I am relaxed and friendly with friends, or even sometimes with strangers. Other times, I barely look at people, and am fully of anxiety even with those closest to me. Nevertheless, when it comes to emotional intimacy, I am definitely 'high functioning' as I understand it.

So. I guess I'm curious what anyone thinks about the question of folks with AS discovering deeper, more subtle emotions; expressing them well to others; picking up on others' emotions; and responding skillfully to soothe or connect with others. I'm pretty convinced that I have Asperger's, yet I'm getting the message that I may be too 'therapeutic' to really have it. So I'm conflicted, and I'd love your feedback on the subject. And thank you for letting me speak of this here. It means a lot to think others might understand.

Here's a link. If you feel very aligned with it, it makes a lot of sense vis a vis your past, then your place on the spectrum is likely:
http://aspennj.org/pdf/information/adul ... ecades.pdf

On Wrong Planet (welcome aboard from another senior here!) we have a saying: " If you've met one aspie, you've met one aspie". Many clinical observers are looking for clone-type presentations it seems.

The problem with diagnosis is that the processes are poor for people in older age groups, as you have outlined, and that it is not so easy to fit senior people with a great diversity of life impacts, experiences and adjustments - all those decades of social learning, other learning etc - into a "tick the box" behavioural observation approach which were mainly normed on young male populations.

Hi Deeper Sky

I enjoyed your post and I love your username.

Your story is actually quite common, and in many ways it mirrors mine. I am a teacher of the Alexander Technique, Writer and elder at my local Quaker Meeting.

If I was not to have traced my biological father later in life and found out he had autism, I would have incorrectly assumed that all my sensory and information processing difficulties as well as my obsessionality, organising and prioritising dysfunction and
eye contact issues, were all linked to my "mummy and daddy issues."

What professionals and many in the autistic spectrum need to be reminded about, is that it is impossible to neatly package what exactly goes where in the jigsaw puzzle of the mind. "Either or thinking" and "dichotomous thinking" is just as prevalent in the minds of psychologists diagnosing people with autism as it is with those in the autistic spectrum itself.

I thought you and others might enjoy a little piece of writing I just completed with respect to my latest book. It has yet to be edited so no need for others to point out to me all my spelling mistakes.

My love to you and everyone here at Wrong Planet.


Diagnosis as an Awakening

What you want to overcome you must first of all submit to"...
Tao Te Ching - Chapter 36
_______________________

The Facts are kind, said the much loved Jesuit Gerry Hughes. However, you could equally say that the denial of the facts can be extremely unkind as well.

In your autobiography, A Painful Gift, you brought out into the open the enormous struggle of living your life within the cloud of unknowing you were in the autistic spectrum. As the years passed you came to see that there really was nothing special about your story. Many people just like yourself, had reached middle age depressed, exhausted and overwhelmed by
unknowingly over - compensating and adapting to being in the autistic spectrum.

It is quite ironic that one of your greatest achievements - your adaptive skills, became your greatest impediment and barrier to being diagnosed and getting the help you so desperately needed. You simply became too convincing behind your persona of normality for the depth of struggle to reveal itself. It seemed that for every humiliation you received as a child, your mask of 'normality' became ever more fused to your being. What once saved you from abuse and humiliation, was now constricting and crushing.

Being a spiritual guide has helped you to see that we all have our defenses and personas, and that we wear them like garments of clothing. However, when you become over-attached to the masks you wear, to the extent that you loose touch with who that it is looking through the mask, you can suffer a great deal. When the mask falls, so too does the sadness that gave birth to this protective layer. In tenderly holding this very grief, a doorway can be found that can set you free.

Your experience of being diagnosed with high functioning autism was life changing. It was like a moment of enlightenment whereby you felt like you were given your humanity back. At first there was euphoria. The overwhelming joy of your struggle being seen and given its rightful name. “The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their proper name," said Confucius.

Today you can look back with great joy on all the painful twists and turns along the way, which included your eventual diagnosis with autism. All these experiences have been like being struck by the "awaking stick" used in Soto Zen. For this you feel a gratitude that is beyond words.
_________________________

While bieng told maybe is frustrating as hell, whether it is Aspergers or a lot of Aspie traits you really are at a much better place now then you have been been your whole life. You do not have a official label, but you do have a concrete explanation.

In your autobiography, A Painful Gift, you brought out into the open the enormous struggle of living your life within the cloud of unknowing you were in the autistic spectrum. As the years passed you came to see that there really was nothing special about your story. Many people just like yourself, had reached middle age depressed, exhausted and overwhelmed by unknowingly over - compensating and adapting to being in the autistic spectrum.

It is quite ironic that one of your greatest achievements - your adaptive skills, became your greatest impediment and barrier to being diagnosed and getting the help you so desperately needed. You simply became too convincing behind your persona of normality for the depth of struggle to reveal itself. It seemed that for every humiliation you received as a child, your mask of 'normality' became ever more fused to your being. What once saved you from abuse and humiliation, was now constricting and crushing.


Thank you. How eloquently you express and describe the experience of "passing" and being sidelined from the territory of clinical recognition. This also affects many women not just of my own age (nearly 70) but in younger age groups also, women who have "managed presentation" for so long that their inner pain and struggles are obscured from view.

Thank you B19

It's quite a journey....... Go well for now.

People can and do receive a diagnosis even if they are in an older age bracket in which there are no living relatives to come and contribute to the evaluation.

As for your decision at a very young age to explore psychology and learn - that part of your post reminds me of myself. By the time I was the age of 11, I was so sick of knowing there was SOMETHING off about me in relation to and comparison with other kids my age, and I was so sick of all the things about me that made me aware I was different-not-in-a-good-way, that I started raiding my local library's Psychology section. I was super young to be reading about basic principles and history of psychology and human behavior, but I delved into as much as I could -- Freud, Jung, even the more popularist Desmond Morris book on behavior. There was even a weekly pop culture publication called "Understanding Human Behaviour" that I asked my mother to put on regular order for me. I even read all those hokey old original self help books by people like Norman Vincent Peale. I read books about self esteem. This was a kid of 12 in the year 1974.

I was striving to understand myself and to get to the bottom of what was "wrong" with me because I knew there was something wrong with me. My social deficits were so painful I was determined to even learn the "correct" body language in all situations. I was obsessed, I was on a mission. Some of it has been responsible for my even having the tiniest bit of what for me was at least more success in small ways than I'm sure I would have had without becoming an autodidact for any of this stuff.

Don't let any clinician who is potentially assessing you for autism tell you that you are too accomplished in how to behave "normally" with the people you help. Just telling that person about how much you efforted to even learn about any of this and tutor yourself should be part of the information you give them in the evaluation.

Also, even people of your age/my age who didn't set themselves deliberately to learn these skills or this knowledge have usually learned a few of them just by living life and noticing other people's behaviours. That's another monkey wrench in the works -- sheer age and life experiences means even many people on the spectrum have mastered some skills they didn't have when a child or young person. But a good specialist dealing with adults will know that, or ought to.

Wow. What a fast, compassionate bunch o' responses!

quaker: "It is quite ironic that one of your greatest achievements - your adaptive skills, became your greatest impediment and barrier to being diagnosed... You simply became too convincing behind your persona of normality for the depth of struggle to reveal itself.

This says it exactly. I feel a strong urge to defend my integrity as a counselor, by sharing the best of my skills and understanding... Yet at the same time, highlight all the ways that I'm dysfunctional to somehow prove I deserve a diagnosis. What a mess! I have to come back again and again to just being honest. And the truth is, all sorts of realities can live together in one human package...

Your experience of being diagnosed… was life changing. It was like a moment of enlightenment whereby you felt like you were given your humanity back. At first there was euphoria. The overwhelming joy of your struggle being seen and given its rightful name.

Still feeling that euphoria... And clarity. And gratitude that so much of my life actually makes sense...

ASPartOfMe: ...you really are at a much better place now then you have been been your whole life.

It's true.

ToughDiamond: I think it's entirely possible for us to do that. I'm a diagnosed Aspie. It seems that I'm capable of those things, and (in the right environment) have been capable of them for a very long time. I don't always have the energy or the inclination, but neither does anybody else, as far as I can see.

These words mean so much to me. And you know, when it comes to sensing other people's emotions and responding with skill and empathy, I've found that a great many "neurotypicals" are less skilled than I am. After all, I've spent 30 years in dedicated study and practice, with some fierce motivation (to stop being unhappy). But I really, really enjoy setting all that down and just being myself... And I'm constantly asking people to be straight with me about what they need, so I can rest. And then, if something I do upsets them, they can share about that and we can look into ways to make it all better. 'Cause I've definitely had many times when I've said or done something that offended people. And sometimes they've left me - which really, really sucks. But AS is helping me see that I can't be responsible for all of that. I can do my best, and care, and utilize my skills, and be honest... But things do happen. And in truth, though we may stand out by virtue of not being as socially determined, everybody makes such mistakes. And all of us are worth the friction.

Birdinflight: I was striving to understand myself and to get to the bottom of what was "wrong" with me because I knew there was something wrong with me. My social deficits were so painful...

Everything everyone said was absolutely spot on for me. I did not expect such a speedy reaction from folks. I'm actually feeling a little bit scared, because it feels so encouraging. I'm not accustomed to sharing freely, despite my rich therapeutic background. I'm very good at saying things that fit within parameters... I'm going to try to be honest here. Please do the same for me. And thanks, all of you.

Peace.

Deeper Sky, you seem like a wonderfully sensitive person. Your patients are very fortunate.

Oh I copied other people's behavior too, in addition to reading about psychology and what is supposed to make "normal" people tick.

I copied bigtime -- not just observing and mimicking what other children did, but just anyone, adults too, and even taking onboard the ways of actresses in movies and TV shows, like that was any kind of "real" behavior....but still I just wanted to act like all the ways I saw other people being.

Tiankay - I love your debugging idea.

Spinelli - Thank you.

I remember composing short, simple rules for parties, like "if you don't know what to say, repeat the last few words of what they said." I could do that repeatedly, and lots of people didn't even notice! They were too happy to keep talking...