Thrifty vs Frugal.

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Hi all,
Money seems to be the most important currency there is and I've felt that my experiences with money have led to a problem...I'm just too frugal!
I can't get out of this buy-as-cheap-as-possible mentality with everything. It's like I'm scared to pay more than basic amount for either quality or convenience.

And yet, I'd say with relation to my colleagues at the same employment skill band - politest way of putting low paid part time - I am more than comfortable with my finances right now. Hard earned mind, I've used birthday money for Christmas gifts and been on benefits for six months, and I feel those 18 months have caused a negative view on spending money in general.

Spending money on myself is incredibly difficult - even if I see something I like, almost anything will inevitably put me off purchasing. I read all receipts when food shopping to check how and where we spent. I've walked home from town or other social events in the early hours because I didn't want to pay for a taxi. I can't even book a holiday abroad - something that I've wished for years - because I know we can get a cheaper holiday in England by The Sun (newspaper), yet I know each holiday in England is a complete disappointment and I end up wishing I was back home.

There's got to be a name for this?! And how do I break out of it?
I know with clothes shopping there is a big self-image problem there, but I can't understand why it's so gripping and addictive, almost.

I do have plans for purchasing a car and going to college, but I feel that without any assistance, I won't pay for them.

Any help?

Yes, there is. It's called 'Being Scottish'

I have always been quite similar to you (and yes, I am Scottish!) I have often found it very difficult to spend any money. After the bills are paid, the majority of money goes into savings. I will skimp on food in order to put money in my savings account. For me I think it comes down to feelings of insecurity; when I was growing up my family ended up in lots of debt due to financial mismanagement and there was always the worry that we could lose our house at any time. I still remember how anxious it all made me feel and I now have an aversion to debt.

Slowly I have started to spend a little money on things I enjoy doing such as crafts. I can often justify that to myself because it is for other people (gifts, charity etc). Today I realised that despite being quite an enthusiastic knitter I haven't knitted anything for myself. Tomorrow I am going to buy wool and knit myself a jumper. Sometimes, I buy myself little treats like a lipstick for £1.99 or a £5 book. Perhaps you could practice buying small things that you need or want, and then work up to making bigger purchases like a holiday. It might also help if you have a budget - that way you can see how much disposable income you have after you have deducted bills etc - seeing the amount you have left over might make you more confident about spending it.

Although you have taken things a little far, your basic attitude is better than that of many people. If individuals and countries had lived within their means as you have, we wouldn't be in the economic situation that we are all in now.

I'm very frugal as well and living alone that skill is really coming in handy as I don't have a lot of extra to throw around. One thing that annoys me is how women see that as a major turn off. Wouldn't you want to have someone who is financial stable to start a family with?? It's not like I refuse to tip (I'm very generous) it's just I don't make purchases I don't have to and buy bulk/sale items at the discount stores. Is that such a bad thing?

That sounds similar actually. I remember - quite angrily - watching the Higher Education Act '04 (Aka the second tuition fees bill) on BBC News get passed. I exploded into a rage because I knew I wouldn't be going to University because of how my parents finances were. And still are. Hmph. My grades went pretty downhill after that.
I'm still angry at how he handles finances...and I've still not applied to college because of the costs.

I can buy small treats every so often. But I do feel guilty when I know I can get a cheaper alternative.

It's the bigger things I do need help with. I'm getting really short on clothes but I can't justify the prices, or 'like' the clothes I keep browsing at. I do think if I look around H&M or River Island again without buying anything, they'll ban me. Buying a car seems practical at times and a really great sunny enjoyable holiday abroad for the first time in 9 years would be nice as well. College would inevitably boost my social life which is dead.

All these cost large sums of money that I'm not comfortable paying out.

GiantHockeyFan - women want good-looking guys in trendy clothes. I'm neither right now. But yeah, having money for a rainy day shouldn't be a turn-off...

Another frugal Scot here. I regard myself as just plain sensible, with regards to money. My husband is the same. We were doing all the things Martin Lewis (The Money Savings Expert) is telling us to do, many years before he appeared on our TV screens. We're living quite a luxurious life, on a single modest income (my husband works, I don't). It's all down to being a sensible youngster, big deposit on our first house so we needed a smaller mortgage, then paying off a little bit more each month than the minimum payment. On my 30th birthday, we paid off our 25 year mortgage, in 10 years, and both of us were on fairly low incomes. Because we are frugal, we have had the cash to spend on our luxuries (holidays, after school classes, theatre, etc) and we give very generous gifts too. We have a nice home and car and don't dress poorly, we just don't buy the most expensive and we're never wasteful. It's not like we live as misers.

Mummy_of_Peanut - that sounds positive, but it's not helpful at the moment.

Do you think you are starting to dney yourself stuff that you actually need? You've gone through a rough patch where money is concerned and your mind is still telling you to be careful. Are you actually building up a huge nest-egg and denying yourself stuff that you need? Are you now in a financial position where you don't need to worry for the foreseeable future (I'm meaning 10 years or more ahead)?

I would say there is purchases that need to be made but I don't feel comfortable about the amounts required. No, I'd say I don't have a nest egg and it isn't really a concern.

I just don't get why I can't just go and spend! I spent like £60 last Friday on getting ready for a wedding reception and I felt particularly out-of-pocket, despite the opposite.

I spend money very differently than most of my agemates - I shop around, I coupon like CRAZY, I find ways to reduce all of the little costs... Basically I watch my pennies all the time, so that every once in a while I can spend whatever I so desire on something that matters far more, like travel.

I even once bought into a small pub and I still argue that I got every penny back =P

^ This is what I'm meaning in my first post. Being frugal has allowed me to have the money available for the things I enjoy. I can't see the problem in being frugal, for that purpose. But, if you can't allow yourself to buy things you need or really want, even though you have the cash available, I really hope you manage to get over it.

definitely have to have priorities - at the point where you have the money and won't/can't spend it on stuff you need, that's no better than having too little money and spending it on things you don't need. My comments aren't really about that, because I can't really wrap my head around the idea of, say, eating only ramen noodles if you can afford more nutritious food. I have a friend who does this and I can't logic it out so I mostly just ignore it.



As for purchasing decisions in general, though, I sort of have a balance/scale in my head - and I weigh pretty much every purchase against the value it provides. Then, once I've decided it's worth MSRP, I find a better deal =P


Also, if you're talking about buying the absolute cheapest 'thing' and can't bring yourself to spend more up front, maybe get out a pencil and paper and see if you'll actually save money in the long run. Boring example to follow:


I am allergic to everything. Seriously, I had a reaction to everything the doc had a test for. From 2002 when I went to college until now, I figure I spent $5,000 on vacuums, carpet cleaners, replacement plans, mattress and pillow covers, air filters, and whatever extra I was paying for electricity to use the fancy filters. The day I got a dyson was life changing, as was when I got rid of carpets entirely. I worked for kirby for like a day recently, and while I couldn't stand the business model, I was really impressed with the product. I bought one on craigslist - brand new, no warranty - for $400. If it breaks I can pay to have it repaired, or learn how to fix the darn thing myself - crap products usually aren't even worth repairing!

Anyway, my point is that I look at a 'large' purchase and I try to decide on the function I'm expecting it to perform, and then see how I can minimize the long term costs, and then I find the best price on the solution that works best for my current situation and all the realistic futures I can imagine. I also put a little weight on how much I can sell something for if times are tough - and that always favors higher quality products.

Another boring example and then I have to go be useful: I stopped buying cheap pressboard furniture and started buying used solid wood furniture. I actually spend LESS on each piece, and I think the only additional cost I incur is in extra beer for getting friends to lift really heavy furniture whenever I move. Oh, that and I have to keep murphy's oil soap or I feel guilty for neglecting nice hardwood furniture.

When deciding whether to buy something do you do a cost-benefit analysis? Obviously you consider the cost carefully (too carefully, by the sound of it), but do you consider the benefit?

I use "benefit" in a very broad sense here. It's not always as simple as "pay $5 now and it will save $10 later". The benefit is often intangible, like time saved or a little less happiness or more frustration in your day - but it's still there and should be considered. Of course, the same applies to cost.

Also, I try to focus on the cost and benefit in my specific situation, not in general. For instance, I think my weighted blanket was pretty expensive for what it is, but it's totally worth the enjoyment I get out of. On the other hand, my bed sheets were really cheap, probably because they have a stupid pattern printed on them that most people would be embarrassed about. It's not a problem for me, though, because nobody else sees them!

The next stage of this is to also not agonise too much about purchases that are too small to matter. In a way it's factoring the psychological cost of making a well-reasoned decision into the decision. If it's a one-off $1 purchase it just may not be worth the time and effort to decide. Either just do it or just don't or flip a coin - but there's no point in stressing about it. Where exactly that threshold is depends on how much money you have, obviously, but there should be a "threshold of caring" somewhere.

I'll post the most common example of what I mean:
Buying a chocolate bar and a paper from any local offies/shops.

I like chocolate, but not too much, so 1 bar with my paper should be enough. I find that the cost of an average bar of chocolate these days is about 70p, when I used to pay 30-35 back in schooldays. Yet, I can buy a Freddo bar for 20p and get the same Chocolate buzz with less calories than say, a twirl or bounty bar.
As for the paper, I prefer the independent as it's the only semi-decent paper that's not a broadsheet and thus I can read it easily. The problem is that it costs £1 on a weekday, and a whopping £2 on a Sunday. £2 for a paper which contains almost everything I could browse anyway? Yet, it's new-ish sister paper, the 'i' costs only 20p per weekday and 30p on a Saturday and contains mostly the same quality reporting at a fraction of the price.

So instead of spending £1.70, I'm actually spending between £0.40-£0.50.
I'd prefer the better bars and paper, yet I'm saving around £7 per week alone on just these two choices.

OK, that sort of thing I'm 'guilty' of, but... I normally would order a whole case of the chocolate I like, and a whole case of the cheaper chocolate I like less, and I'd choose which one I was going to eat on any given day as I'm leaving the house. As for the paper... if you get it every day, have you considered a subscription? sometimes you can work something out with a delivery guy for a sweet deal. if every day is more than you need - or if the subscription is still pretty pricy - could you perhaps usually get the cheaper paper but sometimes 'reward' yourself with the better paper?

Even if none of those options sound appealing, I actually don't think there's anything wrong with what you're doing - it seems like you've weighed the costs and what you get. Do remember that name brand products are the ones that get discounted the most for sales and coupons - when you combine them, you can often get the 'better' product for less than the regular cost of the off brand. Does the paper you like come with coupons if you get a subscription?

hmmm, just realized I don't know for sure you all do coupons across the pond...

I have been told that I am cheap. I think I understand where that is coming from but I don't think that I agree. I will spend money on things that I like. Just refuse to spend on stupid stuff that I don't see a purpose in. Do I really enjoy the name brand peanut butter 20% more than the generic? No. So that's a bad deal for me. Restaurant food rarely tastes 500% better than my own cooking. et cetera.

Although, to be honest, I have, on a number of occasions, gone to the grocery store with intent to buy a specific thing and left empty-handed because that item was not on sale. I guess that's 'cheap'.

I guess with me, I like to get clothes, but wait til they are on SALE or use gift vouchers I get via Survey websites.