Did I say something abelist? looking for interpretations.

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__Elijahahahaho
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27 May 2024, 2:06 pm

I shouldn't worry too much about this, but I want to sort of ask this community.
I was in a conversation with a girl who had done some startup with mental health services.

I told her I was also working on a project just to share what it was, I said it
was about solving the "theory of mind problem", by visualising the contents of social interactions
and allowing labeling of the entities within them, and breaking down the process of inferring
or aggregating behavioural patterns about what the other person is like and showing their emotions and stuff.
(although I said it in a bit of (very) a jumbled way).

She kept interrupting me, saying "explain it like I am 5", but then asking for specific definitions of stuff i thought was meant to be a helpful analogy.

I then said it was supposed to be a "social wheelchair".
And that we cannot rely on the goodwill of people in the community all the time to learn and respect
"invisible disabilites".

She then said something about starting from a place of hostility, and expecting more from humanity then
abruptly said she had to go to the toilet and left without a word.

I suppose technically I am solving the "double empathy" problem, and perhaps people object to using "disability",
but I thought it was clear that it was not meant to diminish autistic ability,
but to work as a visual aid in areas of theory of mind and
bringing in extra context, where autistics might struggle.

Although it might sound like it makes the world hostile,
it actually doesn't because it makes you less paranoid
the better you get at identifying real dangerous situations.
Its about increasing detection but also precision through a visual medium.

I suppose I have a few questions:
- As an autistic person myself I have had the experience that you
absolutely do need a "theory of mind" aid for
potentially malicious situations, how "hostile" is the world to you?

- Do you care so much about terms like "disability", i don't really know what word to use,
I don't mean it badly, I just mean it like it is for the specific areas of
communication that I understand there to be problems.

- Maybe the woman was giving me a hard time by constantly interrupting and asking specific definitions, instead of thinking with me and trying to paraphrase what I was saying. Her abrupt exit seemed to indicate she was offended, or just annoyed, she is a "mental health professional" I think, I know a bit but not much about that, I just know about software and a possible way that would help me. Why did she ask so many questions if she just wanted to end the conversation.



__Elijahahahaho
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27 May 2024, 2:14 pm

A chatbot suggests she may have been "willfully ignorant" which sounds plausible, but also I wasn't very clear and she probably got impatient, but if she was just impatient she would have said something vague then goodbye.

Whatever.



Edna3362
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27 May 2024, 2:24 pm

I see nothing ableist.
Just a pessimist who pissed off an optimist. :lol:

Quote:
As an autistic person myself I have had the experience that you
absolutely do need a "theory of mind" aid for
potentially malicious situations, how "hostile" is the world to you?

In my own case; it's the other way around -- I'm the hostile one, not the world.
For no external reasons other than whatever internal encumbrance that I have; which can distort everything -- internal and translated to external.

Of course it won't make sense to anyone who isn't me.
What they may see as hostile, I don't see it that way and vice versa.

Quote:
Do you care so much about terms like "disability", i don't really know what word to use,
I don't mean it badly, I just mean it like it is for the specific areas of
communication that I understand there to be problems.

Personally, somehow. Due to my past and the lack of control that I had in my youth.
But I shouldn't and it should be a reclaimed word.

Quote:
Maybe the woman was giving me a hard time by constantly interrupting and asking specific definitions, instead of thinking with me and trying to paraphrase what I was saying. Her abrupt exit seemed to indicate she was offended, or just annoyed, she is a "mental health professional" I think, I know a bit but not much about that, I just know about software and a possible way that would help me.
Why did she ask so many questions if she just wanted to end the conversation.

Possibly that her expectations, interpretations and definitions are very different from yours.

Yours can possibly make dissonating hers.
I did dubbed her an 'optimist'; maybe your 'judgement' over how humans react sets her off.

Maybe you made her feel dumb and clueless.
Maybe you weren't able to give her a framework.
Maybe because she really just have very different pictures of know hows and doesn't know how to approach that and it frustrates her.

I don't know what and where her priority lies. Nor her character for that matter...
I assume that this was a job with a degree of advocacy involved.

Maybe she never truly cared at all, is just this close minded and just want to be over with.
Maybe none of this -- was she impatient before all of this? Not that I'm asking for more info. It could be very much nothing to do with what had happened.


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angelsonthemoon
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27 May 2024, 2:49 pm

She may have had trouble understanding theory of mind. It's not the most descriptive term, leading to easy misunderstandings. I would describe theory of mind as the ability to simulate another person's perspective rather than assuming people think the same as you. A person with autism may not have the theory of mind to comprehend that the other person doesn't want to hear everything about their special interest. They may be slow to pick up on subtle social cues like an irritated nod rather than a happy nod.



funeralxempire
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27 May 2024, 2:59 pm

People sometimes don't like being reminded how little others actually care about their needs.


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LittleBeach
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27 May 2024, 3:32 pm

I do find the world hostile to autistic misunderstandings. I suffered from anxiety for many years because of people reacting wrongly to things I do and say.

I personally dont think you said anything offensive with your disability analogy

My guess is the woman was just overwhelmed by lots of info, and was trying to participate but didn’t know exactly how to contribute.



__Elijahahahaho
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28 May 2024, 5:47 am

I realised she did say she had a recent failed startup in some kind of "mental health" service, so maybe she was a bit pissed of I was "on her turf" or jealous.



IsabellaLinton
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28 May 2024, 5:56 am

I'm lost on the whole idea because I have Aphantasia, meaning I can't visualize anything.
I hate when people, especially therapists or disabilities' rights people, tell me to visualize.

It's ableist to ask someone to "visualize the content of social interactions and the entities with them"
Many autistic people can't visualize.


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