Talk about Curing Autism

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I agree, the video sucked. I just about switched it to the album version. Its a gorgeous song normally, and the division bell was outrageous live. Outstanding live performers.

Because you aren't going to cure autism. Enabling an autistic to communicate with others does not change the fact that they are autistic. Autism goes much deeper than that. As far as a cause, it seems to be genetic, and I personally want to avoid eugenic screening of autistic fetuses.

How so, you cannot say this, who knows what genetic advances will be made, or how far in utero medicine will advance. I cannot understand the mentality which rejects all notion of finding a cure, or prevention by genetic medicine

It seems to me that many with aspergers or HFA seem to think that their condition defines them in a positive way, eg. they attribute their high intellect or analytical skills solely to AS. This seems illogical to me, as many - quite possibly the majority - of aspergers /HFA do not have these skills, which to my mind suggests that the high intellect and increased analytical skills are not the result of being on the spectrum, but instead owe these attributes to the same causes as others who share these abilities and are not Autistic/Aspergers.

Dent, you know the concept that measuring atomic position changes the velocity and measuring its velocity changes its position, right? The Heisenberg uncertainty principle.

That also applies at the molecular level. ie: Genetics.

Basically after the proto-human passes the zygote stage, there are too many cells to change. and a zygote is much too delicate to muck around inside of. Even with medicine once you start pumping it in you can change the density of the cellular fluid, disrupt the electrolytic process, cause cellular separations, kill stem cells that specialising... or just cause the mother to spontaneously abort. At the very least you will cause greater problems than you will solve.

In fact, only about 1 in 8 natural pregnancies pass by this stage... and nobody is interfering. Early pregnancies are really that delicate.

Saying cure is a misnomer. After conception it is already too late. The genetic material is all pervasive. Its not a tumor! You just cant excise it.

And you cannot modify the mothers egg production for the same reason, nor the fathers sperm.


So that leaves one option: genetic elimination. Or in the vernacular, abortion. Abortion is not a cure, its prevention. Elimination.

And if you have a bunch of unwilling aspies blended into the general population, popping out babies here and there, you will never stem the tide of Autism. Unless you tromp on their rights and enforce mandatory screening and abortion.

Dent, you are the sort of guy that loves the company of others. I know you wouldnt want an autistic child, but would you be pleased if you had regular children? Imagine if Doctor Someone said to you:

"Any pregnancy you participate in will be aborted as per policy. Your genotype is indicative of autism and the fruits of your labour(so to speak) are not acceptable for our fine society. If you try bring an unauthorized child to term, you will be discovered when you register the birth and you will be fined and/or jailed. Your child will be taken from you and sterilized. We cannot permit autism to persist even one more generation."

"As you can see from this Mendel square, even though your wife is autism negative, you have a three out of four chance of spreading your awful autism. However, there may be a way for you to have a child. Might I suggest letting another man impregnate your fine fine wife? Mmmmm. I'd do her up a treat, and I can assure you, I am perfect, unlike you."

Of course I would be opposed to enforced eugenics, but yes I do accept your points. Trouble is for many whose progeny turn out to have LFA some, maybe many, wish that there had been a test, so that they could have had the choice to make an informed decision.

As I have said on numerous occasions a non discriminatory ASD test is fraught with philosophical dangers. If I was involved in a decision to continue with a pregnancy, that had the potential to result in a child with LFA, I am not at all sure which way my decision would go. As it stands now I think I would want to have the test available, but this is of course purely hypothetical, and put this into a real world situation my thought process may well be very different.

You misunderstand the nature of autism. It is pervasive, ingrained very deeply into a person. It would be impossible to "cure" me of autism; autism is part of who I am. Even if it were medically possible (it is not, and probably never will be) you would not actually have cured me, you would have killed me and replaced me with a different person. Whether this new person is better or worse is irrelevant.


The issue is that analytical skills and high intelligence are markedly more common among AS/HFA individuals than in the general population. It is well-established from a number of studies that there is a strong link between autistic traits and quantitative ability. That many Aspies are bad at math is irrelevant, since almost all people, autistic or not, are mathematically illiterate. Other studies have shown that autistics have far superior memories and are less susceptible to framing bias; ie are able to be relatively more objective than neurotypicals, independent of context.

Wouldn't that create the exact same problem we have now, only the opposite way? Rather then equating autism with LFA we'd equate it with HFA, and the the so-called LFA would have the same problems with getting services and getting recognized that the higher-functioning people do now.

Why not eliminate the problem entirely by presenting autism as a spectrum disorder that includes EVERYONE, aspies, 'Low Functioning', whatever?

Nevermind that you aren't a mind reader and you CANNOT know how the collective care-givers of autistic people who don't communicate feel, and how you focus on the care givers, not the autistic people themselves.

Are you able to read and comprehend, if so, I suggest you put this ability into use. If not, I have highlighted the salient point for you

Edit:

And the same for this




If you bothered to read, before you react, you would have noticed this






So to your analytical skills

Last edited by DentArthurDent on 11 Jan 2010, 2:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

To eradicate the problem you must eradicate them all, which would be a loss.

One, it cannot be done, and even with better tests, it would select against intelligence

yes, some are a problem, but most only annoy, and more are a gift.

From what I have gathered, it sounds like they still haven't determined that it is in fact genetic or linked to a gene and if they were able to determine the cause(s) then they could theoretically use some measure of prevention to enable a cure, at least to a greater degree. I don't see anything wrong with that as a possibility. Even though I'm gifted and grateful on the one side, the profound costs on a human suffering level on the other has been far too great. I can't be cured but I wouldn't wish what I go through on my worst enemy.

Meadow, I could not agree more with you sentiments. Even though it is highly probable that there is a major genetic link, we do not know for sure if that is the only cause. It is possible that like cancer, ASD is multi-factorial, and you need a combination of these to bring on the condition, who knows, I certainly don't, and like you - if I were to have one - I would certainly have no wish for have a child of mine go through what I have

Depilatory cosmetics can be used to alleviate hairy palms. You needn't have suffered all these years.

Now you tell me

Grrr, that irks me. Granted, I haven't a clue what its like to be AS or ASD, but my child is perfect the way he is. Autism doesn't need to be cured.

Cure autism? LOL, cure brown eyes... Cure blonde hair... It's all just as stupid.

The first part of this sentence tends to show that you cannot objectively back up the second. Also your son has HFA not LFA.