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protest_the_hero
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28 Feb 2009, 2:46 pm

Autismis generally seen as disability. If you're smart like an aspie, you obviously won't be seen as disabled like LFA so you'll more likely be considered mild. Though when it come to actual autistic traits:1.obsessions 2.childish behaviour 3.hypersensitiviy 4.resisting change etc. are we actually normally milder than LFA?



Callista
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28 Feb 2009, 2:58 pm

Generally they will only diagnose Asperger's if you are able to take care of yourself (though not necessarily to the point of being able to live independently) and communicate by spoken language. But you're right, Asperger's can be severe. Kingdomofrats has mentioned several Aspies who live in a group home, and that the biggest problem for them seems to be meltdowns and other behavioral issues. In my own AS support group there are several who can't live on their own yet because they can't manage the logistics of shopping, bill-paying, budget-keeping, etc. and all the unexpected events that come when you haven't got anybody to manage them for you.

In general, people labeled LFA have one of several things: One, very strong autistic traits; two, comorbid mental retardation; three, severe sensory processing problems. Being non-verbal (not using spoken language) is possible but not certain; and some non-verbal are not low-functioning (by some definitions) because the use of sign, writing, etc. lets them communicate.

Complicating all of this is the problem that "low functioning" doesn't even have a set definition; so somebody who is HFA to one doctor may be LFA to another, and it's possible to jump from one to the other during your lifetime, sometimes more than once. While "low functioning Asperger's" may seem a misnomer, it can and does happen--if your definition of "low functioning" includes something more than just speech and IQ. (If it doesn't, you've just labeled people who need 24 hour care, but can speak and have 70+ IQs, "high functioning"...)


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Erminea
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28 Feb 2009, 3:23 pm

Good question. Must say, I'm a little touchy about the term mild used in context with autism and this isn't meant as flaming someone but....

Imo, the 'pervasive' in a pervasive development disorder, cannot be seen as mild, as pervasive means intense and spread throughout. All influencing. Those two words (pervasive and mild) are, imo, almost the opposite of each other. But that's maybe nagging about words but still this is how I feel about it.

I consider myself quite lucky in some aspects but my sensitivity for sound, bright light, flickering lights, some smells and touch isn't mild at all. I experience those quite intense most of the time. Sometimes it's even unbearable and cause of a major meltdown.

I'm mildly intense? Mmmm. Don't know?



whitetiger
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28 Feb 2009, 3:46 pm

I'm still perplexed by whether I'm high or low functioning. I have to have a test soon to figure it out. If I'm low, I get DD services.
My AS BF qualifies as LF, even with an average IQ.

I have an above average IQ but I can't drive, can't work (unless it's from home,) don't always budget well, need a network of support around me to get by and have a co-morbid condition (bipolar) but it's stable on meds so not an issue at all now.

I'm curious as to how I will be classified. I'm going to be given a "functional IQ" equivalent, that is different from performance or verbal IQ. I'm curious to see what it is.


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28 Feb 2009, 3:55 pm

I also consider myself to be very lucky. There used to be times in the past, when I used to question whether I did have AS or not. Having said that, those were times when I was still living with my family, and I was suppressing a lot of stuff. Just a little under two years ago, I've bought a little Sid character at Value Village. I've bonded so much with little Sid from a certain movie, that I take him everywhere with me, because him and I are twins of a different species. He's just a piece of plastic to the people of mainstream society, who expect everybody to be like them. I know that Sid is a toy, but he's a lot more than just a piece of plastic to me. Despite that one little thing, I consider myself to be very well functioning.


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SpongeBobRocksMao
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28 Feb 2009, 4:08 pm

I think they call Asperger's mild as we can talk and we generally have normal IQ's. But I must admit, we're not high functioning at everything, like you said, like obsessions and social skills.


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Followthereaper90
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28 Feb 2009, 4:10 pm

even (like most of i know) i have meltdowns im happy that im able to talk and do normal stuff :) so im not that unlucky when i think about it


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pezar
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28 Feb 2009, 5:37 pm

I actually think that Warren Buffett, who seems to have AS, is actually more LF than he lets on. According to his biographer, he can't dress himself or eat a balanced diet (hamburgers, potato chips, and Coca Cola anyone?) and he seems to have opinions that have been placed in his head by others-he grew up an extreme John Birch right winger, but Susan made him liberal, so he seems to not be able to form his own opinions-but can drive and work in an office (although for many years he worked alone in a spare bedroom) so he's LF in some ways yet can do things that other aspies can't. That's why it's a spectrum, I guess.

People have tried to dig up dirt on him and failed. Other billionaires have multiple closets filled with all sorts of juicy skeletons-kinky sex, drug use, ruthlessness, organized crime ties-but Buffett seems to be a zero in all the traditional rich guy scandal areas. When his son divorced, the ex wife was besieged by offers for a kiss and tell, but decided to write about Buffett's investing strategies instead. The strategy seems to be Buffett's biggest secret. That seems to be typical of aspies, except those who are drawn to substances to dull the pain of social rejection, and even then they drink/smoke alone.



samtoo
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28 Feb 2009, 5:41 pm

I guess it's not mild in how powerful it can be, but mild in comparison to something that's described as more so than mild.


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28 Feb 2009, 8:45 pm

AS isn't a "mild" disorder, and when people say that it is, they're comparing it to Early Infantile Autism, which is usually severe compared to AS (they kinda blur into one around the point where the highest functioning individuals with Autism appear similar to those with AS).

Some points on why it's seen as "mild" compared to Autism:

-being able to interact with someone, no matter how odd and eccentric it is, is "mild" compared to someone who can't interact with people
-not actually needing a routine to function; you might become anxious/stressed/uncomfortable if a plan/routine is broken, but you can usually still do it
-being able to handle the presence of people
-[possible] sensory disorder that's nowhere near as bad as those with autism, i.e., uncomfortable compared to non-functional
-can form relationships/friendships in person; most with Early Infantile Autism can't
-can work in a decent paying job if it's related to an interest (rather than the menial one that those with Autism are always given)
-can live and work independently (it doesn't mean they can, but most with Autism won't live independently)



2ukenkerl
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28 Feb 2009, 9:08 pm

pezar wrote:
I actually think that Warren Buffett, who seems to have AS, is actually more LF than he lets on. According to his biographer, he can't dress himself or eat a balanced diet (hamburgers, potato chips, and Coca Cola anyone?) and he seems to have opinions that have been placed in his head by others-he grew up an extreme John Birch right winger, but Susan made him liberal, so he seems to not be able to form his own opinions-but can drive and work in an office (although for many years he worked alone in a spare bedroom) so he's LF in some ways yet can do things that other aspies can't. That's why it's a spectrum, I guess.

People have tried to dig up dirt on him and failed. Other billionaires have multiple closets filled with all sorts of juicy skeletons-kinky sex, drug use, ruthlessness, organized crime ties-but Buffett seems to be a zero in all the traditional rich guy scandal areas. When his son divorced, the ex wife was besieged by offers for a kiss and tell, but decided to write about Buffett's investing strategies instead. The strategy seems to be Buffett's biggest secret. That seems to be typical of aspies, except those who are drawn to substances to dull the pain of social rejection, and even then they drink/smoke alone.


He IS old and rich, so a lot of those things now don't mean much.



2ukenkerl
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28 Feb 2009, 9:12 pm

Danielismyname wrote:
AS isn't a "mild" disorder, and when people say that it is, they're comparing it to Early Infantile Autism, which is usually severe compared to AS (they kinda blur into one around the point where the highest functioning individuals with Autism appear similar to those with AS).

Some points on why it's seen as "mild" compared to Autism:

-being able to interact with someone, no matter how odd and eccentric it is, is "mild" compared to someone who can't interact with people
-not actually needing a routine to function; you might become anxious/stressed/uncomfortable if a plan/routine is broken, but you can usually still do it
-being able to handle the presence of people
-[possible] sensory disorder that's nowhere near as bad as those with autism, i.e., uncomfortable compared to non-functional
-can form relationships/friendships in person; most with Early Infantile Autism can't
-can work in a decent paying job if it's related to an interest (rather than the menial one that those with Autism are always given)
-can live and work independently (it doesn't mean they can, but most with Autism won't live independently)


If you read the DSM, it DOES make AS sound almost normal(from a non social and day to day standpoint). I toyed with writing here about an episode I recently had. Maybe I will.



28 Feb 2009, 10:30 pm

According to the AS criteria, you are not supposed to lack self help skills or adaptive behavior so you are supposed to be able to take care of yourself, manage your money, hold down a job, etc. but there are none aspies out there who also can't manage their money or hold down a job or take care of their house or themselves, due to reasons because they also have a condition that impairs them such as Bipolar or they suffer from laziness so they aren't motivated to work or even clean their house or even bath or shower.



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28 Feb 2009, 10:50 pm

Spokane_Girl wrote:
According to the AS criteria, you are not supposed to lack self help skills or adaptive behavior so you are supposed to be able to take care of yourself, manage your money, hold down a job, etc. but there are none aspies out there who also can't manage their money or hold down a job or take care of their house or themselves, due to reasons because they also have a condition that impairs them such as Bipolar or they suffer from laziness so they aren't motivated to work or even clean their house or even bath or shower.


Well, Bipolar has nothing really to do with it. If they have mania, they may actually feel better about the job. If they are depressed, a job could help keep it at bay. YEAH, I know chemical depression doesn't have situation causes, but the situations CAN make it worse. And laziness affects EVERYONE.

Still, I CAN understand how routine, social, and meltdown problems can affect work. HECK, they affect MY work also! Still, I muddle through. I ALSO had chemical depression. I think honoring my interests more helped that a LOT! AND, through a lot of bad accounting by others, etc... I now have enough cash to probably ride out a bad year(Don't worry, it is really just a different way of accounting, and is mine. I'm not one of the beneficiaries of any "stimulus" package.), so I guess I can't complain about that. Still, even when it looked like my situation was that much worse, I didn't react like I once would have even if I were a billionare with no cares.



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01 Mar 2009, 10:52 am

In the video someone posted about the autistic couple in love, the woman's father said, "It's harder to be high functioning than low because you're just so close to normal, but not there. It's frustrating."

I thought that summed it up well.


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01 Mar 2009, 1:05 pm

Employment for Aspergers is only about 10%, from what I've read of the research (one study said higher, though still <50%, but it was a high-end group).