Before there was diagnosis.....

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I'm going to bring up a very difficult subject and i would like to ask for a little patience and maybe assistance to aid me get the discussion going in a manner where we can explore and maybe find some understanding.

As one of the people for whom diagnosis was not available as a child i can't help but observe a chasm between the realities of my cohort and the younger generations.

This isn't either of our fault but none the less it exists.

Most Aspies of my generation and older are likely to have experienced lives that are more akin to a horror movie, i am not going to sugar coat it. We were abused.

Whether physical abuse, mental abuse or sexual abuse, abuse has been part of our daily lives from the beginning and for many still occurring.

I personally feel that i cannot post on the threads related to life experience because the juxtaposition of realities is just too great, you cannot relate to my life nor i to yours, the scars we bear are thankfully ones you will not have had to experience, especially alone.

We are often accused of being 'angry' as a way to undermine our life experiences especially so on the IRC channel, let me make one thing perfectly clear. WE'RE ENTITLED TO BE f*****g ANGRY.

Any attempt to reframe our experiences or to nullify them or invalidate them or stifle the discussion around them because it makes you uncomfortable, or it takes the focus away from your clique is not acceptable, whilst many of you use IRC as your social outlet, for some it is a last chance lifeline.

We haven't had the luxury of early diagnoses or intervention programs or therapy. We were beaten, locked in cupboards, ostracised, derided, dehumanised and dumped. So please snowflake tell us why we should shut up and listen to how difficult your life has been living in the house mummy and daddy bought you or how your soo ugly, or how we should shut up whilst you ramble on about unicorns and your fantasy worlds.

Like i said our realities are very different and in the current political climate we should be seeking to help those who walked the path long before you did and not 'constructively' ban them by purposefully triggering.

I know i don't have any blood on my hands as i seek to help those in distress, can you say the same? I doubt it.

You might consider in either "The Haven" or "In-Depth Adult Life Discussion"

These are forums where you should be able to post without derisive posts from the younger crowd.

At the opposite extreme is Politics, Philosophy, and Religion, where many posts are intentionally argumentative.

Welcome to Wrong Planet

This is a section where you can and should relate your experiences as part of the missing generations.

There are lot of us from the missing generations, more than other forums here. A lot of us did not make it, we were locked up in institutions for life. You somehow made it and that is a credit to you.

I can not speak for what goes on in IRC or Tumblr but just for what I have seen at Wrong Planet. What drives me nuts is the insinuations there we were lazy because we did not get diagnosed. Or that there is this massive epidemic of aspie wannabees doing it to be trendy or excuse bad behaviors, or that that people working for neurodiversity, acceptance, and rights for autistics are elitists that are too high functioning to understand "real autistics". Not that they or we are perfect far from it, but a lot of these people trying to help autistics were or are what is described as "low functioning".

Lazy, excuse maker, drama queen, faker, liar, you are just making it up, that is what we heard about ourselves. We had no reason to believe otherwise back in the day.

Thankfully the OP was not on wrong planet a couple of years ago when these sentiments were rampant. A lot of that is gone now because we stood up and told it like was. I do think some of the younger generations have a better understanding of this to a certain degree although it hard to grasp if you did not live it.

Last edited by ASPartOfMe on 22 Mar 2017, 10:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

I understand your anger.

But the assumption that we have not experienced what you've experienced could be erroneous. You might be cutting people off on the basis of incorrect assumptions.

Instead of making these assumptions, please dialogue with us. Consider what we have to say. Please tell yourself that you could rise out of your past, rather than letting your past dictate your future.

I can understand how you could be irritated/angry with me for what I've said, because you think I don't understand.

Yep. I'm young. I don't talk about unicorns, I've never had a fantasy world (impaired imagination is common in autism), my parents haven't bought me a house (young people all have millionaire parents?), I wasn't diagnosed early (I'd already finished school so I had no help, no interventions, therapy, nothing). Abuse still happens. What does stereotyping us do except cause alienation?

I sympathize deeply with what you've been through. I can't imagine how hard it's been for you. Having said that, does being angry help you? Will it change what people think? Will it fix your past? I think that moments of being angry and venting are important - we're not robots. But, how do we move on? How do we increase understanding between ASD and NT populations? How do we heal?

I'm willing to work with you and anyone to this end, and your anger is an important part of dialogue. Let's not stop it at that though. Let's put it towards something better, for everyone.

Please bear with me whilst i finish the reply i started before i was aware of the events unfolding in london, i've had to check activist friends who are regularly in parliament sq are ok.

That was terrible....what happened at the Houses of Parliament.

I don't know how old you are, though if this is the first time you have ever given voice to your experience, there will be a lot of stored anger to release, and it's hard for healing to begin until that stuff is dealt with, validated, and acknowledged.

Hope your friends are safe.

Wow! How bad was it here , whose sentiments were those?

As an Aspie born in the 80s, I think we had the worst of it. At least you older Aspies were allowed more independence because you weren't stigmatized at an early age and the workplace when you were growing up was more tolerant of people who were different. Back in your day people cared if you did the job more than your social skills. That's why you're burning out in your middle ages. Not because some mysterious autistic burnout but because the social expectations are much higher now than before. I had to go through the same bullying. I had the diagnosis sure but they said there was nothing that could be done and I was untreated. I also had to go through a time where social skills were everything to the point it could stop people from independence. Younger Aspies had diagnosis and treatment and older aspies were allowed to slide by as eccentrics and live in a world where you were able to do your work and be left alone. If you notice, many of the Aspies doing the worst were born in the 80s. Now you can't be independent without social skills because they are the end all be all to every job. You can look forward to getting fired very easily.

In some ways it was easier for the seniors, in other ways it wasn't. The older group were much more likely to misdiagnosed by psychiatrists totally ignorant of ASD as being schizophrenic. Some became trapped in that misdiagnosis for decades, and it blighted their lives on all sorts of levels.

But diagnosis isn't so good without any treatment. I was at the age where there was diagnosis but almost no treatment out there.

Thank you for your replies, this post isn't really about me, i've been through that much s**t that it just rolls downhill now, this is about those no longer strong enough or barely clinging on, seeking sanctuary and answers to lifelong questions.

And when those lost souls find a place where they believe they are amongst kindred spirits we MUST offer solidarity and allow their testimony to be heard, not attempt to stifle or curtail their NEED to testify. I for one know i would much rather be an ear to listen than the straw that breaks the camels back and drives that individual to suicide.



I don't remotely think it's erroneous to say that if you went to school before 1987 your experience is very, very different. However would i want to underplay the different types of struggles the younger generations face? Absolutely not, as once again, my direct cohort (i call gen XY) have also blazed this trail, we're the original script kiddies; phone freaking, bbs surfing nerds, we invented this s**t we have watched our realm become saturated by the NTs, turning cyberspace into an almost unrecognisable, vacuous, narcissistic mall of consumption and a handy tool of surveillance and oppression. We see the insidiousness of cyber bullying and how it crosses over into RL, we know what its like to just want to fit in, but receive constant rejection, we see your future growing dimmer and are fighting to stop that.

And i do mean fighting. I'm an indigo aspie, i am compelled to just try to make a difference. I fight governments, corporations and wrongdoers. The ordeals i have been through very much shape and attune my consciousness, which is why i wrote this post, i don't know what happens to those people who are rejected from somewhere they hope is a rock to climb onto in the flotsam and jetsam of turbulent seas, well actually we do don't we?





The sentiments i am relaying are not based upon assumptions they are based upon witnessed and documented incidents which have occurred and continue to occur to many individuals, whose sole aim is to truly understand whom they are and what they are.

I'm a survivor, i've walked through the fires of hell. I'm a creator, i shape my own destiny.

Although i am and always will be angry, i rejoice in the raw beauty of this planet we live on and take heart in the knowledge that the paradigm shift has begun and my part was well played



You're forgiven

The world has changed a lot since i was a kid and a hell of a lot for the generations older than me, this is a reality that is in-perceivable to your generation because your reality started the day you were born, yes you can look back via different means but it was not your reality, just like WW2 Britain was not my reality, the transition from Victorian era Britain only really occurred in the 80s/90s. And in much the same way Aspergers didn't even really get on the radar till the same time. Imagine having this thing and everyone just thinks you're a weirdo and treats you accordingly and if you object they BEAT YOU, you getting it yet? Violence against children by ADULTS wasn't a problem then. This isn't kids in the playground s**t.

Asper80s i cant quote you as im mid post but i was born in the 70s, most of the violence was from adults; teachers etc, adults were by far the biggest bullies and abusers in my life. Corporal punishment was still a thing in my day it wouldn't have been in yours, there were numerous incidents of very serious injury at our school from teachers including one lad losing an eye.

As for the independence thing i think you're very likely correct, in as much as we were forced to face the world full on, as ASPartOfMe said though MOST haven't made it

A lot of it was related to the DSM 5 eliminating Aspergers and debates over self-diagnoses.

There were constant assertions that anybody that wanted to identify as Aspie were doing it because they did not want to associate with lower functioning autistics, and it was a trendy wannabe diagnosis by people looking to excuse rude behavior and there were a lot of people faking it. During 2014 there were three or four of these threads going on at once at times. That was very hurtful to me who had just gotten diagnosed with Aspergers at age 55 the year before and who has faced lifelong consequences for being uncool.

That paled to the bitter feelings caused by the "self diagnoses wars" that often came up. While there are legitimate reasons to oppose self diagnosis all the same negative stereotypes were thrown at the self-diagnosers as were being thrown at the aspies. When it was the self identifying aspies that were targets I felt alone at in fighting what felt had become acceptable prejudices. The self-diagnosers fought back and there were multiple simultaneous threads of hard feelings and there was a heavy generational component to the arguments. The mature self-diagnosers were often being told people self diagnosing were basing their conclusions on reading the Autism Wikipedia article to be trendy. They were told if they were really autistic they would have gotten diagnosed in childhood. People did not take too kindly to this.

I am not going to name names. Some of these people are still here with more understanding and are valuable contributors to WP. In general, there is more understanding of the missing generations because of the two exhaustive Autism history books that have been published and related mainstream media articles.

Thank you for a different perspective. Very often the debate of different experience revolves around over 50 autistics and under 30 autistics. I graduated college in '79 and I experienced the significant negative effects from the trends towered group work, networking etc. Unlike the OP my bullying was from peers, not adults. Adults thought my traits were cute or they just could not figure me out.

While the trends we speak of are real what has stayed the same is success or failure is determined by your Autism and the people you are forced to interact with. Plenty of Aspies prior to 1990 kept on getting fired for social mistakes and meltdowns and were thrown out into the streets out of "tough love" and plenty of today's Aspies are cyberbullied 24/7, suffocated by helicopter parents and schools, and live in a world where their diagnosis is a popular internet insult and they read how people are spending so much time, effort and money to fix them.

So what generation had it worse? I am sure somebody can design a program and figure that out but what a waste of time that would be. While people need to rant sometimes it is should be about making it better for autistics of all ages everywhere on the spectrum.