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fifasy
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20 Apr 2017, 1:46 pm

I'm tired of living in Lancashire, near Merseyside (note: to American forum users this is England I'm writing about). I think both counties suffer from tall poppy syndrome. Both counties have some of the poorest and unhappiest people according to surveys I've found online. Some of the areas in Lancashire and Merseyside also have some of the country's highest crime rates. Educational attainment is often not too high around here either. I think there's a tall poppy syndrome going on. I've noticed when I wear stylish clothes people either stare at me, get an angry look on their face or if they're in a group exchange looks with each other and laugh. There's a culture here of everyone tending to look the same, wearing dark, plain clothes that are very casual. It's quite clear, the message that's being sent. We're all humble. None of us get ideas about our station, we're working class and proud.

I don't like that kind of thing. True freedom is wearing what you want, saying what you want, within reason. Do people who live in other areas of the UK or other areas of the world experience this problem too? Is it better where you are? I know in Sweden, Denmark and Norway there is a culture called Jante law. People who move there say that the people there are very much like how I've described. They tend to all dress in the same style and they treat people who are openly ambitious or are not shy about expressing knowledge others don't know as up their own backsides.



kraftiekortie
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20 Apr 2017, 5:28 pm

I took the railroad once from Manchester to Liverpool. We passed by Merseyside districts. They seem to be pleasant to me. The people seemed to be family-oriented.

Of course, I didn't get into the "meat and potatoes" of Merseyside and Lancashire.

I thought of the song "Ferry 'cross the Mersey."



Jensen
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20 Apr 2017, 8:02 pm

Jante lives on in DK - now more in the social medias. There are places though - especially in small communities, where the social control is very strong.
I guess, Jante is a world-wide human phenomenon.
The poorer community - the stronger social control....like the glue, that keeps the lid on the boiling kettle.


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Dear_one
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20 Apr 2017, 8:27 pm

The "or" is the only part of this title I recognize.



fifasy
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21 Apr 2017, 2:38 am

So how do I get out of here? I'm sick of living here. I need money. I wish I knew what to do. I want to live where there are more educated people, where I can speak my mind and not have to hide. It's so hard here in the UK to move. There are so many people fighting for a limited number of homes to rent, we're overcrowded. And I don't know how to get myself into a state of health where I can work. I don't feel good. Anxiety cripples me.



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21 Apr 2017, 3:10 am

fifasy wrote:
So how do I get out of here? I'm sick of living here. I need money. I wish I knew what to do. I want to live where there are more educated people, where I can speak my mind and not have to hide. It's so hard here in the UK to move. There are so many people fighting for a limited number of homes to rent, we're overcrowded. And I don't know how to get myself into a state of health where I can work. I don't feel good. Anxiety cripples me.


Solution,urban fringe dweller and or country living.
Explore options and look outside the square.


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Jensen
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21 Apr 2017, 12:31 pm

Dear_one wrote:
The "or" is the only part of this title I recognize.


Poppy is brief for Poor+ unhappy...I suppose.
Tall may mean "proud". (Proud poor worker).

Jante is a "law" described by a danish-norwegian author, ironically set up like the Ten Commandments.
1. Don´t think, you´re more than others.
2. Don´t think you, are somebody at all ....and it goes on.

The book is about the provincial small city/village, Jante, where the reader follows a boy, who is subjected to and formed by those "commandmends".
It´s really horrible.... because, there´s truth in it - and it is universal.


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Dear_one
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21 Apr 2017, 12:39 pm

Thanks. Jante law reminds me of the Laws of the Eastern Algonquin. One of them reads "When you have become a mighty hunter, and better than the other men in your lodge, go into the forest, and search until you find the strongest, tallest tree there. Then tell that tree how great you are."



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21 Apr 2017, 1:25 pm

Dear_one wrote:
Then tell that tree how great you are."

lol



Jensen
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21 Apr 2017, 2:11 pm

Dear_one wrote:
Thanks. Jante law reminds me of the Laws of the Eastern Algonquin. One of them reads "When you have become a mighty hunter, and better than the other men in your lodge, go into the forest, and search until you find the strongest, tallest tree there. Then tell that tree how great you are."


Oh, as I understand this, it´s about humility. A sense of proportion.

Jante is about fear brought on by belittlement from "peers", who need underdogs.
The boy in the book leaves Jante and becomes a seaman in a just as rough world - the crew. He develops from being a fearful underdog into being a man on his own terms - but still at times pale-sweatty angst-ridden by memories from Jante.
Jante never leaves you. :skull:


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21 Apr 2017, 6:46 pm

The phrase "tall poppy" might be from a poppy flower rising to high above other poppies, or above the grass lawn (sticks out).



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22 Apr 2017, 11:34 am

In the simplest terms, it sounds like "class envy." Anybody trying to improve themselves is greeted with suspicion.



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22 Apr 2017, 6:40 pm

I live on an estate full of chavs, gangbangers and other unpleasant people. I too stand out from the rest in dress and mannerisms.


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IstominFan
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24 Apr 2017, 9:01 am

I have noticed that people in my town don't know how to dress properly when going out. I see people at nice places dressed like absolute slobs.



fifasy
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24 Apr 2017, 3:30 pm

That annoys me too. I get the sense fashion nowadays is how much can you dress down. Another thing I intensely dislike is the fashion for men to have shaved, bald heads. I used to like men who were naturally bald with tufts of hair on the sides and back like Alfred Hitchcock. To me that looked dignified, the shaven head in my mind is a militaristic, uncouth style to adopt.



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24 Apr 2017, 6:19 pm

It's grim up North.