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Joe90
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06 Jul 2023, 9:42 am

Recidivist wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
So, how does WP feel about antiquing?


I've seen some hilarious antiquing videos.

In the UK around Halloween they introduce rules in shops about selling eggs and flour to kids as Halloween somehow turned into an egging and antiquing fest.


I get reluctant to go out on Halloween because I keep thinking teenagers are going to target me with eggs. They can easily grab a couple of eggs from their parent's fridge at home.
Being targeted is my worst fear and can cause distress and anxiety for me, due to past experiences I've had with strangers targeting me in public.
I feel the same when walking out in the snow, I think I'm going to get a snowball thrown at me by kids, and due to my C-PTSD I see it as a way of them saying "we'll target you because you look too weak and pathetic to bother respecting you". It's also embarrassing being an adult in your 30s being targeted by 12-year-olds.
Touch wood, I've never had a snowball thrown at me by strangers before, but my friend who has downs syndrome has.


Mod. note - this thread was created from a sub-topic discussion on this thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=414874#p9323824


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IsabellaLinton
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06 Jul 2023, 9:51 am

You have CPTSD? ^


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Joe90
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06 Jul 2023, 1:27 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
You have CPTSD? ^


Not diagnosed but I think I have it, or some form of PTSD. I seem to be very afraid of strangers, to the point where feeling targeted is just a big deal to me and it will give me ass sorts of emotions such as anger, anxiety and depression, and can make me not want to go out. The attitude "just ignore them" and "it's them with the problem not you" doesn't work with me. My PTSD or whatever it is is pathological, meaning it can't just go away with positivity. I did have therapy for it but the sessions weren't long enough and the course finished and I wasn't "cured".


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IsabellaLinton
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06 Jul 2023, 1:44 pm

That sounds like Scopophobia. ^ I have that too. It seems to be based on anxiety about "what if" rather than memories of trauma from the past. I could be wrong though, since I don't know your life story.

CPTSD is usually defined as a longterm experience that you can't escape, where your life and safety are in danger. It's a term used for people with longterm physical or sexual abuse, and even prisoners of war or people in captivity. My CPTSD trauma therpist who diagnosed me was a Holocaust survivor and his parents were killed in a concentration camp. He did his PhD on CPTSD trauma related to captivity and kidnap.

People with CPTSD usually react to emotional flashbacks by feeling guilt and shame that it was their fault.

Regular or "Acute" PTSD differs because it's based on one very traumatic experience, like a shooting, a rape, or a car crash. The primary emotional response is fear and avoidance. People with Acute PTSD tend to have visual flashbacks rather than emotional ones, and they don't tend to self-blame -- at least not to the degree CPTSD patients do.

The difference is that CPTSD happens over such a long period of time the person gets habituated to believing they deserve it because they're a bad or shameful person. These people know that anger or fear won't help their situation so they go inward because of conditioned helplessness, and the damage to their self-concept is considered irreparable. It's developmental in nature because the brain learns to think this way as a coping mechanism. It can't be unlearned.


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TwilightPrincess
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06 Jul 2023, 1:51 pm

Quote:
The difference is that CPTSD happens over such a long period of time the person gets habituated to believing they deserve it because they're a bad or shameful person. These people know that anger or fear won't help their situation so they go inward because of conditioned helplessness, and the damage to their self-concept is considered irreparable. It's developmental in nature because the brain learns to think this way as a coping mechanism. It can't be unlearned.
Yeah, this is my situation after spending years in a very abusive relationship. I felt like it was my fault, that I deserved it, and that I wasn’t worth any better. After awhile, a person loses their will to fight. It’s easier to become a walking shadow. I still feel guilty and ashamed for stuff that I shouldn’t. It’s exhausting.


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Joe90
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06 Jul 2023, 2:11 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
That sounds like Scopophobia. ^ I have that too. It seems to be based on anxiety about "what if" rather than memories of trauma from the past. I could be wrong though, since I don't know your life story.

CPTSD is usually defined as a longterm experience that you can't escape, where your life and safety are in danger. It's a term used for people with longterm physical or sexual abuse, and even prisoners of war or people in captivity. My CPTSD trauma therpist who diagnosed me was a Holocaust survivor and his parents were killed in a concentration camp. He did his PhD on CPTSD trauma related to captivity and kidnap.

People with CPTSD usually react to emotional flashbacks by feeling guilt and shame that it was their fault.

Regular or "Acute" PTSD differs because it's based on one very traumatic experience, like a shooting, a rape, or a car crash. The primary emotional response is fear and avoidance. People with Acute PTSD tend to have visual flashbacks rather than emotional ones, and they don't tend to self-blame -- at least not to the degree CPTSD patients do.

The difference is that CPTSD happens over such a long period of time the person gets habituated to believing they deserve it because they're a bad or shameful person. These people know that anger or fear won't help their situation so they go inward because of conditioned helplessness, and the damage to their self-concept is considered irreparable. It's developmental in nature because the brain learns to think this way as a coping mechanism. It can't be unlearned.


Well I was targeted by kids when walking home from school (kids I didn't know, as in weren't in my class or anything), and they'd humiliate me and pick on me because of the way I looked so weak and pathetic and always on my own. So ever since then I have been afraid of encountering the same experience by strangers in public, and I think the root of my scopophobia is from the past experiences. I also fear social rejection because of how it happened to me so much during my teen years.
I know it isn't as serious as why other people have PTSD but I do suffer with social anxiety and agoraphobia due to past experiences. I'm more traumatised than what it sounds, as if I am targeted by strangers in public I will dwell on it for months, years, if not the rest of my life, and I get the ''would it have happened to other people or just me?'' thoughts. It makes me avoidant and nervous of the world.

EDIT: I do feel guilty and ashamed of being diagnosed with autism, which is why I hate, hate, hate it so much, but I don't want to go all into that, as I think I have derailed the thread enough.


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TwilightPrincess
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06 Jul 2023, 2:15 pm

^ People can have social anxiety and agoraphobia without meeting the very specific criteria for a PTSD/CPTSD diagnosis.


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Last edited by TwilightPrincess on 06 Jul 2023, 2:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

IsabellaLinton
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06 Jul 2023, 2:20 pm

I understand. I"m not suggesting you didn't have bad things happen or that you don't feel traumatised as a result. People can experience things that traumatise them without meeting criteria for PTSD / CPTSD according to the clinical diagnostic criteria. In your case I'm not trying to suggest it wasn't scary, but at least you had that option to "go home" and it would have stopped, even though you kept ruminating on it. I guess worst case scenario you could have moved schools or moved homes or whatever, even though that presents its own set of difficulties and wasn't really within your control. I'm just pointing out that people with CPTDS have NO way of avoiding the danger without increased danger as a consequence.

Anyway, I'm not sure what started this topic here but I think if you have Scopophobia, Agoraphobia, RSD, and a lifetime of austistic rumination from social anxiety that's still worth talking to your psychiatrist about. Maybe there are treatment options you can look into, like EMDR or DBT which tends to help autistic people better than CBT does. Have you been in touch with your ADHD doctor again? They might point you in the right direction for RSD support geared to autistic people with ADHD.


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Last edited by IsabellaLinton on 06 Jul 2023, 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

TwilightPrincess
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06 Jul 2023, 4:04 pm

Criteria for PTSD:

Quote:
DSM-5 Diagnostic Criteria for PTSD

Note: The following criteria apply to adults, adolescents, and children older than 6 years. For children 6 years and younger, see the DSM-5 section titled “Posttraumatic Stress Disorder for Children 6 Years and Younger” (APA, 2013a).

A. Exposure to actual or threatened death, serious injury, or sexual violence in one (or more) of the following ways:

1. Directly experiencing the traumatic event(s).

2. Witnessing, in person, the event(s) as it occurred to others.

3. Learning that the traumatic event(s) occurred to a close family member or close friend. In cases of actual or threatened death of a family member or friend, the event(s) must have been violent or accidental.

4. Experiencing repeated or extreme exposure to aversive details of the traumatic event(s) (e.g., first responders collecting human remains; police officers repeatedly exposed to details of child abuse). Note: Criterion A4 does not apply to exposure through electronic media, television, movies, or pictures, unless this exposure is work related.

B. Presence of one (or more) of the following intrusion symptoms associated with the traumatic event(s), beginning after the traumatic event(s) occurred:

1. Recurrent, involuntary, and intrusive distressing memories of the traumatic event(s). Note: In children older than 6 years, repetitive play may occur in which themes or aspects of the traumatic event(s) are expressed.

2. Recurrent distressing dreams in which the content and/or affect of the dream are related to the traumatic event(s). Note: In children, there may be frightening dreams without recognizable content.

3. Dissociative reactions (e.g., flashbacks) in which the individual feels or acts as if the traumatic event(s) were recurring. (Such reactions may occur on a continuum, with the most extreme expression being a complete loss of awareness of present surroundings.)
Note: In children, trauma-specific reenactment may occur in play.

4. Intense or prolonged psychological distress at exposure to internal or external cues that symbolize or resemble an aspect of the traumatic event(s).

5. Marked physiological reactions to internal or external cues that symbolize or resemble an aspect of the traumatic event(s).

C. Persistent avoidance of stimuli associated with the traumatic event(s), beginning after the traumatic event(s) occurred, as evidenced by one or both of the following:

1. Avoidance of or efforts to avoid distressing memories, thoughts, or feelings about or closely associated with the traumatic event(s).

2. Avoidance of or efforts to avoid external reminders (people, places, conversations, activities, objects, situations) that arouse distressing memories, thoughts, or feelings about or closely associated with the traumatic event(s).

D. Negative alterations in cognitions and mood associated with the traumatic event(s), beginning or worsening after the traumatic event(s) occurred, as evidenced by two (or more) of the following:

1. Inability to remember an important aspect of the traumatic event(s) (typically due to dissociative amnesia, and not to other factors such as head injury, alcohol, or drugs).

2. Persistent and exaggerated negative beliefs or expectations about oneself, others, or the world (e.g., “I am bad,” “No one can be trusted,” “The world is completely dangerous,” “My whole nervous system is permanently ruined”).

3. Persistent, distorted cognitions about the cause or consequences of the traumatic event(s) that lead the individual to blame himself/herself or others.

4. Persistent negative emotional state (e.g., fear, horror, anger, guilt, or shame).

5. Markedly diminished interest or participation in significant activities.

6. Feelings of detachment or estrangement from others.

7. Persistent inability to experience positive emotions (e.g., inability to experience happiness, satisfaction, or loving feelings).

E. Marked alterations in arousal and reactivity associated with the traumatic event(s), beginning or worsening after the traumatic event(s) occurred, as evidenced by two (or more) of the following:

1. Irritable behavior and angry outbursts (with little or no provocation), typically expressed as verbal or physical aggression toward people or objects.

2. Reckless or self-destructive behavior.

3. Hypervigilance.

4. Exaggerated startle response.

5. Problems with concentration.

6. Sleep disturbance (e.g., difficulty falling or staying asleep or restless sleep).

F. Duration of the disturbance (Criteria B, C, D and E) is more than 1 month.

G. The disturbance causes clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.

H. The disturbance is not attributable to the physiological effects of a substance (e.g., medication, alcohol) or another medical condition.


Specify whether:

With dissociative symptoms: The individual’s symptoms meet the criteria for posttraumatic stress disorder, and in addition, in response to the stressor, the individual experiences persistent or recurrent symptoms of either of the following:

Depersonalization: Persistent or recurrent experiences of feeling detached from, and as if one were an outside observer of, one’s mental processes or body (e.g., feeling as though one were in a dream; feeling a sense of unreality of self or body or of time moving slowly).

Derealization: Persistent or recurrent experiences of unreality of surroundings (e.g., the world around the individual is experienced as unreal, dreamlike, distant, or distorted). Note: To use this subtype, the dissociative symptoms must not be attributable to the physiological effects of a substance (e.g., blackouts, behavior during alcohol intoxication) or another medical condition (e.g., complex partial seizures).

Specify whether:

With delayed expression: If the full diagnostic criteria are not met until at least 6 months after the event (although the onset and expression of some symptoms may be immediate).


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK2 ... ch3.box16/


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Last edited by TwilightPrincess on 06 Jul 2023, 4:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

IsabellaLinton
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06 Jul 2023, 4:16 pm

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Joe90
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06 Jul 2023, 4:28 pm

Thank you Isabella for educating me. You are a true friend (if you don't mind me saying that :) ). I'll post more feedback tomorrow when I'm more awake.


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06 Jul 2023, 5:12 pm

Genuine question: Have you ever considered just social anxiety disorder, or even something more like Avoidant Personality Disorder? I'm going to be blunt, it doesn't sound like you have straight up PTSD/CPTSD, but you can 100% develop SAD or AvPD from the experiences you mention, AND autistic + ADHD people are MUCH more likely to do so. I know a label like AvPD is scary, but AvPD is nothing like BPD or NPD or ASPD, it's actually in a different "cluster" of PDs entirely, and is honestly basically like social anxiety that took a f**k ton steroids w/ a severe fear of rejection/embarrassment/etc. that makes you do really life limiting s**t like avoiding going outside, possibly being seen/watched by others, etc. Do actually fully look into it though before you go around saying you think you may have it, if you look it up and think you relate to it, because it's still quite serious and still has the stigma personality disorders in general do.



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06 Jul 2023, 5:36 pm

Also, a person can have some of the characteristics of PTSD, but that doesn’t mean they have it unless ALL of the diagnostic criteria is met.


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Joe90
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06 Jul 2023, 5:45 pm

Well at first I knew I didn't have PTSD because I thought it was what Isabella explained, but a while ago someone here (can't remember who it was) pointed PTSD out to me and said that I may have it, from the bullying and social rejection I faced. So that's why I began considering myself PTSD.

But coming from people here who actually have PTSD and explaining it so well, I have learnt again what it is and that I probably don't have it. But I just feel traumatized by crap I've received from people in my life, as in angry, resentful, self-loathing, etc.

I was thinking along the lines of the type of PTSD (forgive me if that isn't the correct term) that people have from past experiences such as being afraid of dogs after a dog attack or being afraid of swimming after nearly drowning in a pool. In my case, it's being afraid of ridicule and humiliation from strangers in public due to having past experiences of it that still haunt my dreams. I wish there was a medical term for the "once bitten twice shy" type of PTSD that isn't exactly PTSD. I just feel PTSD-ish.


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06 Jul 2023, 5:49 pm

People often develop phobias by going through bad experiences like those. Social anxiety can certainly be caused by negative social experiences.

You might want to consider talking to a psychologist or having psychological testing done to rule out something like a personality disorder. A mental health professional would be able to give you real answers that we can’t.


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Joe90
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06 Jul 2023, 5:55 pm

I did get tested for personality disorder after I was assessed for ADHD, but the results came back negative and they said that my behaviours and symptoms are all a mixture of Asperger's, ADHD and anxiety disorder.


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