When people bring up my body language what do they expect?

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hollowmoon
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12 Nov 2018, 3:53 pm

People really dislike my body language. They are always bringing it up from teachers to coworkers to friends. They said that I look blank and angry. However, when I ask them what do about it they just say "smile!". But when I walk around smiling they say that I look crazy and to stop doing that. WHAT DO PEOPLE EXPECT ME TO DO WHEN THEY BRING THIS UP? All its doing is making my self-conscious, because they never give me any real solutions.



puzzledoll
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12 Nov 2018, 4:07 pm

If you really want to get people to stop reacting to you that way, I would practice your facial expressions in a mirror so that you can see what other people see. Try and see if you can match the facial expressions of people who seem to be open and friendly. Also try to match body posture (especially if you are prone to "hunching" your back and shoulders). If you have close friends or family, actively have them help you with this by telling you if an expression seems "angry" or "crazy" and what you can do to adjust it. If you don't have the skill set you and want it, you will have to work to learn it.



hollowmoon
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12 Nov 2018, 4:09 pm

puzzledoll wrote:
If you really want to get people to stop reacting to you that way, I would practice your facial expressions in a mirror so that you can see what other people see. Try and see if you can match the facial expressions of people who seem to be open and friendly. Also try to match body posture (especially if you are prone to "hunching" your back and shoulders). If you have close friends or family, actively have them help you with this by telling you if an expression seems "angry" or "crazy" and what you can do to adjust it. If you don't have the skill set you and want it, you will have to work to learn it.


Even if I did learn the facial expressions do people actually expect me to spend my whole life thinking about facial expressions when I'm in public? In order to do the expression I'd have to consciously think about it ALL the time.



jamthis12
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12 Nov 2018, 4:26 pm

It takes time to learn. At the end of the day, all it is is just masking and imitation. I hate it just as much as you, but after a while, you get used to it. Like pretty all of the stuff I do socially is just copied from an NT person.


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12 Nov 2018, 5:16 pm

hollowmoon wrote:
Even if I did learn the facial expressions do people actually expect me to spend my whole life thinking about facial expressions when I'm in public? In order to do the expression I'd have to consciously think about it ALL the time.


With a part of your attention, yes, and around people who you wanted to not behave like that to you, yes. It's does get easier with practice. Masking is notoriously tiring for many people on the spectrum...



quite an extreme
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12 Nov 2018, 6:00 pm

hollowmoon wrote:
People really dislike my body language. They are always bringing it up from teachers to coworkers to friends. They said that I look blank and angry. However, when I ask them what do about it they just say "smile!". But when I walk around smiling they say that I look crazy and to stop doing that.

They wan't you to smile or having a good mood once you look at them or into their eyes only. You don't have to smile all time except you really enjoy something. Looking in someons eyes without any emotions is not a problem for most animals but NTs think you are angry or even going to kill them. This make them angry on you. Try to look at them in a good mood and try a little smile (not a grin). The people who like you smile back then. You can train how to look using a mirror. You should also learn to smile with your eyes a little bit. Facial expressions are really important to make friends. Be carefully towards guys except you want them to crush on your smile. But they also won't like it if they don't like you.
Here is a little bit more about eye contact: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=368901&hilit=eye+contact&start=30#p8054848



hollowmoon
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13 Nov 2018, 2:57 am

quite an extreme wrote:
hollowmoon wrote:
People really dislike my body language. They are always bringing it up from teachers to coworkers to friends. They said that I look blank and angry. However, when I ask them what do about it they just say "smile!". But when I walk around smiling they say that I look crazy and to stop doing that.

They wan't you to smile or having a good mood once you look at them or into their eyes only. You don't have to smile all time except you really enjoy something. Looking in someons eyes without any emotions is not a problem for most animals but NTs think you are angry or even going to kill them. This make them angry on you. Try to look at them in a good mood and try a little smile (not a grin). The people who like you smile back then. You can train how to look using a mirror. You should also learn to smile with your eyes a little bit. Facial expressions are really important to make friends. Be carefully towards guys except you want them to crush on your smile. But they also won't like it if they don't like you.
Here is a little bit more about eye contact: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=368901&hilit=eye+contact&start=30#p8054848


Why do they think your going to kill them if there’s no emotion?



envirozentinel
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13 Nov 2018, 3:33 am

Tell them you're emulating Wednesday Addams in Addams Family Values!

Just joking, but couldn't resist. Everyone was scared out their wits when she smiled!

One shouldn't have to try and meet the expectations of others regarding our facial expressions. I'm sure you can give a genuine smile when really enjoying something. It should rather come naturally than be forced.

It can be tricky to meet everyone eles's expectations. Rather try and please yourself!


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13 Nov 2018, 6:51 am

envirozentinel wrote:
Tell them you're emulating Wednesday Addams in Addams Family Values!

Just joking, but couldn't resist. Everyone was scared out their wits when she smiled!

One shouldn't have to try and meet the expectations of others regarding our facial expressions. I'm sure you can give a genuine smile when really enjoying something. It should rather come naturally than be forced.

It can be tricky to meet everyone eles's expectations. Rather try and please yourself!


I agree with this. And it can cause such stress/performance anxiety to always monitor your appearance, vocal tone, and body language. Not healthy, but it's what many demand. It's very tiring to often be told to smile, watch your tone of voice, and how you present yourself.



jamthis12
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13 Nov 2018, 7:58 am

Yeah I really hate having to mask. But in order to even be semi-functional, I need to do it and it really irks me. But at least I've gotten good at it over the years.


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naturalplastic
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13 Nov 2018, 8:25 am

A number of ladies on this site have mentioned something called the "relaxed b***h face". I suppose that that is sometimes a symptom of autism in females. Sounds like what you have.

Maybe you should get in front of the mirror and put yourself into your normal "walking around in public" mindset and see forself what your face looks like.



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13 Nov 2018, 4:12 pm

You can't look "blank" and "angry" at the same time

You can't satisfy everyone at the same time



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13 Nov 2018, 6:05 pm

hollowmoon wrote:
Why do they think your going to kill them if there’s no emotion?

Right question but I think it's different if it comes to men and women. If I like somebody I try to look friendly. It shows that I have a good mood and have no intentions of being aggressive. If somebody is angry then it causes him to look angry. Does somebody keep eye contact while being angry then it he looks agressive.
If I look emotionless in another mans eyes it's a serious thing. It says that I'm not friendly towards him and because I don't look away I'm showing that I'm also not afraid of him. Because I keep looking at his eyes this shows him that I'm reading his intentions and don't trust him. Either he gets out of my way then or it comes to a fight. Men are quite fast with this. Women are much less aggressive and rarely look emotionless. I think if they look emotionless then they are mostly disappointed or angry. That's what you got telled.


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13 Nov 2018, 8:02 pm

Btw: To realize how the peoples mind works opens my eyes. May be because I'm currently to much on my own and thinking to much about it. But much about humans behaviour makes more sense to me now. To realize how others peoples brain works gives sometimes a strange power.
A sample. I sometimes late to meetings at work. As long as I feel sorrow about it people think they have the right to be angry on me. Because of this I have changed now. I just enjoy now reaching the meeting and bring in a really good mood. And instead of being angry on me they just enjoy to see me now. It's hard to be angry on the only one who feels positive and has a really good mood even if he is the one who is nearly always late. Their empathy stops them from being angry on me. I know that they don't really get me but that they realize it and even starting to get used to it. NT people are strange.


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Richard_the_ Dogged
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13 Nov 2018, 8:13 pm

This idea of defect, deficiency, and difference is really toxic.

One gets more experience dealing with people, just by doing it.

Some of us are outside the herd.

I don't talk about Autism, Aspergers, Neurological Difference, I only talk about Shamanism.

Don't worry about other people's normative standards.


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14 Nov 2018, 2:58 am

HighLlama wrote:
it can cause such stress/performance anxiety to always monitor your appearance, vocal tone, and body language. Not healthy, but it's what many demand. It's very tiring to often be told to smile, watch your tone of voice, and how you present yourself.


Not healthy, indeed. In my opinion, what we need is to build an autistic-friendly subculture (including autistic-friendly businesses) in which all this stressful, tiring, utterly unnatural crap is not necessary, freeing us to devote our energies to more productive things.

That's my dream, and I believe it's doable if enough of us (autistic, autistic-like, and autistic-friendly people) are willing to work toward that goal.


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