Preference of the terms "Autistic" or "Person with Autism"?

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Do you prefer the term "autistic" or "person with autism"?
I prefer "autistic" 67%  67%  [ 45 ]
I prefer "person with autism" 3%  3%  [ 2 ]
I prefer neither "autistic" nor "person with autism" 3%  3%  [ 2 ]
I am indifferent (Either/both is/are acceptable) 27%  27%  [ 18 ]
Total votes : 67

magz
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13 Dec 2022, 12:45 pm

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
One person is not "diverse". A group of people might be "diverse".
That's why I don't like the word, even if the concept is useful.

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
"Neurotypical" sounds inaccurate because anything that is not autism is "neurotypical". Including brain damage and down syndrome. "Neurotypical" sounds like it means "normal brain"
I believe not autistic is "allistic". "Neurotypical" is someone who does not deviate significantly from the median in any direction, so someone with typical presentation of Down syndrome is allistic but not neurotypical.


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13 Dec 2022, 2:31 pm

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
magz wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
I happen to like “on the Spectrum” because this covers people who might not be diagnosed with autism, but who have definite autistic traits. It reflects the varied presentations of autism.

It sort of “softens the blow,” too, especially for those who feel ashamed of having autism.

I like "on the spectrum", too. As you said, it reflects the variability of autism, neither suggesting "a walking diagnosis" nor something external and unrelated to who one is.

I also use the term "ND", for even broader concept of variety, including things like ADHD, dyslexia, etc. I'm not super fond of the name "neurodiverse" but I find the concept useful.



One person is not "diverse". A group of people might be "diverse".

"Neurotypical" sounds inaccurate because anything that is not autism is "neurotypical". Including brain damage and down syndrome. "Neurotypical" sounds like it means "normal brain"
Neurotypical doesn't mean not Autistic. It means having a brain and neurological system that has developed in what is considered clinically typical. The word for not Autistic is Allistic.


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13 Dec 2022, 2:32 pm

magz wrote:
shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
One person is not "diverse". A group of people might be "diverse".
That's why I don't like the word, even if the concept is useful.

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
"Neurotypical" sounds inaccurate because anything that is not autism is "neurotypical". Including brain damage and down syndrome. "Neurotypical" sounds like it means "normal brain"
I believe not autistic is "allistic". "Neurotypical" is someone who does not deviate significantly from the median in any direction, so someone with typical presentation of Down syndrome is allistic but not neurotypical.
Yes to this


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13 Dec 2022, 3:40 pm

Allistic sounds like 'you can do it all'. Neurotypical sounds like sounds like you're a bit boring. Thats good. NTs are the majority and are the dominant part of society so they can take a little put down, and dont need praise by implying that they 'can do it all'.

Maybe if I had been diagnosed early in life, like childhood, I would prefer "person with autism" over "autistic". But since it was only few years ago in my middle aged life 'autism' does not cut deep into my mind as an identity. Its just a piece of clothing that I can put on, or take off, at will.

Just dont call me an 'autist'. Yuck. Calling someone an 'autist' makes it sound like the person 'does' autism at will, either as a talent/craft/profession (like an artist or scientist), or a embraces autism as a creed (like an environmentalist, Baptist, or a Communist).



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13 Dec 2022, 7:26 pm

I am autistic.

I couldn't care less if someone uses person first language to refer to me. Their hearts are in the right place.



kraftiekortie
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13 Dec 2022, 7:28 pm

It's all semantic bellyaching to me.....



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13 Dec 2022, 7:30 pm

magz wrote:
shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
One person is not "diverse". A group of people might be "diverse".
That's why I don't like the word, even if the concept is useful.



Individual people are called Neurodivergent, not Neurodiverse.


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13 Dec 2022, 7:38 pm

rse92 wrote:
I am autistic.

I couldn't care less if someone uses person first language to refer to me. Their hearts are in the right place.
IF people's hearts are in the right place, it's not a big deal. But the way that I have been treated by many people, it is obvious to me that their hearts are not in the right place at all and it's more about social dominance than anything else. I am not saying that everybody's heart is bad. I know that many people are very good hearted. But we can't always take that for granted.


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14 Dec 2022, 12:45 am

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
magz wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
I happen to like “on the Spectrum” because this covers people who might not be diagnosed with autism, but who have definite autistic traits. It reflects the varied presentations of autism.

It sort of “softens the blow,” too, especially for those who feel ashamed of having autism.

I like "on the spectrum", too. As you said, it reflects the variability of autism, neither suggesting "a walking diagnosis" nor something external and unrelated to who one is.

I also use the term "ND", for even broader concept of variety, including things like ADHD, dyslexia, etc. I'm not super fond of the name "neurodiverse" but I find the concept useful.



One person is not "diverse". A group of people might be "diverse".
"


But an individual can be 'divergent'. And can be 'neurodivergent', and thus would have the same ND initials.



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14 Dec 2022, 4:28 am

skibum wrote:
magz wrote:
I believe not autistic is "allistic". "Neurotypical" is someone who does not deviate significantly from the median in any direction, so someone with typical presentation of Down syndrome is allistic but not neurotypical.
Yes to this
.
Correct: Neurotypical is supposed to mean a lot more than just not autistic. On this site and elsewhere Neurotypical or NT are used way more often than allistic which tells me most of the time Neurotypical is used to mean not Autistic.


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14 Dec 2022, 5:43 am

just call me an autie or an aspie or a spectrumite, just don't call me shirley. ;)



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26 Apr 2023, 10:47 am

This article also discusses "nonverbal" vs "nonspeaking" and other nonclemeture
‘Child with autism’ vs. ‘autistic child’? What to say and why it matters - Caregiver.com

Quote:
Autistic vs. person with autism — which is the more inclusive, sensitive language preferred by the community? In many, but not all, cases, it’s the former. However, keep in mind, in the past few years, language has evolved quite a bit, and ultimately, the terminology is not one-size-fits-all.

“When it comes to saying ‘person with autism’ or ‘autistic person,’ this should always be a personal choice to the individual themselves, so just ask what their preference is!” says Alyssa Latham, a board-certified behavior analyst and parent coach at Ally ABA Consulting, which supports the development of neurodivergent kids.

“As professionals and educators, it was drilled into our heads that we should always use person-first language, such as ‘person with autism,’ because it was viewed as more respectful, and their diagnosis does not define them. But alternatively, many autistic individuals have stated that they cannot separate themselves from autism, meaning being autistic is who they are, therefore they prefer to identify as ‘autistic.’”

Here’s what else to know about the terminology.

Disorder” or “ASD” is frowned upon
Ann Carrick, communications manager at the Madison House Autism Foundation in Rockville, Maryland, an organization that focuses on autistic people in the older population, notes that the community, and those trying to be inclusive and sensitive, generally avoids using the term “Autism Spectrum Disorder,” or “ASD,” since “a lot of the autism community is very vocal about not wanting it to be viewed as a disorder, but rather a different way of thinking that often comes with a set of challenges.”

Chloe Duckworth, the co-founder and CEO of Valence Vibrations, an emotion AI company that creates real-time emotional subtitles as a digital accessibility solution for neurodiverse teams. adds: “When one believes that autism is a disorder that needs to be cured, saying ‘person with autism’ is no different than saying ‘person with cancer.’”

That being said, Latham notes: “While many people do not think of autism as a ‘disorder,’ because that lends to the idea that autism is something to be ‘cured,’ ASD is the official diagnosis in the DSM-V. It’s important to know that receiving this official diagnosis opens doors to access supports and accommodations that the individual might need.”

Person-first language vs. identity-first language (autism vs. autistic)
“In the autism community, there has been a shift in whether to use person-first language, such as, ‘a child with autism’ or identity-first language like, ‘autistic child,’” explains Jana Sarno, a board-certified behavior analyst and chief clinical officer at Hopebridge Autism Therapy Centers. “Historically, the language was person-centered, but since the neurodiversity movement, society has started to honor, accept and better understand everyone’s uniqueness, as many adults in the autism community feel like autism is part of their identity.”

Jenny Root, a board-certified behavior analyst and associate professor of Special Education in the School of Teacher Education at Florida State University, notes that it’s fairly common for first-person language to be used initially with children and identity-first language for adults. The reason being, kids can’t really voice what their preference is at this point.

“Many teenagers and adults see autism as part of their identity, so they prefer ‘autistic,’” Root says. “With younger kids who aren’t yet part of the self-advocacy movement, their parents may prefer ‘child with autism,’ particularly if they’re very young and/or need a lot of support.”

Again, though, the best way to determine what a person or family prefers is to ask.

Sarno explains that instead of having a one-term-fits-all policy at Hopebridge, they leave the choice up to families. “We acknowledge the history of how this language has changed and believe the choice is up to the families, as well as the children themselves, once they are able to make that distinction,” she explains. “Because we primarily serve children 5 years and younger, many of our families are newer to autism. Because of this, we typically use person-first language. However we shift that language if a parent refers to their ‘autistic son,’ for instance. It’s important to honor a family’s preferences and mirror their language.”

Non-verbal vs. non-speaking
Another term in the autism community that has shifted recently is “non-speaking,” which is generally preferred to “non-verbal,” as the latter indicates a person can’t communicate, when in reality, they’re just not using spoken words.

“While the term ‘non-verbal’ is widely-used within the autism community, ‘non-speaking’ or ‘non-vocal speakers’ are typically more accurate when referring to an individual who does not vocally communicate,” Sarno explains. “‘Non-vocal speaker’ is broader, recognizes receptive language and includes those who use AAC devices or sign-language to communicate. It also does not exclude those who are able to vocally speak but choose not to do so. Even better than either term is referring to what the individual uses as a communication modality rather than the method in which they do not communicate.”

Why the community is moving away from person-first language
The initial goal behind the encouragement of using person-first language, such as “a person with autism,” was to put the person ahead of their diagnosis. However, as self-advocacy has become more pervasive, many in the autism community have voiced the fact that they prefer the opposite and have done so for quite some time (everyone else is just playing catch-up).

The Association of University Centers on Disabilities (AUCD) writes: “Identity-first language emphasizes that the disability plays a role in who the person is, and reinforces disability as a positive cultural identifier. Identity-first language is generally preferred by self-advocates in the autistic, deaf and blind communities.”

“The neurodiversity movement shows that autism is simply a different sensory processing system that needs different tools to make sense of a world that isn’t designed for autistic people,” says Duckworth. In this sense, autism cannot be removed from one’s identity, and just as it would be strange and offensive to say ‘person with tallness’ or ‘person with queerness.’ Autistic people overwhelmingly prefer identity-first language — autistic person — over person-first language — people with autism.”

A 2022 survey from Autistic Not Weird found that, out of the over 11,000 people that were polled (both autistic and non), over 76% of autistic participants only refer to themselves using identity-first language.

“This debate has existed in the community for a long time because neurotypical professionals in the space insist on anti-neurodiversity language to emphasize the medical model of disability over the social model of disability,” Duckworth adds.

The bottom line on “autistic” vs. “person with autism”
“When discussing autism and other diagnoses in more general terms, terminology like ‘neurodiversity’ and ‘differing abilities’ are also appropriate,” says Sarno. “Many people find words and phrases like these to be more inclusive, understanding and accepting than terms such as, ‘disability,’ ‘special needs’ or ‘problems.’”

“Language is constantly evolving, but it’s important to try to use words that are mindful, inclusive and respectful of others while honoring diversity and uniqueness,” she continues. “Many times, there is not only one correct way to say something.”


Interesting that all the ABA practitioners quoted were ok with or favored identity first.

The "nonspeaking" vs "nonverbal" debate is personal to me because of the trach I had inserted I could not speak at all for a little over a year. Back then the term "nonverbal" was universally used and that was how I described myself. Until they knew me the staff at the rehab facility I was at did treat me as intellectually disabled but it had nothing to do with the terms I used, they saw I could not speak and assumed.


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26 Apr 2023, 6:19 pm

rse92 wrote:
I am autistic.

I couldn't care less if someone uses person first language to refer to me. Their hearts are in the right place.

Yes, but it also means that they're not particularly critical of the ideas that they come across and may well get offended by things because somebody told them they should be offended by it. As in a bit of a ticking time bomb as far as I'm concerned.

Person first versus identity first really shouldn't be a thing. Some languages put modifiers before what they modify and some reverse the order. It's kind of racist to suggest that one order is more respectful than the other when the modifiers and things that are being modified are typically slurped up in the same semantic block. It's typically only a problem if you're stacking more than the recommended 1-3 modifiers.



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26 Apr 2023, 7:42 pm

When we (the autistic/ND) community fight over language we lose sight of the goal and don't unify over the real issue(s). Its how the enemy wins the game - Divide (and sub-divide) and conquer.



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27 Apr 2023, 5:55 am

I am not partial to the use of one or the other. I use them both at different times, just as I say I am diabetic or I have diabetes. Word policing is becoming a division nobody needs in today's world. People who think one way should not be forced or "made" to use one term over the other (this applies to many situations and self descriptions). Humans have enough trouble getting along in this world without making us afraid we will somehow harm somebody else by the words we choose to describe ourselves.


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27 Apr 2023, 10:57 am

autisticelders wrote:
I am not partial to the use of one or the other. I use them both at different times, just as I say I am diabetic or I have diabetes. Word policing is becoming a division nobody needs in today's world. People who think one way should not be forced or "made" to use one term over the other (this applies to many situations and self descriptions). Humans have enough trouble getting along in this world without making us afraid we will somehow harm somebody else by the words we choose to describe ourselves.

Language policing is much more of a problem(not on WP) with "Aspie" and "Aspergers" these days than with person first language. What makes it even more frustrating unlike person first language policing in days of yore is it mostly comes from the autistic community rather than the allistic part of the autism community.

It is a distraction but sometimes we are forced to curb the bullying before we can move on.


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