Aspergers --> Spectrum change
funeralxempire
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The problem is that those traits are common in both autism and ADHD, and with the high rate of comorbidity it's hard to entirely untangle the relationship between the two.
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ASPartOfMe
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This is why the informal term AuDHD has gained currency.
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DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity.
“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman
It always infuriates me when I see various people claiming that the change was made to be more inclusive, when that's not at all what happened nor is there any good evidence that it was even intended to ensure more coverage and support.
The change was made to be exclusive.
I think that much is pretty clear. I see people claiming that the spectrum is wider than it used to be, but that's really only in the sense that autistic disorder was considered to be autism at the time and now there are other things being rolled into that. But, the total area that it covers is, as you're pointing out, narrower than the combined spectrum of all the constituent diagnoses with people previously diagnosable with autistic disorder and AS being particularly hard hit in terms of being undiagnosed.
It may conceivably have made it easier to get help if you still qualify for a diagnosis, but it made getting diagnosed even harder. Especially folks like me that have had to go through a series of evaluations due to the rules about comorbidities. I couldn't get an ADHD diagnosis due to the OCD diagnosis, and it's been a struggle to get any sort of ASD related diagnosis because I already had diagnoses for OCD, ADHD and most of the Schizophrenia spectrum disorders, but getting appropriate help with the autistic traits has historically just not been available due to the way the resources get allocated, even though the stuff I would need is pretty cheap to provide.
Susan Swedo, chair of the DSM-5 neurodevelopmental disorders workgroup, said in May that many people who identify with Asperger’s Syndrome “don't actually have Asperger's disorder, much less an autism spectrum disorder.”
David Kupfer, chair of the task force charged with the DSM revisions, blurted to the New York Times in January: “We have to make sure not everybody who is a little odd gets a diagnosis of autism or Asperger Disorder. It involves a use of treatment resources. It becomes a cost issue.” (This was startling to those who’d missed the memo that declared costs and treatment resources the responsibility of the APA. Which was everyone.)
Catherine Lord, the director of the Institute for Brain Development at New York-Presbyterian Hospital, and another member of the workgroup, told Scientific American in January, “If the DSM-IV criteria are taken too literally, anybody in the world could qualify for Asperger's or PDD-NOS... We need to make sure the criteria are not pulling in kids who do not have these disorders.”
Paul Steinberg, a D.C. psychiatrist, declared in a New York Times op-ed in January that “with the loosening of the diagnosis of Asperger, children and adults who are shy and timid, who have quirky interests like train schedules and baseball statistics, and who have trouble relating to their peers” are erroneously and harmfully labeled autistic. He blamed a 1992 Department of Education directive that “called for enhanced services" for children diagnosed with autism spectrum disorders: “The diagnosis of Asperger syndrome went through the roof."
Dr. Bryna Siegel, a developmental psychologist at the University of California, San Francisco, told a Daily Beast reporter in February that she “undiagnoses” nine of out ten students with so-called Asperger’s. Siegel was a member of the panel responsible for the inclusion of Asperger’s in the DSM-IV, which the reporter cited to me in a phone call as evidence of Seigel's objectivity: implicitly, Seigel is critiquing her own work. But that same journalist made no mention in the piece of Dr. Seigel’s history as an expert witness for school districts fending off families’ claims for those “enhanced services,” and the obvious conflict of interest (as well as the selection bias in her client pool) this represents. In October, she told New York magazine that she undiagnoses six out of ten. That's quite a shift in eight months. Hope it was evidence-based.
What always gets me about that is just how careless that process of rewriting the criteria was, and that they wound up fossilizing some errors that had been made when the DSM IV was actually published. There's also this massive gap that doesn't get any sort of a diagnosis despite a lack of any evidence that people in that gap don't have significant impairment that requires help of some sort.
The worst of it is that the people most likely to have had their eligibility yanked as a result are disproportionately those with significant support needs and those that would probably be able to manage on their own with appropriate access to information and tools. Much of which has become rather cheap these days. I can easily set my android phone to set a timer to end at a certain time with a label to indicate what it's supposed to be reminding me of with Gemini and the phone itself only cost me $300 several years ago.
Yes, and that's why they were supposed to actually get off their butts and do some actual research. The same can be said of ScPD versus AS, there isn't a well defined line between where one starts and the other ends. But, rather than that doing the work to establish whether or not they're really different things and if so where to draw the line. AS got axed and partially merged into ASD and ScPD is probably just going to disappear entirely without any real replacement.
These sorts of multi-axis conditions can be rather tricky to figure out how to deal with, but the way it's been done has effectively destroyed any ability to conduct the research as now you've got a bunch of people that were effectively blocked from being diagnosed, which means being blocked from inclusion in the statistics and blocked from being considered when new criteria are written or modifications are proposed. It's the same sort of thing that happened with AS where the people least able to participate are now effectively not diagnosable without taking liberties with the diagnosis.
This is why the informal term AuDHD has gained currency.
I prefer to call myself AspieHD. It rolls off the tongue better.

Or AsDHD.
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My diagnosis story and why it was a traumatic experience for me:
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mwalker1996
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I identify with both labels. I definitely had more classic autism traits as a young child, but grew to be very high functioning as an adult. I have a friend who was diagnosed as asperges but he has significantly more support needs than i do and he spends a lot of time in day support groups with more lv 2 autstics. Asperges is more complex, but generally viewed as someone whose a bit quirky but very capable of navigating the world for the most part.
ASPartOfMe
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Since we are discussing our personal journeys with the Aspie and Autistic identities in the wake of the controversies over the spectrum change I might as well discuss mine.
I was diagnosed in 2013 the same year the Aspergers diagnosis was subsumed into the Autism diagnosis. My clinician was against the change. At the time nobody knew how this would play out or even if the Aspergers diagnosis would come back. My clinician hedged her bets. She diagnosed me with Aspergers with moderate severity under the old manual and Autism Spectrum Disorder under the new one. Interestingly she never gave me a level.
It was a bitter controversy in this forum at the time. Supporters of the change often described people who identified as Aspie as elitists who looked down on people who had “real autism”. There were people who opposed the change because they believed Autism and Aspergers were separate conditions. While I strongly opposed the change I also identified as Autistic because I viewed Aspergers as a form of Autism. The idea that you had to identify as either an aspie or as an autistic was bizarre to me. Having multiple identities is usual. I identify as both a New Yorker and an American because being a New Yorker is a subset of being an American. Nobody has problem with Americans who say they are Italian because it is taken as a given that they are American. At the time Aspergers described more accurately where I was on the spectrum then autism so I used that more often.
In 2018 when two historians published works that said Hans Asperger for whom Aspergers was named after was complicit with the Nazis eugenics program. In the wake of these revelations some organizations changed their names and in other Autistics spaces it was demanded that people who identified as Aspie drop it and if they did not they were assumed to be a Nazi. This never ended and intensified when Musk was in the Trump administration. The ironic part is that autism the preferred term was coined by influential eugenicist.
Because of this I dropped the Aspie identity but I did not drop the autistic one. For me using a term coined by a bad person is one thing but using a term to identify with a term named after a person is honoring that person something I feel Hans Asperger does not deserve. Part of Autism is finding change difficult. Dropping something so personal was not easy but I did have the advantage that I did also identify as Autistic. This does not mean I disown my previous identifying as Aspie. That diagnosis under that name helped me a lot. I have no desire nor could I undo that part of my history. But that is what Aspie is now, my history.
The above is my personal choice not something I demand of others. I remember a decade ago when I could not go to comment sections of articles or videos about autism without someone demanding we stop using “Autistic” in favor of “person with autism”. They said “Autistic” is offensive. What I found offensive is someone probably with six decades less experience being autistic than me telling me what I should find offensive. I have no desire to do that to another autistic. Aren’t we bullied enough?
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DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity.
“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman
I dislike it when people accuse us Aspies of being ''supremists'' for not feeling like we identify with autism even though we were diagnosed with Asperger's which is supposed to be a form of autism. It's really offensive when they compare us to racist white supremists. We don't think we're ''better than'' people diagnosed with autism. Some of us just don't feel that we identify with autism. Maybe the term autism feels too good for us! I don't know.
By being pinned down as autistic can make us feel like we're being treated differently. For example, if it hadn't of said Asperger's syndrome on my medical records, I probably would have been in one of the top priority groups for the first covid vaccination, and I wouldn't have wanted that special treatment. A few people diagnosed with autism who I know (and were under 60) got vaccinated first because they have autism but not compromised immune system. But I never got offered priority for my vaccine, I had mine the same time with the rest of my age-group, and I figured it was because my diagnosis was of Asperger's instead of autism, so the government decided I didn't need priority. I didn't need priority anyway. I don't want to be treated like I'm disabled or ill.
However, I'm not sure if having autism instead of Asperger's would help me in the future regarding security, like having financial help if - God forbid - anything happened to my partner, and priority for a secure place to live independently. But whether it's a serious condition or not, Asperger's is still a diagnosis, and I also have diagnosed ADHD and anxiety - the anxiety being under the mental health umbrella. So while I'm independent, I'm still vulnerable when it comes to security. I NEED security and would not cope being homeless at all. I have so many possessions that already indicates that I've always lived in secure environments, and you have to be hard as nails to be homeless, while I'm a bag of nerves and do not want to down that road of needing street drugs and alcohol to survive. No way.
I really need to talk to the doctor about this, as just the thought of being homeless in the future is giving me massive anxiety in the present.
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My diagnosis story and why it was a traumatic experience for me:
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ASPartOfMe
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By being pinned down as autistic can make us feel like we're being treated differently.
In my dozen years here there have always been a few supremacists but the vast majority of members here have never felt that way. During the period right after the Asperger’s diagnosis was eliminated from the DSM manual people who identified as Aspie as a group were regularly accused of being elitists, supremacists, people who were faking autism, people who were not autistic but overdiagnosed, being attention seekers, and using Aspergers to excuse bad behavior. That has not been true here for years but is still true in other Autistic social media. What gets me is that people on X that refuse to drop their Aspie identity are regularly scolded for being Nazis like Musk(If Musk is a Nazi is a topic for another thread). The irony of wanting to cancel Aspergers while on Musk’s platform is lost on these people.
Due to the association with intellectual disability autistics were infantilized while Aspies were expected to do genius tricks. Nowadays we are either infantilized or expected to do genius tricks. The latter comes from the whole autism is a superpower idea which from what I see mostly comes from parents and media portrayals not us.
If we are going to be wrongly stereotyped no matter what we do we might as well be who we are.
Sometimes I do wish that when they took Asperger's out of the ASD spectrum they should have got everyone who were already diagnosed with Asperger's reassessed, as now some of us Aspies don't feel like we fit the autism spectrum and I'm wondering if it was like this back in the late 90s would I have still been qualified for an autism diagnosis? I don't think so. They did think of ADHD at first but because I learnt how to behave at school by age 7 they decided I wasn't qualified for ADHD (even though I still had all the symptoms), so they must have thought "well she isn't autistic exactly but still exhibits some social awkwardness and sound sensitivities compared to her peers, so let's just go by that fancy in-between label 'Asperger's syndrome' that is so famously diagnosed these days".
But I think if that didn't exist then I would have probably been diagnosed with anxiety disorder and maybe ADHD, in childhood.
I've often been told that Asperger's is just an anxiety disorder including social anxiety. Not saying that is true but it seems to be what a lot of people believe.
It's just difficult to work out what you are when you understand social interaction and don't feel like an alien around NTs and you have the normal social desires NTs have and you're interested in people and are social-orientated, yet you are also shy and have social anxiety in some situations. So I'm not the sort to just go up to a random stranger and start talking away. That's the type of social interaction I shy away from. But once I get comfortable around people then I just be myself, don't need to mask that much, and can become chatty. NTs with social anxiety can relate to this all too well.
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My diagnosis story and why it was a traumatic experience for me:
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funeralxempire
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Wasn't Asperger's folded into the term autistic spectrum disorder?
There's no need to reevaluate those people, they've already got a diagnosis that's considered synonymous with ASD.
Whatever feelings they have towards autism isn't really important from a diagnostic standpoint, because liking or disliking the label doesn't matter.
I'd expect a lot of people diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, narcissistic personality disorder and other unflattering diagnoses would insist that they feel like they don't fit in with those diagnoses either, but that doesn't mean they don't meet the criteria.
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^ I just keep hoping I was misdiagnosed. Just like my mother kept hoping she had something else instead of cancer and that the doctors got it wrong. I know cancer and autism are two completely different things but it's still the same emotion felt with me. I'm traumatised by my diagnosis (as explained in my signature), which is why I get angry when people say I'm lying about my diagnosis and that I'm just some trollish NT with Munchausen syndrome pretending I got a diagnosis. Ha, I wish!
(Not referring to you or anyone else in this thread by the way).
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My diagnosis story and why it was a traumatic experience for me:
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Sweetleaf
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I guess I am not sure, because I technically did not get diagnosed with aspergers, I got diagnosed with PDD NOS, which is like aspergers but its like if you lack some of the symtoms but still seem spectrumy. IDK what it stands for is Pervasive Developmental Disorder - Not Otherwise Specified.
But seems that is also just called autism spectrum disorder nowdays to at least in my case.
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I also keep hoping I was misdiagnosed because I keep worrying that I'm going to suddenly develop epilepsy mid-life. It's why I'm scared to drive. They often associate autism with epilepsy and I read somewhere that people with autism have a higher risk of developing epilepsy even if they never did before. It's why I stay away from drugs or alcohol, I don't want to damage my brain at all.
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My diagnosis story and why it was a traumatic experience for me:
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=416910&start=1056#p9695026
This is news to me, but unless you have a compelling need to drive I'd give it a miss!
nick007
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This is news to me, but unless you have a compelling need to drive I'd give it a miss!
My psychs & docs question if I have epilepsy because I'm on a seizure med to treat my OCD & I'm also on Wellbutrin. I never had seizures.
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