why we must be weary of autism speaks

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You really add nothing of substance to the discussion with your childish comebacks and blood-libeling with "eugenics" claims. Other decent individuals on here have explained the reality of what's going on many times, and you just come by with ridiculous propaganda over and over. You inflame me, but can't refute the basics of what I claim. Why not just quit saying what you say against cure? Your side is going to lose. In the long run, technology is going to encompass what research from Autism Speaks and the government is looking for. Then there will be an overwhelming impulse to meet the goal. I heard of this idea called transhumanism. Look it up if you don't know of it. Some of its possibilities seem strange, but I think some of its possibilities would ensure what cure is supposed to do.

Transhumanism sided with the Autistic.

Being limited by Social, Political, Religious, views is the problem.

The Cloneism at the center of the herd is not Humanism, it is people living the most common lie, so they do not have to think for themselves.

It did not take electroshock to get them on drugs, all dressing the same, professing social conformanity, The One True Religion, and Political Party.

They also rented a life, accepted managed debt in replacement of ownership, and Lemming like all bought the biggest house they could lie thier way into.

Conformity has done much more damage than a rather small minority of those with a Differance of Thought and Perception.

Conformity just cost about $100 Trillion in lost assets, and debt funded some decade long offshore adventures.

That is what happens when the right people do the right things for the right reason, without thinking about it.

My spoken views about the Second Gulf War, "Why do you want to give this country to Iran?" I also called McMansions, "Tulip Bulbs."

Now that the dollar has been devalued by half, or at least gas and food cost twice as much, the stock market has reached old highs, which is half of what it was. People are making the same, less are working, and they are in growing debt,

A sameness of Thought and Perception got us here.

So back to Autism Speaks, who are attacking Saddam because the Saudi's did 9/11, and if everyone buys something, it will all work. They are also offshoring research to the Chinese. The Chinese work day and night on a Cure for Round Eyed White Devils.

If you start with the wrong idea, go in the wrong direction, it does not matter how much you believe, how much you spend, and that you have friends in government.

Reality has been described as that which even if you do not believe in it, is still around. The Reality is, nothing has changed for the Autistic. Calling Names For The Cure has not worked, is not working, and never will.

In most ways, we were better off twenty years ago. Better to be ignored than Awareness calling for an Imaginary Cure.

It has not been all bad, Wrong Planet was formed because people hated Autism Speaks. We finally got a Peer Group!

We have not been much help with a cure, because we read, and Science at that. Besides, on our Cure List, we are not even on the first page. There are a lot of more important things to Cure.

Grandparents in Media hiring Marketing to do some Science Stuff, comes to mind. To drive a car you have to pass a test, and get a License, Science does seem to have much lower standards.

This seems Creationist Psychology, a double religion based on failth over facts.

Getting to the core of modern theology, I do think that Tax Cuts are the answer. Autistic people and their parents should not be taxed!

Charities that only study the problem of some group, and do nothing that directly aids them, should be taxed. If I was to raise money to feed the hungry, giving half to Agrabusiness to study food production, should have me thrown in jail. Help the Homeless, giving half to The American Real Estate Profession, should wind up in the next cell.

Having the Chinese study the DNA of the Homeless should not be allowed as a defense.

Hiring Meda Consultants to say what a great job I am doing at doing nothing should not be tax free.

There are two cures for hunger, one is feed them, the other is study the problem till they die.

Now if all that Food Stamp money went to Hunger Speaks, we would be well on the way to a Final Solution to hunger.

Charities, Religions, Hedge Funds, are just a Tax Dodge, They should all be taxed as Ordinary Income, just like a Carnival, or other Stage Play.

I do think that the direct cost of maintaining the Freaks should be deducted from the pre tax gross. Direct as in cash paid.

Also the Big Act, Politics, those who would bribe elected officials, those who wish to be elected, should not be allowed to deduct the bribes, and the money in politics should be taxed as Ordinary Income.

Autistics have been shut out of Autism. It has become a Non-Autistic Game. I do not feel welcome in my own neurology.

Autism Speaks, and Talk is Cheap.

Twenty to Twenty-five years ago, I was debt free, making $30,000 a yr, had a nice five figure bank account, and was cruising around in a brand new camaro. This was made possible because of the printing/graphics art TRADE THAT i was a part of. As a matter of fact, i was decent enough at (what i did) THAT my instructor wanted me to come back and teach. My point IS, for each generation of autists,, there have been both benefits and losses as society 'advanced'. Moving from a post industrial society to a technological society meant more social networking, information exchange, and exposure BUT at the expense of anonymity and skilled labor.

The problem is obvious .As long as, Autism is considered a neurological condition or disorder......researchers and doctors will have a significant say in the direction Autistics take.


TheSunAlsoRises

do you expect a decent reply? if you don't except my argument it doesn't mean ican't refute you, it just doesn't mean you agree with me. and, killin is killin. so when i say something against your views its ridiculous inflaming propaganda, and when someone agrees with you it ain't? well we will see who wins when we get there. my question to you in the form of my comeback is. "how do you know a cure would be good, what would be a cure, how would we vet it, who do you consider cured"
and last of all, why do you think you can decide when i get to post on this forum?

I think it's really time to face reality: if Autists want respect, we've got to earn it, and having to be financially supported is no way to earn respect. We need to force the world to respect us, not by loud protests, but by silent work.

This needs to be something done by Autists, for Autists. I'm talking about Autist-run groups that help people find and keep employment. I'm talking about Autist businesses. Almost an entire shadow economy running alongside the present, NT-dominated marketplace, friendly to Autists. Perhaps even a scheme to ensure Autist children in care will be adopted and fostered, ideally by parents who can understand them, rather than just abandoned. If we can demonstrate that we're not dependent on NT's for survival - even if we're better working together than apart - the entire pro-cure movement will collapse, as parents see that their Autistic child can lead a life just as fulfilling as an NT.

No-one is going to help us unless we help ourselves.

+1

You have no proof of what you say. Look at the way you talk. Stop putting words in others' mouths. I'm not deciding when you get to post. I'm criticizing the way you talk of these things. If you want the point of cure explained: A cure would be helpful cause it would ensure to all individuals, the basic abilities needed to live and to do things without dependence on others. As far as I know, it would involve enhancements/alterations of whatever aspects of neurology that are necessary to have various aptitudes. Some think it will be possible when the technology to implement it is devised and when the underlying genetic and morphological shortcomings are thoroughly identified according to the impairments they cause. The result should ensure that nobody lacks functioning, and that any can do what the high-functioning can do. So, the disparities between the low and high ends of the spectrum would go away.

very few political arguments can be proved with absolute emperical evidence.nor were you successfull in proving me a liar

so i'm putting words in your mouth now? you seem to love these immature little comebacks don't you. i'd say they don't add any content to your argument. well maybe someday we will choose whatever personality we want. when that day comes it will be a total free for all, so you can think what you like. it would be like cosmetic surgery on the mind. I have already explained most of my points in the original post and the link. mostly what i hate about autism speaks is actually money management issues and their bullying autistic people and saying our lives are worthless. do you like people calling you worthless? do you think that is what a charity should do to the people it claims to serve?

First, I think one has to define what they mean by autist. If it is all individuals with autistic traits, that likely constitutes close to 30 percent of the population, most of whom identify themselves with their personal identity rather than any specific behavioral characteristics or different way of thinking..

If it is the autistic folks measured by the government, in the US, those are the individuals measured at 8 years old, almost entirely limited to classes for the developmentally disabled, of which 41% are estimated as having cognitive deficits, with IQ's under 70, by the same government agency that provides the 1 in 110 statistic for ASD's.

For the first group everything you suggest has already been happening, perhaps more quietly in the background than some extroverted efforts, but many individuals make their way on the basis of their own personal efforts.

Most every individual is dependent on society to some degree, regardless if they have autistic like traits or not. While we live in an extroverted society, in the US, the efforts of the introverts/broader phenotype of autism are as crucial to the infrastructure of society as the efforts of the extroverts/people considered as socially inclined/also referred to as neurotypicals.

For the second group many will depend on society for their existence, their entire life. The supports our society provides allow many individuals with disabilities, to survive, that would not have survived in the past without those advantages of modern society.

But, there is also a third group, some of whom visit this website, self diagnosed, or professionally diagnosed, with what are considered "milder" cases of autism.

The government rarely captures this statistic in their reports, and the rest of the broader phenotype of autism, for the most part aren't aware they are part of any group associated with autism.

Some in this third group lean more towards the first group and some lean more towards the second group.

What you are suggesting is not going to work for many in the second group, for those that are permanently disabled, their reality is much different than most in the first or third group.

The first group, for the most part don't need any motivation, they are already engaged in the same game for survival that the rest of the population is engaged in.

Some in the third group can do this, it has been reported on this website, already; however unfortunately for some whom lean more towards the second group, for whatever inherent or environmental reason, things don't always work out for them, as is the potential for all whom live in society.

The first group, as measured through research, encompasses about 110 million people in the US population.

The second group as measured through research, encompasses from 1 to 1.5 million people in the US population.

And the third group, per the only available statistics provided in the US, encompasses several hundred thousand people in the US. If the newest study done in England is close to correct, it is more likely that the third group constitutes about 3 million individuals in the US, many whom currently are part of the first group that have no idea they have any form of autism.

Autism Speaks, the government, and most other autism organizations, directs their efforts at the second group. Except for help from family and friends, the rest are largely on their own, whether they want to be or not.

The first group likely comprises many of the 340K family volunteers that support autism speaks, simply because they have autistic traits, and the actual defined disorder, is at least, in part, genetically associated with family members that have some autistic traits.

The second group, may have heard about the organization, but it is not likely many have much emotional concern over the organization; it requires enough effort for them to get through each day, without getting too many negative concerns that there are charitable organizations looking for ways to make life easier for them.

And the part of the third group that understands the organization exists and thinks it poses a problem, basically discusses the issue among themselves, with little concern about what they are talking about from anyone outside of that group.

There is not much evidence that there is actually much more than several thousand individuals, from this third group, in the US, that have any significant issues with Autism Speaks.

That's several thousand individuals opposed to a potential total of 110 million individuals in the US that likely have at least one autistic trait.

Per this perspective of reality, there is nothing much of significance that several thousand people are going to be able to do, to change the attitude and course of reality, in regard of how much the rest of society wants to help individuals, by finding a cure or whatever it takes to help the part of that 1.5 million, that will likely never gain independence in life, through no fault of their own.

All that said, we don't really have much choice but to take care of ourselves, or hope that there are loved ones or friends to help us when we truly are in need. While there is some assistance in the US, most of it is aimed directly at the second group.

The idea of arguing against an organization composed of several hundred thousand volunteers, with the solid intent to helped their loved ones in need, whom likely are part of the measured 1 out of 110, doesn't seem to take in full account of the expanse of how differently autistic traits impact 110 million potential members of society.

It's obviously difficult to be on the border line of the 1 percent and the rest of the thirty percent. It's an extreme minority of individuals, whom would likely have no avenue to voice an opinion about autism speaks, or any other issue related to autism, to potentially be heard in society, if it wasn't for the internet.

But it bears reminding that out of the potential 110 million individuals with Autistic traits, just in the US, there is likely at most only a few thousand that have any serious issue with autism speaks or any other organization with a mission to help people those considered to have the most struggles associated with autism.

It is likely that many involved in missions similiar to autism speaks, have autistic traits themselves. Scientists, Research associates, Doctors, Nurses, etc. Autistic traits are evidenced as spread out everywhere one looks in society, as a whole.

i think he meant the 1 in 110 statistic.30% of the general population are hardly in need of advocacy.i dont have a problem with un dxed people but one must have several clinical traits.i would say 100% of the population has a autistic trait for that matter.i think undxed autists are real autists if they have several clinical traits.where your getting 30% of the population from im not sure

I don't know what you're talking of.


What don't you like of their money management? And by asking that, I'm not saying that I think it's close to optimal. What bullying? What would that mean considering the things they did in collaboration with some autistics? I've seen the crap in that old link before. I know they were kinda aggressive in their earlier days, but the overall goal of the organization, as stated, isn't disagreeable. But I actually have a higher trust in the government funded research, and I fear the ASAN may try to mess that up especially. Who is calling who worthless? Nobody should really derive their personal worth through the approval of others anyway. I don't want many of us to be simply reduced to begging stronger individuals in society for their approval and kindness, while accepting not getting any prosperity.

@ahogday ok but they are not autistic if they have a few traits. if they don't know they have it then they can't be in on this. if they are not active in autism politics this doesn't count. last time i took a poll on here about 60% of people supported neurodiversity 17% supported a cure. you can't poll for people who are not interested enough to take the poll or don't know it exists. you don't get any meaningful data from that. so what if 30% of the population has a trait. the diagnosed people are the ones getting slandered. this is between autism speaks and us. no one else is involved by proxy. this is an issue of one person dissing and trying to take advantage of other people. there aint many other ways to understand it.

i don't like the fact that they pocket most of it and throw fancy parties where they actually lose money. I don't derive my self worth from what autism speaks says. the trouble is when you get represented in a bad way other people in society start to see you in a bad light. it effects what job opportunities you get and how you are treated in daily life.

The 30% is from studies in Sweden and the US, that looked for at least one criteria, from an actual diagnosis of autism in the general population, and found them in approximately 30% in both populations.

Autistic traits have been defined in different ways, both from those inside the scientific community and outside of the scientific community, and of course the scientific community continues to refine the definitions.

I think every human being has the potential to evidence at least one autistic like behavioral trait that would meet at least one criteria of an autism diagnosis, at some point in time or another of their life. Depending on life's circumstances.

So, a study today that finds 30% autistic traits out of a pool of individuals, might find a significantly different 30% out of the same pool a year later depending on life circumstances.

But, there are neurological differences evidenced in introverts and extroverts, that are suggested to play a part in this, along with environment. The 30% likely catches many whom have the inherent propensity for introversion. There are many similarities between autistic traits and introversion that are hard to separate once one moves away from an actual diagnosis. But it is all a part of the neurodiversity of humankind as a whole.

The differences that we magnify in each other, that lead to an US vs THEM mentality are in part a result of cultural influences and expectations. The phenomenon of me vs we, is probably relatively new to Social Primates, influenced by culture, in all it's forms, from language to the commercials we see on TV.

Wiring our brains differently through neuroplasticity and epigenetics, that can occur within one lifetime; and the much slower process of Darwinian Evolution that can take thousands of years and thousands of ancestors.

They should be devoting a larger percentage of the money they raise to research. I agree they shouldn't be wasting money on parties like that. They describe the characteristics of the condition. They're not really there to represent us as who we are. To an extent, they inform others of the negative circumstances going on for many on the spectrum. They won't have luck raising money by not exposing those problems. They're not trying to affront your character. And employers don't really get their influence from Autism Speaks to determine who they hire. Where were all the job opportunities for all on the spectrum before Autism Speaks started its awareness campaigns?